Posted on 05/12/2010 6:53:06 PM PDT by delacoert
Mormonism is essentially a sacramental religion, defined by ordinance and ritual more than doctrine or belief. Any effort to define Mormon doctrine is fraught with difficulty and virtually certain of error, although one might venture that the belief portion of the temple recommend interview defines doctrine.[1] As Edward Kimball says, Church history shows that General Authorities frequently declare, clarify, refine, and qualify interpretations of doctrine, but these statements generally constitute only informed opinion.[2]
On the other hand, there are numerous statements, writings and beliefs that have been put forward as doctrine, or believed as doctrine, at one time or by some people, that we can be fairly confident are not doctrine. We have somewhat more confidence about what is not doctrine than what is.
Only half-jokingly, one might start with the obvious-to-most-adult-Mormons statement that your high school seminary teacher was not a reliable source of doctrine.
So what do we know is not doctrine? Here is a short collection of ideas about doctrines we might reject, meant to invite comment and addendum. These are presented in no particular order, although the inspiration for this investigation is chapter 11 of Lengthen Your Stride, which depicts Spencer W. Kimballs contributions to the discussion of doctrine and even more not doctrine.
A. Neither Man, His Origin and Destiny by Elder Joseph Fielding Smith, nor Mormon Doctrine by Elder Bruce R. McConkie, is an official publication of the Church.[3]
B. Despite numerous requests (and positions stated or implied in the publications noted in A above), the Church has never taken a definitive position on the matter of organic evolution.
C. We denounce [the Adam-God Theory] and hope that everyone will be cautioned against this and other kinds of false doctrine.[4]
D. Other churches are not all wrong. The great religious leaders of the world such as Mohammed, Confucius, and the Reformers, as well as philosophers including Socrates, Plato, and others, received a portion of Gods light. Moral truths were given to them by God to enlighten whole nations and to bring a higher level of understanding to individuals.[5]
E. References to blood atonement (leaving aside the atonement of Christ), if understood as applying to modern circumstances, do not . . . represent the official stand of the Church.[6]
F. Elder McConkies talk at BYU on The Seven Deadly Heresies (including acceptance of organic evolution, a belief that God progresses in knowledge, and the idea that progression from kingdom to kingdom in the afterlife is possible) were Elder McConkies personal views and not doctrine.[7]
G. The Joseph Smith Translation is not the official Bible of the Church. It is interesting, a fruitful source, and an invaluable aid to biblical interpretation and understanding.[8]
H. Church policy set in 1967 allowing only Melchizedek or Aaronic Priesthood holders to pray in sacrament meetings had no scriptural basis and should be abandoned.[9]
I. The practice of polygamy after 1890 is not in accord with the teachings of the Church.[10]
J. There is no ban on priesthood ordination of Black men after 1978.[11]
K. There is no authoritative or doctrinal explanation why the ordination of Black men was not allowed before 1978.
L. There is not an absolute prohibition on abortion.[12]
M. The Lectures on Faith are not doctrine.[13]
[1] | In modern form the belief questions are: (1) Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost? (2) Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer? (3) Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days? (4) Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church? These four questions are, of course, not wholly self-defining and lend themselves to a number of interpretations. |
[2] | Lengthen Your Stride, The Presidency of Spencer W. Kimball, by Edward Kimball (Deseret Book 2005), at page 95. |
[3] | Letters and journal entries from President David O. McKay in 1959 and 1960, among other sources. |
[4] | Spencer W. Kimball at October General Conference in 1976. |
[5] | Statement by the First Presidency on February 15, 1978. |
[6] | Bruce R. McConkie, in 1977, responding to a question at the request of the First Presidency. |
[7] | Lengthen Your Stride at page 101 and clarification in the version published in 1980 BYU Speeches of the Year, changing we to I and saying my reasoning causes me to conclude. |
[8] | Quotes from the dictionary included in the LDS edition of the Bible. |
[9] | Priesthood Bulletin 3, no. 3 (July/August 1967). |
[10] | Official Declaration 1. |
[11] | Official Declaration 2. |
[12] | General Handbook of Instructions, which describes certain exceptions where abortion could be the better choice. |
[13] | Not included in the 1979 and 1981 editions of the standard works. Ed Kimball notes in Lengthen Your Stride that inclusion was proposed at that time but not approved, and that Several studies had recently concluded that Sidney Rigdon was the principal author of the lectures. |
I think tea is a no-no, too.
Added stuff... Changed stuff... Rearranged stuff... Removed stuff...
|
We'd have to define 'original' first.
The Temple Rites® has been changed from the old words they used to use.
(BTW; those rites CANNOT be found in ANY of their scripture.)
Actuallty; the BoM is PART of their 'Standard Works'.
As 'scripture' there is hardly ANYTHING in it that theology-wise could be considered very far from orthodox Christianity.
It's the OTHER things that are part of the SW that contain most of MORMONism.
To Whom It May Concern:
Press dispatches having been sent for political purposes, from Salt Lake City, which have been widely published, to the effect that the Utah Commission, in their recent report to the Secretary of the Interior, allege that plural marriages are still being solemnized and that forty or more such marriages have been contracted in Utah since last June or during the past year, also that in public discourses the leaders of the Church have taught, encouraged and urged the continuance of the practice of polygamy
I, therefore, as President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, do hereby, in the most solemn manner, declare that these charges are false. We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage, nor permitting any person to enter into its practice, and I deny that either forty or any other number of plural marriages have during that period been solemnized in our Temples or in any other place in the Territory.
