Posted on 06/13/2003 8:17:51 AM PDT by kattracks
(Editor's Note: Contains information some readers may find objectionable.)
(CNSNews.com) - There's something for everyone on the Internet - even for pedophiles who seek support and acceptance for their fixation on children.
Some of the websites that "celebrate" adults' love for minor children are very careful to monitor their content so they don't break any laws. Pornographic images, erotic literature and other sexually explicit content are nowhere to be found on these sites, but advocates for children find them very troubling nevertheless.
At the website Girl Love Garden, pedophiles claim to be on a quest for social acceptance of their sexual preferences. The website celebrates "the emancipation of girls of all ages and 'girl love,' in general."
The website notes that "true emancipation" lies "in a child's sublime assent to becoming self actualized with the keen-eyed help of a loving mentor (gardener) who is willing to carefully fertilize and tend to the growth of the emotions, spirit and intellectual flora of the garden of a child's soul."
The committee's mission statement offers the view that adults who are "naturally, sensuously attracted to little girls and blossoming young women…will achieve full emancipation only by clothing their souls with a childlike personality and agreeing to 'play safe' with each other…"
Here visitors find "an oasis of shade" among the "refreshing waters of reason" where they are invited to "drink deeply of the exquisite delights to be found herein by Girl Lovers everywhere."
But "boy lovers" need not feel left out. At the Free Spirits website, visitors learn that "boylovers have not chosen of their free will to become so."
"It is an attraction most discover within themselves at a very early age," the site explains. "Through no action of their own, they find themselves considered horrible and vile. Most people who are attracted to minors try to live good lives but find no encouragement from a society and a press that labels all people with that attraction, whatever they do or don't do, as evil monsters," the web site says.
Developers of "BoyChat," the chat room at Free Spirits, admit it is not a place where "well-meaning social workers firmly guide people the way they think they ought to go."
BoyChat says it is run "by boylovers for boylovers." It encourages people posting on the website "to work freely through their own issues and questions."
Anonymity
The operators of both the Free Spirits and Girl-Love Garden websites are free to express their views because of the anonymity of the Internet. There are many other online sites catering to "MAAs" (minor-attracted adults, which some pedophiles prefer to call themselves).
Such websites claim to advocate for the civil rights and acceptance of "the most underserved and misunderstood sexual minority remaining in today's human society," according to the Free Spirits mission statement.
Along with chat rooms, these sites include members' galleries, where visitors find personal, historical and literary insights on loving children; and message boards where visitors may discuss issues involving the emotional, romantic and sexual relationships between children and adults.
'Legal'
According to Barry Maddox, spokesperson for the FBI's Baltimore, Md., office, the sites are "totally legal." Maddox told CNSNews.com the sites come close to breaking the law but do not break it."They've done their homework," Maddox said.
Pornographic images, literature or any other sexually explicit content are nowhere to be found on these sites.
"Girl Moments," or stories describing an encounter with a female adolescent that are "tasteful," "well-written," and focus on "friendships or other light-hearted encounters" are welcome at Girl-Love Garden, according to its frequently asked questions (FAQ) section. But it warns visitors not to "include details that evoke a prurient interest in sexual relations.
"Written materials that appear erotic or that advocate or counsel engaging in sexual activity with a minor constitutes a very serious offence" under the criminal codes of Canada, the U.S. and the United Kingdom, the FAQ warns, adding that "your material must be in full compliance with these laws so that when viewed with a prejudicial eye, they could not be seen as openly advocating, counseling, inducing, nor encouraging sexual intimacy with minors."
"We're only interested in those who act upon these impulses," Maddox said. While legal, he added, the sites "do make me sick to my stomach."
Ruben Rodriguez, director of the Exploited Children Unit at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, told CNSNews.com that while he likes the Internet, sites such as Free Spirits and Girl-Love Garden "have turned sections of it into a sewer."
"Many of these pedophiles act out on their impulses," Rodriguez said. "These kinds of sites are not something I would welcome."
Rodriguez said all the disclaimers and attempts at de-stigmatizing the "deviant sexual behavior" of pedophiles online are "just excuses" for them to "sit in front of a monitor and masturbate." He expressed "disgust" at the notion of society accepting pedophiles as another minority group.
