Posted on 02/06/2017 1:23:41 PM PST by cotton1706
The Utah House called Friday for a convention of the states to consider new amendments to the U.S. Constitution, which supporters said is the only way to rein in an out-of-control federal government.
It passed HJR3 on a 45-29 vote, and sent it to the Senate for consideration.
The resolution calls for a convention that would consider amendments to "impose fiscal restraints on the federal government, limit the power and jurisdiction of the federal government, and limit the terms of office for its officials and for members of Congress."
"We are in jeopardy of losing our republic," said HJR3's sponsor, Rep. Merrill Nelson, R-Grantsville. "States are no longer equals in our government. States must be restored to their roles as sovereign, equal partners."
(Excerpt) Read more at sltrib.com ...
No one is proposing a Constitutional Convention.
What is being called is a Convention for proposing Amendments
What is be proposed is a convention of the states to propose a select list of propose amendments. The delegates would be limited by law to vote on those specific amendments.
All of the states proposing the Convention of the States would agree to that slate before ever agreeing to the convention.
This is the usual boilerplate that I append to these threads. It's intended for those who don't understand the Article V process and who are unaware of what is being done behind the scenes to make a Convention of the States both successful and restricted to Georgia's application language.
***
The amendatory process under Article V consists of three steps: Proposal, Disposal, and Ratification.
Proposal:
There are two ways to propose an amendment to the Constitution.
Article V gives Congress and an Amendments Convention exactly the same power to propose amendments, no more and no less.
Disposal:
Once Congress, or an Amendments Convention, proposes amendments, Congress must decide whether the states will ratify by the:
The State Ratifying Convention Method has only been used twice: once to ratify the Constitution, and once to ratify the 21st Amendment repealing Prohibition.
Ratification:
Depending upon which ratification method is chosen by Congress, either the state legislatures vote up-or-down on the proposed amendment, or the voters elect a state ratifying convention to vote up-or-down. If three-quarters of the states vote to ratify, the amendment becomes part of the Constitution.
Forbidden Subjects:
Article V contains two explicitly forbidden subjects and one implicitly forbidden subject.
Explicitly forbidden:
Implicitly forbidden:
Reference works:
Frequently Asked Questions About a Convention of the States
Proposing Constitutional Amendments by a Convention of the States: A Handbook for State Lawmakers
State Initiation of Constitutional Amendments: A Guide for Lawyers and Legislative Drafters
Thank you for your explanation, and I apologize for terming it a Constitutional Convention, when it is a Convention of the State’s.
I’m not in favor of it. Some day I may change my mind, but I haven’t up until now.
I don’t think your opinion is wildly off base. I am not comfortable when it comes to amending the constitution in this manner.
I can’t always be right, but this is my take on it for now.
You are so absolutely right! A states convention is so rarely understood by most Americans. It means that our Congress in Washington DC cannot interfere but the states themselves can change things term limits or not term limits and lots of other things can be discussed!
You are so absolutely right! A states convention is so rarely understood by most Americans. It means that our Congress in Washington DC cannot interfere but the states themselves can change things term limits or not term limits and lots of other things can be discussed!
I see the house and senate full of republicans who are scared shipless to do anything when the Soros based news attacks them. They as well as state politicians are craven cowards who go whatever way the wind blows or the dollars flow.
We can only thank Trump for the courage to do what he says he would do. I don’t see many politicians who have done that of late. Or ever, for that matter, since I can remember save for Reagan
Bills being submitted to relinquish federal power to states or to establish term limits or control federal spending are not going to happen from the federal legislature. They WANT the power and control or they wouldn’t be there. More rights to states lessens the power of those very guys who would have to pass the legislation.
Yeah, there are a few good guys in office. But even the conservative legislators are there for the power. Can’t be avoided. Not enough self-sacrificing dudes to make it happen.
Why are you against using the Constitutional method laid out for the benefit of states? Honest question as I don’t understand.
I just read your reply to another person. It answered my question.
Imho, we must always be very judicious with respect to the United States Constitution. We must always protect and defend the original intent of it, as a treasured and irreplaceable document that has allowed us to hold our hopes, our dreams and protects us from harm. This is no limp-wristed promise. Our Founding Fathers realized and accepted the retribution that might follow them when they determined to begin this revolution and we must not disappoint them.
I do not have confidence in this not being hijacked.
I do not trust Republicans or Democrats these days.
