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FBI concerned about threat of terror-induced blackouts
CNN ^ | Thursday, September 4, 2003

Posted on 09/04/2003 2:07:51 PM PDT by presidio9

Edited on 04/29/2004 2:03:04 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

The FBI found no evidence of any type of terrorism or criminal hacking in its investigation of the August power blackout in the Northeast, but the threat of such action remains a concern, the FBI's top counterterrorism official told a House committee Thursday.


(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: blackouts; fbi; firstenergy; psylliumhusks; targets; terrorism
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To: Robert_Paulson2
Robert, I believe you might be right. One of the few hopes I have for avoiding that is wrapped up in a successful representive form of government for Iraq.

One of the biggest conserns I have, is that Colin Powell just talked Bush into UN involvement for managing Iraq. That might be the whole ball game.
21 posted on 09/04/2003 3:35:16 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: presidio9
I agree with everything you said, but that the Richard Reid shoe bomb incident occured just after Christmas 2001. Just over a month and two weeks from the Flt. 587 bombing. Not to nit pick, just to clarify those dates for accuracy. I believe had he not been caught, that plane explosion would have also been called everything BUT terrorism.
22 posted on 09/04/2003 3:49:11 PM PDT by Flipyaforreal
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To: DoughtyOne
Colin Powell just talked Bush into UN involvement for managing Iraq


Powell can't talk Bush into anything that Bush isn't predisposed towards considering...
Some folks think that nationalism is what causes wars. Powell is clearly one of those guys... and so I fear is condi and bush...

Cheney, I am not so sure of.
But then again... Cheney is NOT President Bush.


I wanted us to export the concepts of capitalism and business.
It's starting to look like we have majored on exporting our businesses instead.

hard to blame this on clinton.
23 posted on 09/04/2003 5:11:39 PM PDT by Robert_Paulson2 (they promised us smaller government... is it smaller yet?)
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To: DoughtyOne
Now read this one (and thanks for the Sydney link)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/975869/posts
24 posted on 09/04/2003 5:29:47 PM PDT by Calpernia (Innocence seldom utters outraged shrieks. Guilt does.)
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To: DoughtyOne
It just seems strange to me that all of a sudden within a month to six weeks the three of us have had major outages.

I consider the power failure to be a great "dry run" for the government's preparations, and mine.

Unfortunately, I'd have to flunk the government for what it did. Or didn't do. I mostly heard, on my crank-up radio, government and company officials pat themselves on the back for how well they were handling things.

Safe water was the most immediate problem, and they issued "boil water" warnings. As long as you had a non-electric source of heat, you were okay. But there were a lot of people out buying bottled water, and the National Guard "water buffaloes" never showed up.

I think this power failure just blew out of the water the official government doctrine of "three days of supplies, and by then we will pick you up and relocate you". Relocation works for a few hundred, or a few thousand. Any problem that affects 50 million people has to be solved while leaving people in place.

I had enough bottled water bought during the "duct tape scare" that I didn't have to go out and stand in line, trying to buy some. 35 half-liter bottles for $6 at Costco meant I could remain well-hydrated, and not have to burn up energy to boil it.

So the blackout convinced me that safe water is the most important item to have, and one should plan for a supply that will last considerably longer than 3 days. Bottled water is cheap, and doesn't take energy to make safe. Don't wait for the National Guard to deliver water to you.

Also, the larger the emergency, the longer it may take to rescue you. The government is doing a disservice by emphasizing the "three day supply". Think in terms of 30 days of water, food, heat, shelter, and weaponry, and you can face all the smaller emergencies with calm.

Thank you, Great Blackout of 2003.

25 posted on 09/04/2003 5:33:13 PM PDT by 300winmag (All that is gold does not glitter.)
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To: 300winmag
I think in terms of ninety days to six months. I agree with your plan ahead strategy.

We buy the two gallon sparklets juggs and rotate.
26 posted on 09/04/2003 5:39:30 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: Robert_Paulson2
I'd agree with that. Still, Bush adopts a policy and then there's a change. Then Powel goes out and touts it. Grrrrrrrrrr. I don't want the UN to snatch this operation from the jaws of success.
27 posted on 09/04/2003 5:41:13 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: Calpernia
Thank you. I had read something to that effect and it influenced me to make the comments you saw earlier. I don't know about London or Sydney, but there was some interesting things taking place on our networks before the power went down.
28 posted on 09/04/2003 5:43:30 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: DoughtyOne
Trust me, I'm as suspicious as you are. There was also another incident that caught my eye.

Read this:

***"Today (brought) another escalation in the
terrorist activity of the Hamas movement when
for the first time, they launched a rocket into
a town in the southern part of the country,
Ashkelon, making an effort to hit a strategic
target that is one of our largest power
stations," Sharon said.***

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/333892.html
29 posted on 09/04/2003 6:04:55 PM PDT by Calpernia (Innocence seldom utters outraged shrieks. Guilt does.)
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To: presidio9
BLAME it on FirstEnergy.

THEY screwed up 'big time' in their control room ...

All other 'talk' on this subject is the useless flapping of lips by know-nothing observers on the sidelines.

Errors as *BIG* as their's CAN'T be replicated by terrorists ...
30 posted on 09/04/2003 6:16:44 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: DoughtyOne
Odds are, these blackouts are ...

.. the products of independent factors.

31 posted on 09/04/2003 6:18:23 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: presidio9
www.cleveland.com/newsflash/news/index.ssf?/newsflash/get_story.ssf?/cgi-free/getstory_ssf.cgi?f0016_BC_BlackoutInvestigation&&news&clblackout

Transcripts show confusion before blackout struck

The Associated Press 9/4/03 2:54 AM

WASHINGTON (AP) -- One high voltage line failed, and another, and then a third. A coal-burning power plant was already out and a nuclear reactor was struggling to get enough electricity.

