Trump's yearslong crusade against Ukraine has finally come home to roost as Republicans call for abandoning Kyiv

In a phone call with Ukraine's president this month, US President Joe Biden pledged continued solidarity with Ukraine as it battles Russia's military invasion and illegal annexation of Ukrainian territory.

But that level of support could be in jeopardy if the GOP gains control of the House of Representatives in this year's midterm elections.

In April, 10 House Republicans voted against a bill allowing the Biden administration to more easily lend military equipment to Ukraine. The following month, 57 House Republicans voted "no" on a nearly $40 billion aid package for Ukraine. Both measures ultimately passed the chamber.

Like I said, there's plenty of money for national defense if we put an end to Democrats’ corrupt vote-buying schemes.

There is NO MONEY when a country is borrowing over a Trillion dollars every year to meet their spending requirements, which we are.
Can you get that into your head?

As for Ukraine being allegedly “super corrupt”, I've seen no evidence they are even a bit more corrupt than our own politicians, and lots of evidence that Ukrainians as a people are both less corrupt and more courageous than Russians.

Ukraine IS corrupt. Read about Hunter Biden's laptop.
As for we having corruption in America too, well we are not getting tens of billions of free dollars from anybody.
Ukraine IS getting tens of billions from America.
Who pays the piper calls the tune.

Everything to do with 1938 Chamberlain in Munich if we abandon Ukraine to its fate as Chamberlain did to Czechoslovakia.

Tell that to the Europeans. Let them defend and take care of themselves for a change.

xactly right — we helped out the Brits for exactly the same reasons we now help the Ukes

Don't even think of comparing Ukraine to Britain.
We've had strong relationship with Britain for hundreds of years.
Britain was the mother country of America. We speak English and our judiciary, goverment, laws etc are based on the British ones.
We have no historical relationship with Ukraine.

We will certainly burn in h*ll — in this world as well as the next — if we let the naked aggressions of madman Putin & others succeed and feed on their past successes to launch yet more aggressions.

They have to be stopped — somewhere, sometime, somehow, or the next ones will be bigger and harder to stop.

Nobody's stopping the hapless Europeans from “saving” Ukraine if they can.
They can go ahead and save Ukraine if they want, JUST NOT AT OUR EXPENSE!

That's the lesson of history.
Learn it or die.

What history do you have of a nuclear war between the world's # 1 and # 2 nuclear powers?

SmokingJoe: "Every country is free to fight all the wars they want, but we DON'T have to pay for every foreign war fought by tinpot, woke dictators like Zelensky, who has banned all the big opposition parties in parliament and taken over all he big media."

Normal wartime measures, in both World Wars the US took similar measures, however, only pro-Russian political parties are banned.
Ten pro-Ukrainian political parties hold elected seats in Ukraine's parliament.
Servant of the People holds 254 seats of 423 total.

SmokingJoe: "Ukraine can fight all the wars they want, as long as the whiny Zelensky doesn't keep DEMANDING that we pat for his wars"

Where does that word DEMANDING come from?
It's ridiculous -- Ukraine can only request, they can't "demand" anything.
But Americans, Europeans and many others appreciate & admire Ukrainians' courage, tenacity & skill in defeating madman Putin's naked aggression.

That makes it relatively easy for Ukraine to sell their cause to democratic governments.

SmokingJoe: "So tell me, just how many billions of free dollars did we receive from these “foreign friends” you are so fond of? Answer? ZERO dollars."

In the US Revolutionary War, military and financial aid from France, Spain, the Netherlands and others was decisive in American victory -- arguably, the value of foreign warships, troops, weapons, equipment and money contributed about 1/3 to the US war effort.

In 1941, early in the Second World War US planners expected the Soviet Union to be defeated and the US to carry the burden of defeating Nazi Germany.
Planners expected the US to need 250 Army divisions for the job.
But the Soviets stayed in the fight, suffered millions of casualties and their efforts reduced the need for US divisions from 250 to just over 100.
Of course we helped them out, but 150 divisions we didn't have to raise, equip, train, transport & support with logistics and medical care over 2,000,000 men -- those were worth a lot to us.
That's why we had allies.