"I see us sometimes going down a different path," Rodriguez said. "I don't see it getting better, I see it getting worse...going in a direction sometimes that just drives me crazy."
Some MAAs claiming to be Christians say they have found comfort at a website called Philia, which provides news and resources to religious support groups for adults who are attracted to minors. Philia, along with the Christian Boylove Forum (CBLF), are for those who "find themselves in the position of having no one to turn to who shares their faith as well as their sexual feelings.
"This (online message) board attempts to fill that gap by providing a friendly, safe place where we can be honest about our feelings and struggles with sexuality and faith, without fear of destructive criticism or harassment," the CBLF site states. "This is a place for mutual encouragement, support and advice as we seek to deal with our sexuality and society's reaction to it in responsible and healthy ways, to live out our lives with integrity and to express our faith in a way that honors God and demonstrates the love of Jesus Christ to all people."
Both sites are run by "Bach" - the screen name used to protect his identity - a boy lover who told CNSNews.com via e-mail that he has never acted upon his feelings and that he found support through a Christian service agency with which he volunteered.
"I am in a committed relationship with another man and have found that I am able to gain some satisfaction with this compromise," Bach wrote. "We discussed the fact that many message boards didn't allow for a Christian boylover to explore his faith in the context of his sexuality. We were often confronted with boylovers who had a strong hatred for the church, and we were constantly defending ourselves. This was the impetus to form the Christian Boylove Forum."
From CBLF sprung "Christian Consultations," "an annual gathering to bring together Christians (and some non-Christians) who are willing to enter into dialogue about adult attraction to minors," according to the Philia website.
"We have had involvement at the Christian Consultation from various pastors, Christian service workers, members of...Parents, Families and Friends of Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgendered Persons," Bach stated in the e-mail to CNSNews.com. "The goal of these encounters was to provide a non-threatening place for dialogue ...to help break isolation and fear.
"I would hope that Christians could come to accept that minor-attracted adults are not monsters, not sex maniacs, not uncontrolled freaks, but folks who have to live their lives with a desire that is demonized by society and the media to an extent that they are fearful to speak of it to anyone," Bach explained.
Julie Posey, a self-described "cyber-crime fighter" runs the website Pedowatch.org. Posey's website claims that "since 1996, she has passed on hundreds of tips to law enforcement involving child sexual predators who use the Internet as a tool to gain access to children who are later sexually assaulted and in rare instances murdered."
Posey is also the author of They Call Me Kendra, which Pedowatch.org describes as an autobiography of "her life experiences as a sexually abused child and tells how she later became one of the nation's leading experts on child sexual predators."
Kendra was the onscreen name Posey used to trap sexual predators online. She told CNSNews.com that Christian Consultation sounded a lot like prison ministers who work with convicted pedophiles.
"They go into prisons and try to help the families," Posey said. "They say, 'Oh, what your loved one did isn't so wrong...he has a love for boys,' and they try to get them (the family) to accept it. But they're trying to get all of society to just accept it, and it's unacceptable to me."
Posey said sites like Free Spirits and Girl-Love Garden are "just working to make their stories sound good.
"I read the North American Man Boy Lovers Association's manifesto one time, and they were like 'sex is actually good for kids,'...well, I can tell you it's not," Posey said. "If society doesn't get a grip right now - and even right now it's going to be difficult, they are definitely going to have the same rights that we have."
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I've made that point 294857 times, but people still insist homosexuality is "behavior". It isn't.
"There are plenty who just simply stop acting on their desire (for the same sex), but the underlying disease (of lusting after them) is still present."
I disagree with the "disease" part, but other than that I think you're probably correct.
Yes. There are bigots on both sides of the gay issue. No matter which side the bigot is on, the bigotry is equally evil.
No, it's reasonable thinking, since (if you check in scripter's links above and my reference to them) a MUCH larger perecentage of child molestations are committed by homosexuals than by heterosexuals. I don't mean the majority of molestations are same sex, but the numbers are roughly one third (depending on the study) and homosexuals are only about 2% if the population.
Qwerty, do you know that you are very pathetic? Check out the book scripter links to - subtitled something about overhauling straight America - I'll try to get back to it and link it - you MUST have read it. It's all in there, a book written by homo-activists. Your problem is you keep denying things that everyone, including homosexuals (especially homosexuals, since you guys thought it up and did it) KNOW are true.