There have been so many times when I have had some new grand plan explained to me, only to watch it go South.
I do not trust the process with so many people not being who they represent themselves to be.
I responded before I read this.
I respect your alternate opinion her.
Take care.
For those who think the Article V process is too risky, I ask, "What other options do you see?"
To summarize from a previous post by GraceG:
1. Elect More Republicans - Failed due to RINO/Uni-party confluence.
2. Article V Convention of States to propose Amendments - Needed to try to take power from the federal government back to the states and reel in the federal leviathan.
3. State Nullification - Last ditch effort to try to take power back from the federal monster, though by this point it may be too late.
4. State Secession - Could either end up peaceably like the breakup of the Czechoslovakia in 1993 or a brutal:
5. Civil War II like the first one.... The longer we wait on #2, the more likely #3, then #4 and finally #5. .
So, do we do nothing and just wait for # 5?
Quick review: We need 34 states to pass an application, then Congress shall, by law, call a Convention of States as soon as it receives applications from 2/3 of the State Legislatures. That's 34 states. As of right now, there are 8 states that have applied using the Georgia language: AL, AK, FL, GA, IN, LA, OK, TN and 36 state legislative chambers or bodies have filed or passed resolutions. Amendments are proposed and voted on at the convention. Each Amendment must be ratified by 3/4 of the states in order to become part of the US Constitution. That's 38 states.
There are multiple arguments against a COS. Do not be dissuaded. In reality, there are so many checks and balances against a runaway convention that the risk is near zero. As nathanbefored said, “It requires only 13 statehouse legislatures from 13 different states out of 99 legislatures in 50 states to block an amendment. The problem is not a runaway convention, the problem is getting any amendment through."
"There are far more political and legal constraints on a runaway convention than on a runaway Congress." - Robert Natelson
Most FReepers are aware of these links, but I post anyway for review and for people new to Article V. It is our responsibility to make Article V the most understood aspect of the US Constitution.
****Please see this summary video from Alabama first: Convention of States - Alabama Way to go Alabama! A great introduction!
***Another good introduction video Convention of States: The Plan to Restore America
***For the Young People Overview of the COS Project at Washington Freedom Summit Laura Fennig, a COS Grassroots Coordinator, describes the COS Project plan and how you can get involved!
Rep. Bill Taylor introduces a Convention of States
Convention of States Live! with Mike Farris
The Case for an Article V Convention. Great explanation of an Article V convention to the Massachusetts State Legislature.
**** Convention of States Lots of information here.
**** Article V Blog by Jacquerie. Excellent and worth following.
**** Mark Levin, Constitution Article V, and the Liberty Amendments A great overview of Article V.
Learn about the Convention of States The Problem, the Solution and the Strategy
Call a Convention A call for a Convention of States
Missouri state senator delivers amazing testimony (video) Reasoned speech on why we need an Article V Convention.
Article V Project to Restore Liberty Another good source.
Mark Levin’s Liberty Amendments: Introduction
Mark Levin’s Liberty Amendments: The Federalist I
Mark Levin’s Liberty Amendments: The Federalist II
Mark Levin’s Liberty Amendments: Part IV
Cultural Marxism and the need for an Article V COS by Hostage
Convention of States model Resolution
A Summary of Mark Levin’s Proposed Amendments by Jacquerie
Chapter 1 of Mark Levin’s Book, The Liberty Amendments
Mark Levin, Constitution Article V, and the Liberty Amendments
Mark Levin: "The Liberty Amendments" - Complete Sean Hannity Special + other Links
List of Mark Levin You Tube Videos
Citizens for Self-Governance: Convention of States Project Youtube hub - Lots of educational videos here
Mark Levin Article V, Liberty Amendments youtube video hub
Three hour video of C-Span interview with Mark Levin
*** Mark Levin's ALEC Speech, Dec 4, 2014
Gaining Steam? Nearly 100 Lawmakers Descend on Mount Vernon to Talk Convention of States The beginning.