SmokingJoe: "But then we spent over a Trillion dollars and lost plenty of lives fighting wars to punish those who attacked us.
I don't recall us getting any free money from Germany or France or anybody then. "

Of course, we did, in the past 100+ years we've never fought a major war without allies, and that especially includes the Cold War which was all about standing strong with our allies to deter Soviet expansionism.

SmokingJoe: "These European countries are much older than America is, why the heck do we have to constantly pay for their wars they they get into?"

All of them have allied with us at one time or another in our past wars, and they're all helping to support Ukraine now.

SmokingJoe: "We are in debt to the tune of $31 Trillion.
Adding in social security makes it even worse.
We are running deficits of Trillions of dollars every year.
Do we ave money to waste on Ukraine right now?
Nope."

Of course, I've pointed out before the fact that there's plenty of money for a robust national defense, as soon as we eliminate squandering $trillions on corrupt Democrat vote-buying schemes.

SmokingJoe: "Not to mention Ukraine is not and has never been an ally of the United Sates.
They are not part of NATO or any defense organization we belong to.
Right now, this is just a way for the "Big Guy" to get his normal 10%.
Ukraine is not and has never been our responsibility.
Let them go to their Europeans pals to look after them if they must beg for money and arms from somewhere."

Yes, we did make a formal committment to Ukraine, in 1994, the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances says, in part:

"1. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to Ukraine, in accordance with the principles of the Final Act of the Conference on Security and Cooperation in Europe, to respect the independence and sovereignty and the existing borders of Ukraine.

2. The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their obligation to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine, and that none of their weapons will ever be used against Ukraine except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations..."

Ukrainians believed the promises we gave in 1994 and so gave up their nuclear weapons.
We were there at the beginning, we should be there now.

SmokingJoe: "There is NO MONEY when a country is borrowing over a Trillion dollars every year to meet their spending requirements, which we are.
Can you get that into your head?"

Sure, you can lie about it all you wish, day and night, 24 hours a day you can lie, but the truth remains just what I said: there's plenty of money for a robust national defense as soon as we stop squandering it on corrupt Democrat vote-buying schemes.

Can you get that into your head?

SmokingJoe: "Ukraine IS corrupt.
Read about Hunter Biden's laptop."

Hunter Biden's laptop means Hunter Biden is corrupt, plus his family, plus the FBI which protects them from justice.
It may also mean there are some corrupt Ukrainians.

It does not mean that either the entire US or the entire Ukraine are corrupt.
Good people still have to do the right things, regardless of some corruption.

SmokingJoe: "As for we having corruption in America too, well we are not getting tens of billions of free dollars from anybody.
Ukraine IS getting tens of billions from America.
Who pays the piper calls the tune."

Republicans like Rand Paul and Jim Jordan voted against aid to Ukraine precisely because they didn't believe we'd put adequate controls to prevent misuse of our aid to Ukraine.
I think they're exactly right about it -- we should have strong controls to prevent misuse & corruption.
And we will when Republicans take charge.
In the mean time, Ukraine still has a war to fight and we need to help them, just as other countries helped us in our Revolutionary War.

Did you forget about that?

SmokingJoe: "Europeans should pay for ALL their wars themselves IN FULL.
They cannot keep sucking on the American teat forever.
Enough is enough already!"

Madman Putin's invasion of Ukraine is the direct result of Biden's disgraceful skedaddle from Afghanistan.
Insane Putin sanely realized he'd never have a better opportunity to do what he wanted -- certainly never while Trump is in office.
So Biden's weakness and stupidity are the immediate causes of madman Putin's invasion.
In 1994 we signed the Budapest Memorandum promises to Ukraine, then in 2021 our weakness provoked madman Putin to invade.

So, yes, we are at least partly responsible and need to help as best we can.

SmokingJoe: "We ave had budget deficits for DECADES so whats so great about Germany having any deficit this year (if they get a deficit at all)."

I merely answered your question -- I'm no expert on German budget deficits, but will hazard to guess they'll have one this year.
You asked the question, that's my answer.

SmokingJoe: "Tell that to the Europeans.
Let them defend and take care of themselves for a change."