One case has been reported, in which the parties allege that the marriage was performed in the Endowment House, in Salt Lake City, in the Spring of 1889, but I have not been able to learn who performed the ceremony; whatever was done in this matter was without my knowledge. In consequence of this alleged occurrence the Endowment House was, by my instructions, taken down without delay.
Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriages, which laws have been pronounced constitutional by the court of last resort, I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws, and to use my influence with the members of the Church over which I preside to have them do likewise.
There is nothing in my teachings to the Church or in those of my associates, during the time specified, which can be reasonably construed to inculcate or encourage polygamy; and when any Elder of the Church has used language which appeared to convey any such teaching, he has been promptly reproved. And I now publicly declare that my advice to the Latter-day Saints is to refrain from contracting any marriage forbidden by the law of the land.
WILFORD WOODRUFF
President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
President Lorenzo Snow offered the following:
I move that, recognizing Wilford Woodruff as the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and the only man on the earth at the present time who holds the keys of the sealing ordinances, we consider him fully authorized by virtue of his position to issue the Manifesto which has been read in our hearing, and which is dated September 24th, 1890, and that as a Church in General Conference assembled, we accept his declaration concerning plural marriages as authoritative and binding.
The vote to sustain the foregoing motion was unanimous.
Salt Lake City, Utah, October 6, 1890.
Hebrews 11:35-40
35. Others were tortured and refused to be released, so that they might gain a better resurrection. 36. Some faced jeers and flogging, while still others were chained and put in prison. 37. They were stoned ; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated-- 38. the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground. |
"Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriage...I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws..."~ Wilford Woodruff, 4th LDS President
The Official Scriptures of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © 2006 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. Rights and use information. Privacy policy. |
FOUNDED BETWEEN 1830 AND 1844
NON-EXTANT MOVEMENTS FOUNDED 1844-1860
EXTANT MOVEMENTS
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, James J. Strang, 1844
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Brigham Young, 1847
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of The Church of Jesus Christ, Alpheus Cutler, 1853
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, 1851-1860
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of The Church of Jesus Christ, William Bickerton, 1862
Splinter Groups and Sub-movements of Church of Christ (Temple Lot), Granville Hedrick, 1863
Good Question.....
I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.
17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the otherThis is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)and which I should join.
19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.
20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, Never mind, all is wellI am well enough off. I then said to my mother,
Joseph Smith continues: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price, Joseph Smith-History 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses, 18:172).President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses, 10:127).James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p.196).
Good Question.....
Pointing out that the TEACHINGS of MORMONism are NOT Christianity is ONLY called 'bashing' by those who do NOT like having the FACTS of their Bait-and-Switch religious tactics shown.
Sorry; but the BIBLE 'trashes' MORMON theology.
It 'trashes' it's INCEPTION,
and it 'trashes' it's continuation.
If some folks want to start a charter school, and teach that 2+2=5; you can bet your bippy that some REAL math students will be on their case from day ONE!
I guess you haven't noticed that you are in the RELIGION Forum on FR.
If you do NOT want religion; then join the masses and get in the OTHER forums.
I’ve suspected as much... ;^)
Read reply #27.
THE BOOK OF JACOB
THE BROTHER OF NEPHICHAPTER 224 Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.
25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a righteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.
26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.
27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;
28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.
29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.
30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.
31 For behold, I, the Lord, have seen the sorrow, and heard the mourning of the daughters of my people in the land of Jerusalem, yea, and in all the lands of my people, because of the wickedness and abominations of their husbands.
32 And I will not suffer, saith the Lord of Hosts, that the cries of the fair daughters of this people, which I have led out of the land of Jerusalem, shall come up unto me against the men of my people, saith the Lord of Hosts.
Or even HERE:
1 Timothy 3:2-3
2. Now the overseer must be above reproach, the husband of but one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
3. not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money.1 Timothy 3:12
A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well.Titus 1:6
An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient.
THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTSSECTION 1325157, Emma Smith is counseled (commanded) to be faithful and true; 5866, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.51 Verily, I say unto you: A commandment I give unto mine handmaid, Emma Smith, your wife, whom I have given unto you, that she stay herself and partake not of that which I commanded you to offer unto her; for I did it, saith the Lord, to aprove you all, as I did Abraham, and that I might require an offering at your hand, by covenant and sacrifice.52 And let mine handmaid, Emma Smith, areceive all those that have been given unto my servant Joseph, and who are virtuous and pure before me; and those who are not pure, and have said they were pure, shall be destroyed, saith the Lord God.53 For I am the Lord thy God, and ye shall obey my voice; and I give unto my servant Joseph that he shall be made ruler over many things; for he hath been afaithful over a few things, and from henceforth I will strengthen him.55 But if she will not abide this commandment, then shall my servant Joseph do all things for her, even as he hath said; and I will bless him and multiply him and give unto him an ahundredfold in this world, of fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, houses and lands, wives and children, and crowns of beternal lives in the eternal worlds.
Some things, meant to be insults, are more like awards that can be displayed on a wall - all depending on who gives them.
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