Posted on 03/15/2010 12:07:15 PM PDT by Colofornian
Edited on 03/23/2010 6:15:31 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
When Glenn Beck told listeners of his radio show on March 2 that they should "run as fast as you can" from any church that preached "social or economic justice" because those were code words for Communism and Nazism, he probably thought he was tweaking a few crunchy religious liberals who didn't listen to the show anyway. Instead he managed to outrage Christians in most mainline Protestant denominations, African-American congregations, Hispanic churches, and Catholics...
(Excerpt) Read more at swampland.blogs.time.com ...
Sorry, but I don’t. All I remember was they said they were Evangelicals and the name of the church had “Evangelical” in it, but a name can be anything.
Thanks for letting me know. I have never heard a Bible Believing Church say what you are claiming. So I curious who would say that. If you remember just let me know.
Sorry to disappoint you, but you have lost the bet, the dude who “accused” me of being Mormon, say it something like “Lynn, you’re Mormon, aren’t you. Don’t deny it. What are you doing here?”
The preacher apologized to me.
I don’t know if my friend was ever asked that question or not.
As an add on to my previous post, I have to several Evangelical congregations and this is the only time I was confronted like that. It surprised me.
But I was asked one time in one congregation by the preacher when I was introduced to him if I was Mormon. I said yes and asked him why and he said, “Oh, white shirt and tie.” “Guilty as charged.”
Frankly, the coolest receptions I have ever received have been at different mormon wards, but I never have complained about it...people always examine strangers. I don't see that it's anything to hang on to though.
....and the bet was with my Christian FRiends who have attended different churches...I didn't bet you anything.
It wasn’t my friend. It was somebody who lived a couple of blocks away and I had met him and his family several times at school functions. Like I said, he was an acquaintance.
There are people like him everywhere.
LOL, that white shirt and tie’ll get you every time...
Well, then you have a jerky neighbor. My uncle the former bishop tells me he is not allowed to attend other churches. Very sad he missed my son in law preach for the first time.
Grey, the preacher, IIRC, was relatively new to the area and the previous preacher was a gung ho, hellfire and damnation type. He had meetings several times a month about what was wrong with other religions and he encouraged his congregation to not associate with any paganistic heathen who wasn’t a true Christian.
The new preacher was trying to change that attitude, but it hadn’t been that long.
In fact, my neighbors, across the street, when to first preacher’s congregation and I had just moved to the neighborhood. We became good friends in a short time. I have one son and another on the way and my son would go over and beg and plead for cookies.
About a month after I moved to the neighborhood, they came home from church and they were really upset. It turned out that the preacher had told the congregation that a Mormon family had moved into the area and that nobody in the congregation was to associate with us. Vera and Bill found a congregation before the next Sunday.
I really miss them. I was their neighbor for 15 years before she died and he went to a nursing home.
I’ve never heard that a bishop is not allowed to go to another church, though it might have been that he isn’t suppose to miss meetings in order to go to one. I’ll have to ask my bishop. This also might be something that a stake president had come up with.
Lady R, (does it bother you if you call you that?) you said:
- - - — - - -
I prefer Baroness. :)
As to the rest, the fact that you keep saying you are doing what you FEEL God want’s you to do, and that it is how YOU interpret scripture, is starting from a false premise. It is never about US, how WE feel, what WE want, it is about God, what the Bible says
That being said, I did have the “LDS blinders” on for many years so I do have some idea of where you are coming from. All I can tell you is I will pray that God will open your eyes. This is NOT an intellectual exercise (meaning we can understand it on our own), it is a spiritual thing (and I do not mean relying on feelings).
How do you know He isn’t revealing the truth to you? Seriously. God revealed the truth to me through my doubts about the LDS church. My feelings wanted me to stay, I LOVED being LDS, I felt ‘worthy’ and (looking back) self-righteous about being a good “temple mormon”. But the doubts wouldn’t go away, I researched and I understood the issues in intellectual way, but I didn’t understand. I couldn’t understand, until He smacked me upside the head, broke me, and changed me. ONLY THEN could I really understand topics that you are bringing up.
Christianity is not well explained, it must be lived to be understood.
If you are sincere, if you really want to see what God wants, stop going to Church, get a different Bible (non LDS), only read that, DON”T use KJV english in prayers, don’t go to the temple, don’t watch conference, don’t read the Ensign, don’t go to priesthood meetings, give up your callings and spend ONE YEAR ONLY ONLY reading the Bible (preferably a non KJV). You will be surprised what God shows you, where your doubts are. But until you are spiritually Born Again you (or anyone) cannot have a true understanding
Also, I suggest reading “Born Again Mormon” (you can download it for free) and watching the FIRST TWO episodes of the TV show where he talks about how he became a Born Again Christian (in an evangelical sense) and God led Him out of Mormonism.
www.bornagainmormon.com
He is a former bishop, sorry forgot to type that I guess.
Anyway, I called them (aunt and uncle) and asked if they wanted to hear their great nephew preach his first sermon.