N.A.T.O. makes us part of Europe, the size of our contributions makes us the leader.
If we walk away from Ukraine & Europe after promising support, then our skedaddle from Afghanistan will seem like child's play in a sandbox compared to the disaster we'll leave in Europe.

It would not be good.

SmokingJoe: "Don't even think of comparing Ukraine to Britain.
We've had strong relationship with Britain for hundreds of years.
Britain was the mother country of America. We speak English and our judiciary, goverment, laws etc are based on the British ones.
We have no historical relationship with Ukraine."

"You know nothing, Jon Snow!"
We fought two major wars against the Brits -- they burned down Washington, DC!
Sure, you may think that's a great thing, all to the Brits credit!!
But the truth is God Himself thought enough of us in those days to send a hurricane to put out the fires the Brits had set in DC.

Plus, a lot wealthy Brits favored the Confederacy in the Civil War -- did what they could to support the South, would have been happy to see Confederates win.
So they were not always our friends, and when we went into the First World War, it wasn't so much to support the Brits, whom we still didn't much like, as to support the French, whom we loved -- "Layfayette, we are here!"

Our promises to Ukraine began with the 1994 Budapest Memorandum.
Unlike Britain, we've never fought a war against Ukraine.

SmokingJoe: "Nobody's stopping the hapless Europeans from “saving” Ukraine if they can.
They can go ahead and save Ukraine if they want, JUST NOT AT OUR EXPENSE!"

We (Obama & Biden) are as responsible as any for madman Putin's invasions.
Our pathetic weakness in Afghanistan provoked Putin.
We will not like the results if we don't help stop him.

SmokingJoe: "What history do you have of a nuclear war between the world's # 1 and # 2 nuclear powers?"

I served in Germany during the Cold War, while madman Putin was still a student at Leningrad University.
Soviets threatened us with nukes and massive tank armies.
We stood strong, and they never moved beyond their post war borders.
The name of our doctrine was MAD. It still is.

N.A.T.O. makes us part of Europe,

Nope.
Not even close.
Check the map.

the size of our contributions makes us the leader.

That's the problem right there.
We have no business making massive, out of whack, totally far above proportion contributions to a bunch of the richest continent on the planet, even as Germany continues to register nice budget surpluses even as we work ourselves into great debt and poverty for big chunks of our propulsion.
Check the homeless camps in San Francisco etc.
NATO should have been banned or massively reduced after the Warsaw Pact was desolved.

If we walk away from Ukraine & Europe after promising support, then our skedaddle from Afghanistan will seem like child's play in a sandbox compared to the disaster we'll leave in Europe.

We HAVE to stop pouring borrowed money into Ukraine pit hole.
We have ZERO responsibility for the corrupt, sleazy , woke Ukraine regime.
Let the Europeans take care of their own messes.
We've spent too much money fighting wars to protect Europe.
They have plenty of money now. Let them look after themselves now for a change.

Plus, a lot wealthy Brits favored the Confederacy in the Civil War — did what they could to support the South, would have been happy to see Confederates win.

And the problem is?
A big chunk of the American population supported the south.
And it was the British who actually BANNED slavery long before America did and sent their warships to stop slave ships costing thousands of British lives.
Slavery was going to end in America sooner or later anyways, with or without the Civil War. The economic model based on cotton stopped being viable long ago.
You are not going to be successful pushing far left nonsense that the south was full of evil people.
They were not.

So they were not always our friends, and when we went into the First World War, it wasn't so much to support the Brits, whom we still didn't much like, as to support the French, whom we loved — “Layfayette, we are here!”

Look at the history of Europe or Africa or Asia or anywhere. else
France has fought plenty of wars against Germany. Britain has fought plenty of wars against Spain etc etc.
Europeans history is full of the countries fighting against each other going back centuries.
Its no big deal we fought wars against the British,
We fought against Spain too at one time or another.
How do you think we came to posses Florida?

Our promises to Ukraine began with the 1994 Budapest Memorandum.

We did NOT make any promises defend to Ukraine in the 1994 Budapest Memorandum.

We (Obama & Biden) are as responsible as any for madman Putin's invasions.
Our pathetic weakness in Afghanistan provoked Putin.
We will not like the results if we don't help stop him.

