Posted on 07/17/2007 3:49:34 PM PDT by NYer
Lesson 2 of 43.
Catholic ping!
The following text contains the correct link to the article.
Nowhere does the Bible say that the Bible is the sole source of Christian teaching. This fact refutes the classic Protestant teaching of "the Bible alone" (sola Scriptura ). For more on this topic, see The Catholic Church proved by the Protestant Bible.
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Bump! Vital reading for all.
Well, this was in the nineteenth century, and that was a long time ago . . . .
Peter 1:21 (KJV) For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
Verse 20 is not saying the Catholic church is God's official interpreter, it is saying that man didn't think up a prophecy: God did via the Holy Ghost.
Protestant teaching about Sola Scriptura is not "Bible alone". (Solo Scriptura) Carry on.
Just getting back on line today. Will post what I promised yesterday shortly.
From the Catholic Bible ... here is the footnote from that particular verse.
Often cited, along with 2 Tim 3:16, on the "inspiration" of scripture or against private interpretation, these verses in context are directed against the false teachers of 2 Peter 2 and clever tales (2 Peter 1:16). The prophetic word in scripture comes admittedly through human beings (2 Peter 1:21), but moved by the holy Spirit, not from their own interpretation, and is a matter of what the author and Spirit intended, not the personal interpretation of false teachers. Instead of under the influence of God, some manuscripts read "holy ones of God."
Isn't the New Testament the Old Testament fulfilled?
"Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle." (2 Thessalonians 2:14)
This was 1 letter written to 1 church. The word "epistle" here is singular. There were many letters written to lots of other churches. How do you know that when all these letters were put together ALL the "words" "tradations" needed for salvation were not included. In this scripture, Paul is speaking of this one particular epistle, not all epistle's wrote.
"Many other signs also did Jesus in the sight of His disciples, which are not written in this book." (John 20:30)
If you go on and read the rest of this sentence in the next verse you get the whole meaning of the thought. That the things John wrote in his book, he choose to prove that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. This scripture quoted does not mean that the things that were not written down included things we need to know as "teachings." It does not imply at all that there are things not written that are needed to be a true Christian. IMO, this scripture in this lesson is being taken out of context.
Becky
2Ki 22:8 ¶ And Hilkiah the high priest said unto Shaphan the scribe, I have found the book of the law in the house of the LORD. And Hilkiah gave the book to Shaphan, and he read it.
2Ki 22:11 ¶ And it came to pass, when the king had heard the words of the book of the law, that he rent his clothes.
2Ki 23:2 And the king went up into the house of the LORD, and all the men of Judah and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem with him, and the priests, and the prophets, and all the people, both small and great: and he read in their ears all the words of the book of the covenant which was found in the house of the LORD.
2Ki 23:3 ¶ And the king stood by a pillar, and made a covenant before the LORD, to walk after the LORD, and to keep his commandments and his testimonies and his statutes with all [their] heart and all [their] soul, to perform the words of this covenant that were written in this book. And all the people stood to the covenant.
One can hear the old priests crying out, “This book needs to be interpreted according to our tradition!”
No, the rest is in tradition.
"Many other signs also did Jesus in the sight of His disciples, which are not written in this book." (John 20:30)
Maybe your Catholic bible left out the next verse...Is that why you didn't include it???
Joh 20:30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:
And why were they not written in the book??? Because they were not needed for our Salvation...
Joh 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
Here's the verse that goes with the one you cited, and left out...Why would you not quote this one as well...Trying to prove something that isn't so???
Bingo, the Holy Spirit sent to the Church as a whole on Pentacost. It is the Holy Spirit who has guided the Church in all truth and the same Holy Spirit guides the Church today. Alleluia! Thanks be to God for His wonderful gift.
Agreed, and as well, there is always Joshua 1:9, saying similar:
Joshua 1:8 (KJV) This book of the law shall not depart out of thy mouth; but thou shalt meditate therein day and night, that thou mayest observe to do according to all that is written therein: for then thou shalt make thy way prosperous, and then thou shalt have good success.
The book is to be meditated upon...not upon "those who are the official interpreters of what it says".
I really like your scripture, though. It makes a great point.
Here is another passage about "tradition":
Matthew 15:1-9 (KJV) 1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying, 2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread. 3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. 5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; 6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
I note, from above, that Jesus didn't deny he was defying tradition of the "elders". He DID say, "also", didn't He?
He admitted that He was going AGAINST what the elders had taught via 'tradition'...because their tradition was worthless. Even worse than worthless...it ultimately went against the commandment of God.
There is a reason Jesus SAID: Matthew 15:9 (KJV) But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Read that above verse again...VAIN worship...teaching the DOCTRINES (that means tradition folks) of men.
Luke 8:18 (KJV) Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.
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