PROPOSALS INVITED FOR MORE CIVIL DISCOURSE RE RELIGIOUS FIGURES AT ODDS WITH VARIOUS SENSIBILITIES

Quix | 18 MAY 2006 | Quix

[Quix]

PROPOSALS INVITED TOWARD A MORE CIVIL DISCOURSE RE RELIGIOUS FIGURES AT ODDS WITH VARIOUS SENSIBILITIES

The current thread regarding Pat Robertson is but the latest in a long tradition of certain flavors of evangelical Christian and particularly Pentecostal/Charismatic religious figures being thoroughly shredded by what--90% or more of the posts--usually in the harshest, most hostile, even demonizing wording possible.

It seems that when folks are perceived to be in such Pentecostal/charismatic categories, all bets are off, no holds barred--the most viscious attacks are the minimal Standard Operating Procedure. Instead of exhorting one another in Christian Love, the worst attitudes normally evidenced in the most ruthless of groups seems to flood out from many corners of the forum.

The forum rules about personal attacks are thrown to the wind--usually with great cheered-on fervor.

Personally, I don't mind the likes of Shrillery getting thoroughly castigated. They are the evil--even truly satanic opponents to everything this forum stands for. Ditto for the Jihadis. I think on that, all conservatives would readily agree or near agree.

However, when it comes to religious figures, there tends to be great haughty hostility to those not seen as kosher enough--and too often--for all those not members of one's own tidy little group.

We can ALL feel DUTY BOUND to "set folks Bibllically straight" regarding the horrible demonic errors of this or that figure. And, Pentecostals/charismatics usually make easy targets because we say things that are very uncommon in other corners of Christianity--though, interestingly, not at all uncommon in the New Testament Church.

But, from our perspective, we could say the same thing about John McArthur, for example. Or Dave Hunt.

Each homogenic group could come up with a list of popular religious figures from other groups that the first group considered evil and beyond the pale.

Then there's the great hostility between the RC's and the Protestants.

IF WE ARE REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT ACTING LIKE JESUS--THERE MUST BE A BETTER WAY to handle such perspectives. What are your proposals?

It's not up to the beleagured Religion Moderator. And Dear JimRob has been driven to distractions more than a few times and probably wished there was some way to send the whole religion forum into a black hole for good.

It seems to me that if we cannot police ourselves better on this score, that we may well not deserve to call ourselves CHRIST-LIKE = CHRISTIAN.

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I'm not suggesting that we ought not be allowed to state sincerely held perspectives which question another's stance as being Biblical enough or full of enough integrity or lacking in duplicity etc. We ought still be able to articulate what we perceive to be true and particularly Biblicly true vs UnBiblical.

But doing so so outrageously and in such devilish terms ought to stop and stop cold. PARTICULARLY ABOUT THINGS WITH REGARD TO WHICH THERE IS BIBLICAL ROOM TO DISAGREE, TO HAVE MORE THAN ONE PERSPECTIVE. I am not talking about the Virgin Birth, The Resurrection etc.

But we ought to have some mutually agreed upon minimal Christian standard for doing so. And we ought to police ourselves as well as lovingly each other.

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Personally, my proposal would be

1. that things such as calling another religious figure a demonized, satanic, etc individual needs to be limited to VERY OVERT DEMONSTRATIONS OF CLEARLY DEMONIC BEHAVIORS AND STATEMENTS. That is, demonized behaviors common in the NT. Statements clearly and overtly blasphemous in starkly brazen and obvious terms--not interpreted, rationalized terms on the part of the hearer.

2. that naysayers from outside the normal Christian community--those hostile to the whole idea of Christianity and all the more so to anything remotely supernaturally Christian--that those sorts of hostile naysayers be soundly, persistently and totally discouraged from getting away with their viscious, demeaning, virulant rants.

3. That once the more strident of us have stated our perspective regarding a particular religious figure--especially 2-3 times--we would do well to let it rest and avoid ranting on and on and on and on for dozens of strident redundant posts.

4. IF WE CAN PUT THINGS tenatively and graciously, OK--perhaps a longer discourse would be warranted or merited. Graciousness deserves something extra in the religion forum! But the haughty, self-righteous-from Mt Sinai sorts of castigating-of-all-not-our-idea-not-our-tidy-little-box--that needs to go and go quickly.

5. Those failing to follow through with such guidelines might voluntarily or even at Mod's requirement take themselves out of the next X or XX such threads. Or perhaps they would be prevented/ordered to avoid all further threads on such a topic.

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I'm happy to consider other reasonable alternatives. I'm just groping to try and find a workable, functional way which

1. Allows reasonable discourse and a mutually respectful sharing of all perspectives on a topic and even on a personage.

2. Demonstrates MUCH, MUCH, MUCH MORE of the unity of spirit and mutual charity which Christ called HIS FOLLOWERS to.

3. Prevents virtually every thread that involves Pentecostal/Charismatic figures and topics from becoming a bloody shredding fest ALWAYS at the expense of those of that perspective.

4. Brings glory to God instead of such a tarnished bad taste in everyone's mouths because of the awful behavior of God's snotty nosed kids.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

Exactly.

[Quix]

I strongly agree.

And, while I also think that most other TV evangelists etc. are probably more earnest good hearted servants of God than sometimes appears to be the case . . .

Pat Robertson is a whole several orders of magnitude different.

Perhaps those not familiar with the . . . genre . . . would miss such distinctions. But I don't. He's qualitatively much above average in a list of respects.

[R. Scott]

I hate to say it so bluntly, but you're speaking from ignorance, my friend.