Biden screwed up the withdrawal from Afghanistan yes,
so let Obama and Biden use some of the vast amounts of money they have stolen to defend Ukraine then.

First of all, Russia is not the same as the Soviet Union.
Second point is, Ukraine was part of the Soviet Union. You forgot to mention that didn't ya?
And third, I don;t remember Brezhnev etc threatening unclear war against Germany etc.
Russia has had nukes almost as long as we have and we have fought plenty pf proxy wars against them including Vietnam, Korea, Angola, Mozambique etc. The Russians have never threateneded to use nukes n any of those wars.

Normal wartime measures, in both World Wars the US took similar measures,

Nope.
The main parties are the Republicans and the Democrats, neither of which were banned in WWI or WW II.
Lincoln was Republican , and he never even came close to banning the Democratic Party during the nasty, bloody Civil way.
You can't go about banning opposition parties just because there is a war.

Where does that word DEMANDING come from?

Tucker Carlson Blasts Zelensky for Demanding American Money

Carlson called Zelensky an “uppity foreigner” after watching the clip during which Zelensky delcared how much he would need from the US. Zelensky has previously said that his country requires $7 billion a month in aid, not including the “hundreds of billions of dollars” he said would be required to rebuild the country after the war, reports BBC News.

“What?” Carlson said incredulously. “Some uppity foreigner in a t-shirt demanding money for his ‘critical economic needs.’ We have critical economic needs too, buddy. Who are you, troll? Go away. What? Since when does that guy have a claim on our treasury,” Carlson asked.

Carlson compared Zelensky’s demands to a spoiled child with a Christmas list. “Really? Up yours, buddy,” Carlson said.

https://noqreport.com/2022/10/14/breaking-tucker-carlson-blasts-zelensky-for-demanding-american-money/

BJK: "N.A.T.O. makes us part of Europe,"

SmokingJoe: "Nope.
Not even close.
Check the map."

Here's the map of NATO. You might notice NATO includes Alaska::

SmokingJoe: "That's the problem right there.
We have no business making massive, out of whack, totally far above proportion contributions to a bunch of the richest continent on the planet, even as Germany continues to register nice budget surpluses even as we work ourselves into great debt and poverty for big chunks of our propulsion."

So here are the real numbers -- US GDP (nominal) is six times larger than Germany's.
In 2020 Germany's federal budget deficit was around $225 billion -- in US terms that's about $1.4 trillion.
In 2021 Germany ran a federal budget deficit of $180 billion -- in US terms that's $1.1 trillion.
In 2022 Germans expect their deficit to total $90 billion -- over $half a trillion in US terms.

The US federal deficit was $2.8 trillion in 2021, projected at $1.4 trillion in 2022.
Future US deficits are projected to average around $1.8 trillion.

Bottom line: Germany, like many other countries has been running very large budget deficits since 2020.

SmokingJoe: "Check the homeless camps in San Francisco etc.
NATO should have been banned or massively reduced after the Warsaw Pact was desolved."

Homeless camps in San Francisco are a function of local and California state politics, they have nothing to do with Federal budgets.

NATO, by my count, since 1990 has conducted 20 operations in 14 countries and seas, including: Serbia, Bosnia, Adriatic Sea (blockade) Yugoslavia, Herzegovina, Kosovo, Northern Macedonia, USA airspace (after 9/11/2001), Mediterranean Sea (WOT), Afghanistan, Turkey (air defense), Pakistan (humanitarian), Indian Ocean (anti-pirates) and Libya (no-fly zone).
All were multinational operations, most in response to UN resolutions.
Iraq included both NATO and non-nation allies.

Since 1949 NATO has expanded 10 times, five of those since 1991.
Every expansion has been voluntary:

SmokingJoe: "We HAVE to stop pouring borrowed money into Ukraine pit hole.
We have ZERO responsibility for the corrupt, sleazy , woke Ukraine regime."

Our responsibility comes as a signatory to the 1994 Budapest Memorandum, as the leader of NATO and, arguably since it was our inexcusable weakness in the Afghanistan skedaddle which directly provoked madman Putin's invasion -- we helped make it and break it, we should help fix it.