Curing Federal Dysfunction by Constitutional Amendment: A Primer Professor Rob Natelson
Our American Constitution, Article V Rob Natelson's Article V articles
We can fight the uniparty! States, the Natural Second Party by Jacquerie
Convention to Propose Amendments to the United States Constitution
The Other Way to Amend the Constitution: The Article V Constitutional Convention Amendment Process
Friends of Article V Convention Links
The Indiana Statute that will Govern their Delegates
Congress' Present Duty to Call a Convention:
Congress' Present Duty to Call a Convention. (Part I)
Congress' Present Duty to Call a convention. (Part II)
Congress' Present Duty to Call a Convention. (Part III)
Congress' Present Duty to Call a Convention. (Part IV)
Congress' Present Duty to Call a Convention. (Part V)
Congress' Failure to Call an Amendments Convention. (Part VI)
The 17th Amendment – A Mistake That Keeps on Giving
Ulysses at the Mast: Democracy, Federalism, and the Sirens' Song of the Seventeenth Amendment by Jay Bybee. Repeal the 17th! Shorter Abstract here: Ulysses at the Mast, one page Abstract
****For those of you that still have doubts about the Article V process, please review: Responses To Convention Of States Opposition My initial concerns were resolved after reading these articles. My attitude now is Go For It!
Sarah Palin: Debunking the myths of a Convention of States
A Single-Subject Convention Addresses the "runaway convention" fear.
John Birch Society Denies Its History and Betrays Its Mission The original Birchers were for an Article V Convention.
Publius Huldah vs. Article V: Introduction by Rodney Dodsworth
Update: Convention of States by the numbers The current State count
Convention of States Gaining Momentum
Assembly of State Legislatures – Article V
***Indiana Statute - Duties of Article V Convention Delegates A good example for other states and one of the safeguards.
****Proposing Constitutional Amendments by a Convention of States - An Article V Handbook for State Legislators An important resource.
****State Initiation of Constitutional Amendments: A Guide for Lawyers and Legislative Drafters The Bible on Convention of States
**** State Legislators Article V Caucus State Legislators, Join up at this site!
Most State Legislatures are in session now. Send this list of links to your State Representatives and Senators here: Contact your State Legislators.
Sample Letter to state Representatives regarding the Convention of States Project and also, Talking Points.
Excellent Article V Letter to a State Assemblyman by Jacquerie
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." - Edmund Burke.
Let’s all work together to get this going!
If we don’t soon reform our institutions, especially the senate, another Hillary will eventually win the White House and complete what Obama began.
Roger that!
This is exactly the reason I think it's important to push through with an Article V Convention of States. If we want to continue to support President Trump in following through with his promises to us an Article V Convention is a terrific vehicle. Bypass the Soros bought and Soros skeered Congress and convene a Convention of States.
Even if only an amendment repealing the 17th Amendment were passed it would assert more rights to states. Or term limits. No way Congress is going to pass term limits for themselves. It's one of the items in Trump's 100 day list. How can he do that without our help? McConnell already said that's not on the table.
I understand that explanation. Thank you for replying. I do agree with you about the number of primrose paths we’ve seen.
I just differ, and respect your point, I see this as maybe my last Constitutional chance to leave some liberty to my grandkids. They are why I’m fighting so hard for the Article V Convention. Maybe a pipe dream, but the best one I see for their future at present.
There’s Yuuuge difference between congress and state legislatures. The former is a full-time job with the promise of post-congressional K Street wealth. Most state legislatures are part time gigs. Men and women, business owners, or with full time jobs typically have to sacrifice A LOT when they attend 90 or 120 day legislative sessions.
State legislators, being on the receiving end of the feds, can, in very little way be compared to congress.
Art, you are a peach for keeping this info readily at hand :)
I’ve got so much of this information you, Publius, hostage, jacquerie and nathanbedford have posted printed out and in my briefcase that you should have each gotten credit for the times I’ve driven down to Austin and spoken with legislators.
I think you came up with a good attempt at a great post.
Thanks.
I haven’t read it all. I understand the premise for this. I remain opposed, but if it does proceed I won’t be entirely surprised by a pleasant outcome. I wouldn’t be surprised if it goes South either, and that’s my problem with it,
Under 1.
1. Elect More Republicans - Failed due to RINO/Uni-party confluence.
Why is it that some folks can grasp this problem so clearly at the federal level, and yet fail to recognize the problem at the state level?
Are we really going to kid ourselves that RINOs only exist in Washington, D.C.?
Do terms like Country Club Republicans and Chamber of Commerce Republicans ring any bells?
Aren’t these the Bush acolytes that support open borders?
Aren’t these the friends of Rove, the GOPe, and the globalist movement?
These are state level and lower wonks, that oppose us on many issues.
Do I have confidence that state level people made up from this group will do the right thing?
Does anyone here remember how the caucuses were run in 2016?
I rest my case.
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