It's like the Goebbles' "Big Lie" method that Clinton used - just keep denying the obvious truth until your dying day.
And repeated behavior reinforces the attraction, adds fuel to the fire so to speak. Here's an example - the mind (which basically just replays everything you've ever put it in, including all the movies watched, etc) comes up with a thought - an attraction, if you will. If you "entertain" the thought - the desire - meditate on it - read articles about it - look at pictures about it - go to chat rooms about it - etc etc - and then ACT on it - that's one path. Another path is this - the thought enters the mind, and you tell that thought - Get the F**k out of here! That's disgusting! And you don't focus on it, drool over it, etc or act on it.
Everyone's minds are full of all kinds of weird passing thoughts that they don't act on. That's called being a human being, instead of an animal.
There's a mistaken belief that if we don't act on our desires they will get stronger and stronger, so we have to "do" them to get them out of our system. The reverse is actually true - most desires will get weaker and weaker if we ignore them (especially unhealthy, abnormal or harmful ones, not normal ones like wanting to eat when you're stomach is empty). By ignoring a sick/unhleathy desire its power in the mind diminishes more and more and finally goes away when not acted upon or meditated upon.
Yeah, I know. I've read some of Remedy's stuff. I was trying to make a point to Lan.
Here it is, thanks to scripter:
That book was After the Ball: How America Will Conquer Its Fear and Hatred of Gays in the 1990s by Marshall Kirk and Hunter Madsen. Anybody can read an accurate summary of the book if they're interested. Both books are excellent reads.
He has a link a little back up the thread.
We could go around about this again, but you'd only fling more links. Thousands SAY they left the lifestyle, but how many continue to fantasize about gay sex? How many are actually "gay" to begin with?
Yes, thousands have left the homosexual lifestyle. From everything I've studied on this issue, there is no such thing as a homosexual, just homosexual behavior, so engaging in homosexual behavior is a choice. Everyone struggles with something in their life but not everyone acts on it. And acting on homosexuality is a choice some make.
Nobody said it was easy to leave the homosexual lifestyle, but it's possible as thousands have demonstrated.
I don't wish to "make" anything of it - I just want you to clarify yourself. Are you saying that to have mean unreasonable thoughts about someone is morally equivalent to being a pedophile - whether they just "think" about it, visit sick websites, advise others how to do it, and/or do it themselves?
In my view (reality) the two are like comparing stealing penny candy and robbing old ladies out of their life savings while beating them up. Both are crimes, but can't compare morally.
The fact that you feel I'm pathetic doesn't matter. You are still wrong, and your side has already lost.
"Check out the book scripter links to - subtitled something about overhauling straight America - you MUST have read it."
I never read it. I'm not sure why you think someone's book is speaking for all homosexuals.
"It's all in there, a book written by homo-activists. Your problem is you keep denying things that everyone,(especially homosexuals, since you guys thought it up and did it) KNOW are true."
You think that because a homosexual wrote a book, I know about it? Do you think we gather in underground caverns the first friday of every month after the art galleries close to discuss how we're going to rule the world?
"It's like the Goebbles' "Big Lie" method - just keep denying the obvious truth until your dying day."
Is that how you keep yourself from realizing that you're a conspiracy nut?
We also have the Catholic church turning a blind eye to homosexuals and pedaphiles. Now their is "religious" approval.
That is not for me to decide.
The bigots know who they are. The bigots know the coldness of their own hearts. The bigots' hatereds will lead them to lead lives that parallel their mean spirits. The bigots will face their ultimate judgements before God.
It's fine if you don't ping me. I get pinged anyway, usually.
"Unfortunately you continue to ignore the truths put forth on this forum."
No, I ignore the herd of propaganda links that you put forth. Big difference.
"From everything I've studied on this issue, there is no such thing as a homosexual, just homosexual behavior, so engaging in homosexual behavior is a choice."
Of course engaging in any behavior is a choice. It's the attraction you have no control over.
"Nobody said it was easy to leave the homosexual lifestyle, but it's possible as thousands have demonstrated."
How many go BACK to the homosexual lifestyle? Thousands might have stopped acting on their impulses (probably most of them only temporarily), or perhaps were straight to begin with.... but this doesn't prove that you can ever stop being a homosexual.
Of course, even if I could leave it I wouldn't. But that's another issue entirely.
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