Your words, "corrupt, sleazy, woke" certainly define the Biden administration and madman Putin's dictatorship in Russia.
I've seen no evidence those words describe anybody in Ukraine.

SmokingJoe: "Let the Europeans take care of their own messes.
We've spent too much money fighting wars to protect Europe.
They have plenty of money now.
Let them look after themselves now for a change."

By my count Europeans have contributed about 40% of total aid to Ukraine.
That roughly corresponds to the EU GDP compared to the USA GDP.

The US would be foolish beyond all foolishness to scrap our NATO alliance at a time when it most serves our interests in blocking madman Putin's imperialist ambitions in Ukraine.
Sorry, I know our leaders are abjectly stupid, but even they are not that stupid, FRiend.

SmokingJoe: "And we fought big wars against Mexico, Japan and Canada and Germany too.
That doesn’t mean we want to fight wasr against those countries today does it?"

But we have never fought a war against Ukraine, and yet you want us to treat them like enemies.
What's up with that?

SmokingJoe: "It would be a good thing if DC had remained burned to the ground then.
DC is about the biggest source of evil in America right now."

Ha! Sadly, I agree with you, more than you know.
Occasionally we see suggestions for splitting up Federal government departments & agencies among the various states, such that none would benefit or pay more than the others.
Worth considering...

SmokingJoe: "Slavery was going to end in America sooner or later anyways, with or without the Civil War.
The economic model based on cotton stopped being viable long ago.
You are not going to be successful pushing far left nonsense that the south was full of evil people.
They were not."

No Confederate alive in 1860 was ever going to allow abolition in the Confederacy -- the Confederate constitution made that certain.
The "economic model based on cotton" in 1860 was the biggest single industry in the US, accounting for roughly 50% of US exports and employing at least half of US slaves.
Even today cotton continues as a major Southern product, though no longer the dominant economic factor it was back then.

For centuries the South was full of Democrats and Democrats are, by their nature, evil -- back then, just as today.
Jim Crow, black codes, KKK, effective nullification of the 13th, 14th & 15th Amendments are the kinds of things Democrats do when they have unlimited political power.

Sorry if you don't like that, but it is what it is.

SmokingJoe: "Its no big deal we fought wars against the British, We fought against Spain too at one time or another."

And yet, we've never fought a war against Ukraine, but you still want to treat them like enemies.
What's up with that?

SmokingJoe: "We did NOT make any promises defend to Ukraine in the 1994 Budapest Memorandum."

Of course, we did! Read it.
Based on our promises, Ukraine voluntarily gave up its nuclear weapons.
So that was one h*ll of a promise.

SmokingJoe: "Biden screwed up the withdrawal from Afghanistan yes, so let Obama and Biden use some of the vast amounts of money they have stolen to defend Ukraine then."

Ha! Another great suggestion! I'd vote for that in a heartbeat. ;-)

SmokingJoe: "First of all, Russia is not the same as the Soviet Union.
Second point is, Ukraine was part of the Soviet Union.
You forgot to mention that didn't ya?"

Ukraine was re-conquered & imprisoned by the Soviets in 1921.
In the 1930s Soviets practiced genocide against Ukraine -- the Holodomor killed millions in Ukraine.
So I would never hold Ukrainians responsible for what insane Soviets did.

SmokingJoe: "And third, I don;t remember Brezhnev etc threatening unclear war against Germany etc.
Russia has had nukes almost as long as we have and we have fought plenty pf proxy wars against them including Vietnam, Korea, Angola, Mozambique etc.
The Russians have never threateneded to use nukes n any of those wars."

"You know nothing, Jon Snow."

The Cold War was all about the Soviet threat to use its nukes if provoked.
And the Soviets had multiple nuclear warheads for every one of ours, everything from relatively "low-yield" short-range tactical nukes to the big intercontinental ballistic missiles with warheads yielding many megaton explosions.

And those nukes didn't just disappear when the Cold War ended -- all they did was flip a switch on each from "on" to "off", that's all.
They were still capable whenever the switches were flipped back again from "off" to "on".

M.A.D. = "Mutually Assured Destruction", look it up.

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