Yes. You are right. I should know by now that any one who tacks “Reverend” in front of their name and does some highly publicized good works while excusing other actions has just got to be numbered among the Saints of Heaven.

[R. Scott]

That must have taken some digging.
…
I am confident that if and when anyone around Pat became aware of even an appearance of wrong, that Pat corrected it.

No digging necessary. I do watch the local news. Also, you are partially correct. When the news media brought it to the public’s attention he first tried to excuse it (if I remember right, it went like: The mines employ many natives that would otherwise be unemployed, so it was right that the OB plane was used). When that didn’t go over too well I believe reimbursement was mentioned.

[Quix]

My personal bias is that

that would have been more fitting to have mentioned in the inital diatribe, assault and insult.

And, clearly the reporter must have included 0.0000000% spin on it.

/s

[restornu]

you too Quix, it good to discern and yet be fair!

[Theo]

Dude, what is wrong with you? I've told you that I know the man. You, on the other hand, refuse to provide any evidence for your opinion of him. I have no reason to believe it's based on truth, but on mere anti-Christian bigotry. It's not about "Reverend"; it's about having worked with him for years.

Just apologize and go on. Or be stubborn and arrogant. In either case, it says more about you than the "Reverend."

[Quix]

In my experiences with myself . . . most judgments have been that way . . . even many I thought initially to be so pure and righteous . . . even necessary "defending the truly turest true of the truest true faith."

But God has ways of showing one increasingly deeper and blacker corners of one's heart--always wrapped, of course, in the whitest of white robes and the whitest of white white washes for tombs.

Of course, there are those who decline such a course of study . . . as long as they can get away with it. I know that that's like, too.

[BikerGold]

Quix, your Dad don't have to be a little sweetie to get in the Pearly Gates. "They" come get you, and "Whoops--There He Is."

Glad to hear he's still raising stink down here. Write down his rants--they'll make a whole lot of sense in the future.

[Rhadaghast]

Thanks very much for this post.
I have been very hesitatent to post any Charismatic articles due to this hostility.

After reading 1 Corithians Chapter One I am again brought up short by the attitude of the worlds wisdom spouted on this forum as if it is from God.

Thank you for this declaration of Love that you have bravely posted.

[Mrs. Don-o]

Thanks for this post. I apologize if I have ever offended. I have a weakness in that department. Please forgive me.

[Quix]

True. Thanks.

Dad has had an interesting life. one of 13 kids plus 7 who wandered by. His dad died early--alcoholism and diabetes. Grandma lived to be 96, I think it was.

Thanks for your kind and thoughtful words.

[Quix]

I have been very hesitatent to post any Charismatic articles due to this hostility.

After reading 1 Corithians Chapter One I am again brought up short by the attitude of the worlds wisdom spouted on this forum as if it is from God.
- - - -

Wellll, we know that the enemy fights hardest with the most potent and vivid demonstrations of God's power and majesty. It is a sobering thing for those of us who know the reality of God's power and gifts in our era to walk, live and reach out in ways worthy of that knowledge. By His Spirit, His Blood and the word of our testimony, certainly.

It has felt extremely lonely in years past because so many were intimidated and scared into silence--turned off so much by the hostility. I hate it when the enemy wins so much like that. All the more so on a conservative forum with lots of precious Believers of all stripes.

Thankfully, there seems to be an increase in God's Grace hereon, now. I think our Religion Moderator deserves our prayers and thanks for that, for sure. And, we ought to show God and the RM how much we appreciate such tireless labors by being as supportive and kosher as possible.

Yes! I have been continually . . . educated . . . in very vivid and very literal ways . . . re HOW MUCH it really is true that God's foolishness is wiser than man's greatest wisdom. God seems to have an attraction, a hobby, a bent, a tendency--to set the world up to show how ridiculous and hypocritical it is AT BEST.

I think the spittle with mud to heal the eyes of the blind man was one example. Another was Gideon's battle. The woman washing Jesus' feet with her tears was another. Christ's choice of some of the Apostles was another. And in our era, He seems to have chosen some awful candidates to show His glory through. But then all the more obvious that it is HIS glory. He sure seems to have an affinity for paradoxes.

I think it's going to be much more like that the closer we get to His soon return.

Thanks for your kind post.

[Quix]

I apologize if I have ever offended. I have a weakness in that department. Please forgive me
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Likewise. Lots of people can be offended if I just walk by--even after my shower! LOL.

Thankfully, most students seem to enjoy me above average.

No sweat on your posts. Much appreciate your kind and Christian words.

God's best to you and yours.

[Quix]

Much appreciate the confirmation of that.

Certainly we are called to be healing salve in a broken world. All the more so with the 'Bretheren & Sistern!'

Much appreciate your ministry.

[BikerGold]

Luke9 NIV: 60Jesus said to him, "Let the dead bury their own dead, but you go and proclaim the kingdom of God."

61Still another said, "I will follow you, Lord; but first let me go back and say good bye to my family."

62Jesus replied, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for service in the kingdom of God.

[Quix]

Thanks tons.

Mercifully, Have had that attitude at least for 25 years.

But I have also learned--a little bit--that it's important to wait on The Lord for His direction. So, I continue to do that--hoping I can go back to Asia soon enough to do some good before the real "festivities" globally begin.

Thanks much for your input.

LUB,

[Joya]

Thanks Quix.

‘If A is success in life, then A equals x plus y plus z. Work is x; y is play; and z is keeping your mouth shut.’

{Einstein quote.}

[Quix]

THANKS.