Local pews straining to hold increasing Catholic population

Salisbury Post ^ | May 9, 2005 | Scott Jenkins

[NYer]

the three biggest barriers to recruiting more priests are the requirements that men remain celibate and that they "sign on for life" and the fact that women aren't allowed in the priesthood.
Dean R. Hoge, a professor of sociology at Catholic University of America in Washington

Uh ... professor .... women will NEVER be ordained to the Catholic Church. The pope has spoken infallibly on this. It is finished.

Catholic Ping - Please freepmail me if you want on/off this list

[GipperGal]

You know what -- something tells me that if the diocese there were to ordained "women priests" and/or "married priests", the problem of accommodating a booming Catholic community would indeed disappear. Why? Because there would no longer be a growth in Church attendance! If fact, they would probably lose more than half of their current members. I willing to venture a guess that the reason why their community is growing is that they are an orthodox diocese!

[Romish_Papist]

You'd think this guy would get that point, but hey, maybe he just doesn't want to see it.

[sinkspur]

You know what -- something tells me that if the diocese there were to ordained "women priests" and/or "married priests", the problem of accommodating a booming Catholic community would indeed disappear. Why? Because there would no longer be a growth in Church attendance! If fact, they would probably lose more than half of their current members. I willing to venture a guess that the reason why their community is growing is that they are an orthodox diocese!

How do you explain the growth in parishes WITH married priests? Most Catholics (if you believe the surveys) support married men in the priesthood. It's simply no big deal to them.

Look at the acceptance of married deacons.

I'm willing to venture a guess that accepting married men into the priesthood would be greeted enthusiastically by 80% or more of the weekly Mass attendees.

[N. Theknow]

Specifically, he says, the three biggest barriers to recruiting more priests are the requirements that men remain celibate and that they "sign on for life" and the fact that women aren't allowed in the priesthood. "If those were removed ... the priest shortage would be over," Hoge said. "If any one of them were removed, it would have a big impact."

What a dolt!

The reason there is a shortage of priests is because this is what people want from their church.

He is right in one thing. If priests were allowed to marry and women priests were allowed, the people would stop coming and there would be no more shortage.

[GipperGal]

Married deacons is one thing. Even I don't have a problem with that. But married priests, no -- unless they are former Anglicans or Orthodox priests who have converted to Catholicism. People flock to parishes that are orthodox.

[sinkspur]

But married priests, no -- unless they are former Anglicans or Orthodox priests who have converted to Catholicism. People flock to parishes that are orthodox.

Why is it dandy to accept married Protestant ministers into the Catholic priesthood, but not married Catholic men?

[Rytwyng]

if the diocese there were to ordained "women priests" and/or "married priests", the problem of accommodating a booming Catholic community would indeed disappear

These are 2 separate issues. Women "Priests" are a clear violation of scripture and can never be permitted -never, ever, ever, period, no discussion. If your church ever ordains one, LEAVE!

However -- as several Catholics have explained here at FR -- there are no inherent theological barriers to ordaining married men as priests; the Pope could change that any time if he felt it prudent to do so. It's his call, however, and not the diocese.

[GipperGal]

Why is it dandy to accept married Protestant ministers into the Catholic priesthood, but not married Catholic men?

A) over a thousand years of Catholic tradition. B) the decree of the Magisterium.

I don't pick and choose what I will believe. At every Mass I attend I affirm my belief in "the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church". "Apostolic", as in: I trust the apostolic succession of authority. I trust the continuity of the faith as handing down by the apostles through the bishops and the councils and the See of St. Peter himself. Who in the hell am I to question such authority? Who are you to question it? If you do think you can question it, are you aware that you are breaking an oath every time you affirm your loyalty and belief in the "the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church" during the Mass?

[CouncilofTrent]

So? Is this a popularity contest? Why should the hierarchy trust mere surveys in making decisions within the Church? The Church isn't a democracy and it shouldn't be concerned with how the laity "accept" a particular discipline. Why not have priests have only male altar servers and encourage young men to think about their vocation?

The priesthood is a full time job that requires hours of prayer study and, of course, administering the Sacraments. Now, if you add a wife and kids to the equation, doesn't this take away time from a priest's duties?

[sinkspur]

If you do think you can question it, are you aware that you are breaking an oath every time you affirm your loyalty and belief in the "the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church" during the Mass?

Mandatory celibacy for priests is a discipline, not a doctrine. No one is required to believe that priests have to be unmarried at peril of their soul.

[NYer]

How do you explain the growth in parishes WITH married priests?

How many are there? Where are they located? Got some statistics to back this up?

What about ordaining women as priests?

[sinkspur]

Why should the hierarchy trust mere surveys in making decisions within the Church?

It shouldn't.

I was responding to GipperGal, who asserted that Catholics would leave the Church if married men were ordained priests.

Every indication is that they would not.

[GipperGal]

there are no inherent theological barriers to ordaining married men as priests; the Pope could change that any time if he felt it prudent to do so. It's his call, however, and not the diocese.

Yes, that is true to a certain extend. Yes, it is true that in the past priests were married. However, bishops were usually not married. This tradition has changed for a number of reasons and celibacy has been the norm for over a thousand years. I don't have a problem with "married priests"; however, I will obey Rome. Period. End of story.

I also "personally" believe Rome is correct in denying priests to marry, at least at this present time. I could imagine them allowing it at another time, but not now. Why? Well because the reason why it is being demanded is because our present age has decreed that the end all and be all of human experience is sexual fulfillment. Thus, priests must be allowed to marry because they couldn't possibly be happy otherwise.

[sinkspur]

How many are there?

Over 200

Where are they located?

Mostly in conservative dioceses and in the Southwest.

Got some statistics to back this up?

No. But the local experience is that all of the parishes pastored by Anglican dispensation priests have experienced growth since these men arrived. Maybe they would have experienced growth anyway, but there are not hordes of Catholics marching out of these churches.

Catholics are not bothered by having married men in the priesthood.

[conservonator]

Catholics are not bothered by having married men in the priesthood.

How about married women, or single women for that matter?

[GipperGal]

Perhaps it would have been more accurate for me to say that church attendance would diminish in parishes that called for married priests (i.e. unorthodox parishes that are openly hostile to Rome). Parishes with Anglican dispensation priests are probably very orthodox; after all, the reason why these former Anglican priest have become Catholic is because they are traditionalists who left their church due to its liberal descent into apostasy.

[Thorin]

>>>>>Well because the reason why it is being demanded is because our present age has decreed that the end all and be all of human experience is sexual fulfillment. Thus, priests must be allowed to marry because they couldn't possibly be happy otherwise.

You are exactly right.

[sinkspur]

How about married women, or single women for that matter?

Women cannot be priests.