Posted on 12/28/2007 9:19:39 AM PST by Huber
Yeah. Double yuck.
As do I, and in my mind, because it is part of the magesterium of the church, and imbued with the principles of the beatitudes and supernatural love, it gets precedence over any other moral guide or line of thought that attempts to compete with it.
This is an incredibly wise observation.
S, it's a good read, if for no other reason that to examine a different view on what it means to be free in Christ:
I agree. I don't engage in those discussions; they make me nauseous.
As you may know, since I’ve mentioned it a number of times over the years, Homily XIX on Corinthians was given to me by my father, of eternal memory, just before my own marriage. Its been my “marriage guide” for the past 31 years. It works, by the way! I had forgotten about the wonderful discussion of freedom in Christ which it contains.
Our Western, really Enlightenment, concepts of freedom are rather different from those held by others at other times in other places, especially in the Orthodox East.
Thanks for the reminder!
Marking
What does the Orthodox Church teach about the Church's power to bind & loose sin?
I think that "conscientious objection" is a derivative of "Just War" theory. I think the West recognizes the inherent evil of war, all war, even just wars. While you see the ongoing slaughter that's taken place in European crossroads throughout the ages, the wars that the Western Church prevented rarely get mentioned in any history books. An excommunicated prince had a great deal of difficulty gathering any army, because death on the battlefield by anyone who fought under his banner meant certain damnation.
No recognizing sin for sin and dealing with it through the sacraments is leading to a sort of moral relativism in the West which may well lead to its downfall because, unlike the recognition of the sinfulness of war in the Christian East, its non recognition or nuanced recognition in the West makes the whole concept of evil disappear, sort of like the Evil One has, BC.
I see your point, but wonder about the Eastern response to communism's rise to power in the USSR. The Church survived underground, but it didn't prevent Russians from taking up arms on behalf of their nation.
I'm again reminded of the urban legend about young Catholic girls having abortions, because an abortion would only be one sin, whereas, there's no way to repent if she's committing an ever growing number of sins by taking birth control pills.
“We must all go beyond our limits. Jesus did. We can, with His help.”
Thanks..but I’ve already been stretched beyond the limit.
Thank you!
“I see your point, but wonder about the Eastern response to communism’s rise to power in the USSR. The Church survived underground, but it didn’t prevent Russians from taking up arms on behalf of their nation.”
I doubt we can ever know how many, if any, wars the Orthodox Church has prevented. Human beings go to war whether they are Orthodox or Latin or Reformed or Hindus or Mohammedans, etc. We shouldn’t be surprised if men war with each other. That’s reality. We however should never believe, much less teach, that war is not always sinful.
“What does the Orthodox Church teach about the Church’s power to bind & loose sin?”
That’s sort of a broad subject. In a nutshell, Orthodoxy teaches what Rome teaches but there’s more to it than that.
“I’m again reminded of the urban legend about young Catholic girls having abortions, because an abortion would only be one sin, whereas, there’s no way to repent if she’s committing an ever growing number of sins by taking birth control pills.”
I don’t doubt that’s a legend, however, it speaks volumes about the position the Latin Church has placed at least some of its people in.
I doubt we can ever know how many, if any, wars the Orthodox Church has prevented.
I'm sure the Orthodox Church prevented some, possibly more than the Western Church, though as I said, it's the kind of history that rarely gets told. Rome had a real knack for siding with stronger princes against the weaker ones in disputes, so "prevention of war between Catholic brothers" on Her part wasn't (IMO) always entirely altruistic.
Human beings go to war whether they are Orthodox or Latin or Reformed or Hindus or Mohammedans, etc. We shouldn’t be surprised if men war with each other. That’s reality.
This is true. On a smaller scale, it could be said that police are in a constant state of "war".
We however should never believe, much less teach, that war is not always sinful.
Sin of commission isn't the only kind of sin. Evil can also thrive due to sins of omission.
My reason for bringing up the abortion, birth control thing.... The EO position on war almost seems like it's okay to willfully sin, with an expectation of asking for & receiving absolution later. Those who survive battle have a better chance of forgiveness than those who've died in battle?
Me: “What does the Orthodox Church teach about the Church’s power to bind & loose sin?”
That’s sort of a broad subject.
Indeed it is. The Holy Spirit leads & guides the Church, preventing it from making grave errors. If a church is teaching it's flock that it is incapable of error & the flock managed to follow the church's teaching to the letter, think this imaginary flock would be without any grave sin?
In a nutshell, Orthodoxy teaches what Rome teaches but there’s more to it than that.
What does Orthodoxy teach in respect to its own infallibility?
I don’t doubt that’s a legend, however, it speaks volumes about the position the Latin Church has placed at least some of its people in.
It reminds me a great deal of the penance required of some of the lapsi. Seven years on the doorstep of the church is a very long time & I wonder how many gave up before their time was fully served.
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