"We have no clue," an engineer at the FirstEnergy Corp. control center in Ohio responded when a regional grid monitor asked what was happening.

During the 35 minutes before the nation's worst blackout raced across eight states from Michigan to New York, there was a sense of confusion, uncertainty and anxiety among technicians trying to maintain control of the Ohio power system owned by FirstEnergy, according to transcripts released late Wednesday.

The company and its operation of the grid system south of Cleveland have been at the center of the investigation into the blackout, although FirstEnergy officials have said there were problems on other systems across the Midwest that afternoon, not just in its service area.

Members of the House Energy and Commerce Committee were expected to closely question FirstEnergy officials about its power line problems during the hour before the blackout and how its technicians responded when it resumed a second day of hearings into the blackout Thursday. The transcripts, copies of which were released by the committee, were expected to be a focus.

On Wednesday, Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham, who is heading the government's investigation into the outage, told the House panel that it was too early to conclude what precisely caused the blackout. "We won't jump to conclusions," he said.

Separately, the head of an industry-sponsored power grid reliability watchdog said that last year the industry had 444 transmission operating violations nationwide, including some that had a potential of causing a cascading system failure.

Michehl Gent, president of the North American Electric Reliability Council, said it was "premature" to say whether the type of violations reported in 2002 might have played a role in the blackout. Compliance with NERC's rules is voluntary and carry no penalties.

In all, the House panel released 650 pages of transcripts of telephone communications provided by the Midwest Independent Transmission System Operator, including exchanges between MISO grid monitors and FirstEnergy, during the afternoon of Aug. 14.

At about 3:32 p.m. Eastern time that day, a high-voltage line called Hanna-Juniper tripped after power was diverted to it following the failure of another line, causing an overload and the line to sag, hitting a tree.

But four minutes later in the FirstEnergy control room, technicians had no idea what just happened, according to the transcripts.

"Something strange is happening," an MISO technician, Don Hunter, told the Ohio utility, not sure what was amiss. "I've got to find my calculator," he said, trying to get a handle on the power fluctuations.

Told of the failure, a FirstEnergy technician, identified as Schwartz, said, "Daggone it. When did that happen?"

"We've got something going on," he added, promising to investigate. But for the next 20 minutes there was confusion over what lines were out and what the implication might be for the power grid.

Two hours earlier a FirstEnergy coal-burning power plant had gone down and then the nuclear reactor near Perry, Ohio, began having problems.

"They're having a hard time maintaining voltage," a FirstEnergy technician identified as Jerry Snickey told the MISO official at the other end of the phone line, referring to the nuclear unit.

The transmission failures also were still a mystery.

"We have no idea what happened," Snickey said. "We have no clue. Our computer is giving us fits too. We don't even know the status of some of the stuff (power fluctuations) around us."

Hunter, who was at the MISO grid monitoring center in Indiana, expressed frustration at the failure to diagnose the problems erupting in FirstEnergy's system.

"I called you guys like 10 minutes ago, and I thought you were figuring out what was going on there," he complained, according to the transcripts.

"Well, we're trying to," Snickey replied. "Our computer is not happy. It's not cooperating either."

"I can't get a big picture of what's going on," Hunter fretted.

A few minutes later, according to previously released information, another FirstEnergy line failed, and two minutes after that, at 4:08 p.m., utilities in Canada and the Eastern United states observed a wild power swing in a grid called the Lake Erie Loop.

At about 4:11 p.m. the blackout struck across the region.

- - - - - -

FirstEnergy is going *down* as the cause for this ...

32 posted on 09/04/2003 6:25:28 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
Flight 587 was never truly resolved, was it?

Nope ... sabotage of the tail by another airline's flight attendant who was sore at her boyfriend on that flight is the current *hot* rumor going around on e-mail ...

</sarcasm>

33 posted on 09/04/2003 6:28:17 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: Robert_Paulson2
he us does NOT know where the failure occured

Wrong!

34 posted on 09/04/2003 6:29:40 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: presidio9
Well someone needs to tell the terrorists they didn't sabotage the power in these areas. They think they did.
35 posted on 09/04/2003 6:31:17 PM PDT by ladyinred (The left have blood on their hands.)
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To: presidio9
Since when does the FBI tell us everything we need to know?

GET a degree in one of the sciences ... SECURE a job in a technical capacity .. EXPERIENCE the 'real world' for a change ... then DO your own research ... and learn the truth for yourself ...

36 posted on 09/04/2003 6:32:27 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: Robert_Paulson2
terrorists CLAIMED credit.

Funny ... I don't recall a dispatch on Al Jazeera ...

ARE you making thing up by any chance?

37 posted on 09/04/2003 6:37:41 PM PDT by _Jim (Resources for Understanding the Blackout of 2003 - www.pserc.wisc.edu/Resources.htm)
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To: 300winmag
BINGO:

... "three days of supplies, and by then we will pick you up and relocate you". Relocation works for a few hundred, or a few thousand. Any problem that affects 50 million people has to be solved while leaving people in place.

38 posted on 09/04/2003 6:48:02 PM PDT by GOPJ
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To: _Jim
What's your take on that article linked in post 24?
39 posted on 09/04/2003 6:48:15 PM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: _Jim
no... but a lot of folks were in denial before 9/11... a small fringe percentage remain so til today...

believe what you want...
40 posted on 09/04/2003 6:50:08 PM PDT by Robert_Paulson2 (they promised us smaller government... is it smaller yet?)
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