My uncle said “Wow first sermon. Let me get back to you.” He called Saturday morning and said “Sorry we can’t make it, we are not allowed to attend.”. I actually laughed, thinking he was kidding. He just said “sorry I have to go” and hung up.
I believe that we are each given a gift from God that can guide us aright. John speaks of Christ being “the true light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world” John 1:9
This light of Christ is of immeasurable value to all of God’s children. It can act as a conscience, a guide, as a discerner between truth and error.
How do we know that kindness is sweet, that meanness is cruel, that murder is wrong, that sacrifice is noble, etc. We can feel, sense, discern these things through the light of Christ that is within us.
Incidentally, I believe this light can be dimmed and possibly extinguished through sin and disobedience.
Before I became a Latter-day Saints, I was sincerely seeking the truth of God. I had studied many different religious denominations and although I could find much that was good and positive, I was unsettled with all of them for one reason or another. There was always something that didn’t feel right.
When I first came across Mormonism and learned of its teachings it was as if I naturally recognized the truth and rightness of the Church. It is hard to describe, but it was very real and tangible to me.
I know that many people would consider me deceived, but my personal experience is that I am not.
We need guidance in life, and the light that comes from Christ can be a priceless guide. The Holy Ghost can provide additional light and truth — but this light is a gift to every human being.
Then you better revise how you address the point. Since you cannot specify the denomination and only rely upon some poorly educated 'evangelical' friends, you question has no foundation.
There were like 60 there that night. when most of the congregation found out that I was Mormon, they glared at me.
Again - an unspecified denomination. Perhaps you were very self conscience and feeling out of place. How did they find out - did you tell them? may be they were waiting for a tail and horns (/sarc)
The preacher very specifically said that it wasn’t by grace alone, that we needed to have works to be saved.
again - an amorphic 'church' denomination (but it has 'evangelical' in its name). Unless you can come up with some FACTS I am not inclined to believe your story. Can you supply those facts?
From a Christian standpoint - you are most of the way there in your understanding of grace, but not quite. It is done by God - but is totally undeserved by the recipient.
By works Christianity defines it as any act of righteousness offered in a legalistic manner by which one tries to earn the affection and approval by God and righteousness.
Paul contrasts the two in many places
Eph 2: 8* For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Ro 11:6* And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
There is a form of 'works' spoken of by James. The 'works' described there is not a legalist ritual or specified actions - but behavior reflecting the active faith ALREADY existing in the believer that are done out of love. And if you carefully read James Ch 2 - you will see that those 'works' are borne out in acts of love towards others - not temple work, tithing, etc (for contrast).
Normandy:
To provide a broader context for quotation for Joseph Smith:
“What must a man do to commit the unpardonable sin? He must receive the Holy Ghost, have the heavens opened unto him, and know God, and then sin against Him. After a man has sinned against the Holy Ghost, there is no repentance for him. He has got to say that the sun does not shine while he sees it; he has got to deny Jesus Christ when the heavens have been opened unto him, and to deny the plan of salvation with his eyes open to the truth of it; and from that time he begins to be an enemy. This is the case with many apostates of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
When a man begins to be an enemy to this work, he hunts me, he seeks to kill me, and never ceases to thirst for my blood. He gets the spirit of the devil—the same spirit that they had who crucified the Lord of Life—the same spirit that sins against the Holy Ghost . . .”
(Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 358)
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SZ:
"The only group not covered are the people who left Mormonism. Once professing belief in the Mormon doctrine, they subsequently rejected Mormonism. They are called apostates or sons of perdition. They too will be resurrected but many, if not all, will be sent to Outer Darkness. (Outer Darkness is the name Mormonism gives to the domain of Satan and his legions.)
These apostates are the only people sent to eternal existence with the devil. In speaking of Outer Darkness, the original Mormon prophet Joseph Smith said “This is the case with many apostates of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (quoted in Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual, p. 358).
Norm, your quote doesn't address what is being said here. Apostates are doomed to outer darkness. You both claimed this isn't accurate. What is not accurate about this? I see how it could be expounding and clarifying what JS meant in your quotation, but see nothing inaccurate about this.
The important thing to note here is that my quote is specifically referencing Mormon Doctrine, while you are using one that references denying Christ. Big differences there Norm.
SZonian,
You provide this quotation which comes from an anti-mormonism site:
The only group not covered are the people who left Mormonism. Once professing belief in the Mormon doctrine, they subsequently rejected Mormonism. They are called apostates or sons of perdition. They too will be resurrected but many, if not all, will be sent to Outer Darkness. (Outer Darkness is the name Mormonism gives to the domain of Satan and his legions.) These apostates are the only people sent to eternal existence with the devil. In speaking of Outer Darkness, the original Mormon prophet Joseph Smith said “This is the case with many apostates of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (quoted in Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual, p. 358).
http://www.truthinlovetomormons.com/basic_mormon_doctrine/doctrine/chrono/judgment.htm
The only part of that quotation that comes from a Latter-day Saint source are the words quoted of Joseph Smith - which I have presented in their full context in an earlier post on this thread.
As I have said before, leaving Mormonism does not make you a Son of Perdition.
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