Posted on 11/13/2007 5:34:21 PM PST by Semper
One of the most dangerous political considerations today is that of abortion; it is a most divisive subject. Many in this arena are motivated by religious beliefs. Just in case anyone has forgotten, we are not a theocracy – our founding fathers wanted religion left to the churches and the government left to the most qualified.
Those who fanatically oppose the medical procedure of abortion refer to themselves as “pro-life”, implying that those who do not agree with them do not value life as much as they do (a most arrogant state of mind) .
To believe so strongly in your understanding of life that you assume the right to take away the freedom of a woman to determine what will define her life is dangerous. You certainly have the right to try to influence that woman to do what you think is best, but it is her right and responsibility to make the final decision.
One of the things that hurts the anti abortion movement is the terms which are coined. A fetus is not a baby (just as a child is not an adult and an adult is not a senior citizen). Human life goes through stages of development. And, until someone is born into this human environment, until they breathe on their own, until they feed on their own, until they exist outside of a woman’s womb, they are not anyone’s responsibility other than the woman who sustains them.
That is unless you want to overrule the intention of our founders and apply your religious understanding of how life should be interpreted and take away the freedom for which countless “already born” have died.
Do you presume to insist that human activity (birth, growth, deterioration, death) is more powerful than God’s creation - which is described as spiritual? Can the human decisions to kill a living person (as in war) or to abort a POTENTIAL, undeveloped person actually overrule God’s creations?
I believe that there is nothing humans can do to overturn God’s laws and his infinite creation of good. What is required is for us to FREELY choose to live in accordance with HIS plan. And politically, we need to support those who realistically have a chance to foster that outcome.
FREEDOM
What have you read about "just war" theory? If an armed force intentionally targets innocents, not allowing for the killing of innocents as collateral damage of going after bad guys, but targeting them, would you consider it to be a war crime or something that is morally acceptable for whatever reason?
Very true.
Ungodly men will govern unjustly to the born as well as the unborn.
Been there, done that, chose the risk to myself & at the time I was wishy washy pro-choice. By wishy washy pro-choice my position was, "I could never have an abortion myself, but refuse to inflict my beliefs on everyone else". I've since seen the light & strongly believe my position was incorrect.
Abortions have had many negative impacts on our society. If we hadn't aborted a good share of the generations following the genX generation, you think the immigration debate we're having would be the same as it is? Do you think there'd be the strong euthanasia movement to deal with an aging population? Do you think woman killing their newborns would be getting a slap on the wrist as they are now, if we hadn't so devalued life by accepting legal abortion?
Well, the guy claims to be a Christian, though it does seem like the pick and choose variety.
Tho I can't speak for the poster, I got the impression that the goal here was to try to get some of the Christian right to vote "pragmatically" instead of on principles. By accepting late term abortions, he's taken minority position. By accepting it being a civil rights, federal issue, I think he's taking another minority position.
While I would love to see legal abortion beyond saving the life of the mother made illegal, I doubt that will become the law of the land during my lifetime, so for now, I'll take some incremental ism. After making most late term abortions illegal (life of mother exception), send the rest back to the states.
You put it very nicely!
When God gave Moses the Commandment, "Thou shalt not kill," he made no exceptions for abortion.
Abortion IS murder and just to illustrate the absurd belief of the pro-abortionists try this statement:
"I would not [kill, rape, commit arson, commit armed robbery, sell drugs, molest children, etc.], but I don't believe it is my right to tell someone else that it is wrong for them to [kill, rape, commit arson, commit armed robbery, sell drugs, molest children, etc.]."
Because this is the EXACT statement that they use to justify abortion.
The reality is that in nearly all cases continuing the pregnancy puts the mother’s life at risk, the baby is almost certain to die anyway because it is generally an ectopic. This situation is very rare and nobody is suggesting that the mother not be operated on.
As far as rape/incest goes, statistics suggest that only about one to two percent of abortions are performed on women who conceived during rape or incest. However, in these cases, abortion is still not the answer. No CIVILIZED society has ever punished the child for the crimes of their father.
Yes, of course it is, which is why I admitted to having held that belief. I was once an enabler & it's possible you think I still am, because I'd accept getting the issue sent back to the states instead of demanding we make all abortions a federal crime.
So what? That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote based on their principles.
Disagree. A candidate's position on abortion is an indicator of the type of judges he would nominate for the Supreme Court.
And in Rudy's case, he has expressed support for tax-payer funding of abortion, which makes it an even more relevant issue.
I would be angry at the rapist and do what I could to see him brought to justice.
I would not try to 'fix' the situation by executing one of the innocent parties.
True, but there are other medical conditions that would have to be considered. For example, delaying chemotherapy could be fatal to the mother, but getting chemotherapy would kill the child. Toxemia generally occurs late in pregnancies, after the child has become viable, but not always. Taking the child early puts its life at greater risk, but could be necessary to save the life of the mother. If the child is taken early, but dies, I wouldn't wanna see anyone charged.
This situation is very rare and nobody is suggesting that the mother not be operated on.
Ectopic is the easy one & on it, you are correct.
As far as rape/incest goes, statistics suggest that only about one to two percent of abortions are performed on women who conceived during rape or incest. However, in these cases, abortion is still not the answer. No CIVILIZED society has ever punished the child for the crimes of their father.
You'll notice I didn't allow for rape, incest or health exceptions.
I don't think that at all and I apologize if I gave that impression. I was agreeing with you.
I know several women who had abortions and they are now among the staunchest opponents of abortion today and I believe their testimony to other women is possibly the most beneficial.
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