LDS defend the faith as Christian

The Salt Lake Tribune ^ | 10/07/07 | By Peggy Fletcher Stack

[colorcountry]

Not only is Mormonism a Christian faith, it is the truest form of Christianity, said speaker after speaker on the first day of the 177th Semiannual LDS General Conference. LDS authorities were responding to the allegation that Mormonism isn't part of Christianity. Made by different mainline Protestant and Catholic churches and repeated constantly during coverage of Mitt Romney's presidential campaign, the claim is based on Mormonism's beliefs about God, its rejection of ancient ideas about the Trinity still widely accepted, and the LDS Church's extra-biblical scriptures. "It is not our purpose to demean any person's belief nor the doctrine of any religion," said Apostle Jeffrey R. Holland in the afternoon session. "But if one says we are not Christians because we do not hold a fourth- or fifth-century view of the Godhead, then what of those first [Christians], many of whom were eye-witnesses of the living Christ, who did not hold such a view either?"

{snip}

The day's sermons included many familiar themes, including the importance of faith, the need for pure thoughts and actions, avoiding pornography reaching out to neighbors and eliminating spiritual procrastination. Hinckley talked about the destructive nature of anger in marriages, on the road, and in life, urging Mormons to "control your tempers, to put a smile upon your faces, which will erase anger; speak with words of love and peace, appreciation and respect."

[Elsie]

They are both good. A lot of good men worked hard, with knowledge, to put them together.

I'm convinced. Now convince OMM.

[Elsie]

 

Predestination in any form.

 

Oh??? 

 

THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541

   1 We believe in god, the Eternal Father, and in His son, Jesus Christ, and in the holy Ghost.
   2 We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.
   3 We believe that through the atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
   4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, repentance; third, baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
   5 We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
   6 We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
   7 We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
   8 We believe the bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the book of Mormon to be the word of God.
   9 We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
  10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
  11 We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
  12 We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
  13 We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith

[Elsie]

Predestination in any form.

 

 

ANY form??

 

KJV Romans 8:29-31
 29.  For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
 30.  Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
 31.  What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

 

KJV Ephesians 1:4-12
 4.  According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
 5.  Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
 6.  To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
 7.  In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
 8.  Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
 9.  Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
 10.  That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
 11.  In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
 12.  That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

 

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NIV Romans 8:29-31
 29.  For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.
 30.  And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.
 31.  What, then, shall we say in response to this? If God is for us, who can be against us?

 

NIV Ephesians 1:4-6
 4.  For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love
 5.  he  predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will--
 6.  to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.

 

NIV Ephesians 1:11-12
 11.  In him we were also chosen,  having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will,
 12.  in order that we, who were the first to hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory.

[Old Mountain man]

Well, at least I am Christian enough not to call other people names like you and Elsie.

Our conversations are complete since you do not have the ability to be civil with those that disagree with you or fail to heed your orders.

[FastCoyote]

“Well, at least I am Christian enough not to call other people names like you and Elsie.”

I said you were “willfully ignorant”, that is not a name, it is a statement of fact because you are willfully ignoring the historical statements of Gov. Ford. I will be happy to stop discourse with someone who is willfully ignorant because it is as productive as arguing with a brick. Just please don’t mischaracterize what just went on with name calling.

“Our conversations are complete since you do not have the ability to be civil with those that disagree with you or fail to heed your orders.”

I am exceedingly civil with anyone who wishes to present factual information, though we may disagree on the interpretation. I simply do not abide the willfully ignorant, they are a pox on civil discourse.

I just can’t resist one last question. Who stopped the annihilation of Nauvoo if it wasn’t Gov. Ford? ? ?

The militia had called themselves up and were well formed. The Mormon Legion was also ready for a fight. The only one who could have kept the warring bands apart was Gov. Ford - and as he states in his book, he disbanded a number of militias by his order. But go sulk in your ignorance OMM, who needs to debate someone who wears a bucket on their head.

[greyfoxx39]

JS was a fine-looking fellow...he's much better now!

[Old Mountain man]

At least I have a head. Go attack someone that cares what you have to say.

[Old Mountain man]

Go on back home to the DUmmies where you belong.

[greyfoxx39]

[Elsie]

Well, at least I am Christian enough not to call other people names like you and Elsie.

 

You are absolutely right!

 

You merely assess our mental states according to the Mormon template that anyone who disagrees with you is wrong.

 

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Feel the LOVE!!!

 

 

To: Elsie

Pardon me, but the things you write here tend to make me believe that you are either crazy, viscious or stupid. I am uncertain as to the truth of the matter, at this point.

 

626 posted on 11/01/2007 6:16:55 PM CDT by Old Mountain man (Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice!)

[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 611 | View Replies | Report Abuse ]

 

[1000 silverlings]

LOL.

[Elsie]

At least I have a head.

Get out yer GPS 'cause you can't see any sunshine from there.

[Elsie]

Go on back home to the DUmmies where you belong.

Ha!

You told him!!

--MormonDude(At least you didn't call him a name!)

[Elsie]

Nice tagline!

[1000 silverlings]

Thanks

[Elsie]

Your 'girl' didn't show on your home page.

 

The command you have is THIS:

 

<img src=";http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1042/662119684_62045d1c86_m.jpg&quot;&quot;">

 

Change it to THIS:

 

 <img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1042/662119684_62045d1c86_m.jpg">

 

[MHGinTN]

There’s the Beef! placemarker

[1000 silverlings]

ok, all fixed, thanks!

[FastCoyote]

la la la la la LOL

[Degaston]

All this discussion about the Bible and Mormonism reminds me of something interesting. Some chunks of the Book of Mormon are word for word verbatim the same as chunks in the King James version of the Bible. Then Joseph Smith "translates" the Bible and makes some corrections to some of those very same verses that were "incorrectly translated" in the King James version of the Bible. So not only did the translators of the Bible get it wrong then so did the Nephite prophets and/or Joseph Smith.

  To quickly research a little on this embarrassing issue for my church see http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jst/contents, http://scriptures.lds.org/en/3_ne/12, http://scriptures.lds.org/en/3_ne/13, http://scriptures.lds.org/en/3_ne/14, http://scriptures.lds.org/en/matt/5, http://scriptures.lds.org/en/matt/6, and http://scriptures.lds.org/en/matt/7.