A US Default Would Be The Financial Equivalent Of This Painting Of Hell

TBI ^ | 1-14-2013 | Brett LoGiurato

[blam]

A US Default Would Be The Financial Equivalent Of This Painting Of Hell

Brett LoGiurato
January 14, 2013

Earlier today, President Barack Obama almost dared Republicans to not increase the nation's borrowing limit in a White House press conference.

"If Congressional Republicans refuse to pay America’s bills on time, Social Security checks, veterans benefits will be delayed," Obama said. "... Investors around the world will ask if the United States of America is in fact a safe bet. Markets could go haywire. Interest rates would spike for anyone who borrowed money."

One analyst — Michael Feroli, the chief economist at JP Morgan — speculated what such a situation might look like, specifically if the U.S. missed a payment to bondholders.

It “would be like the financial market equivalent of that Hieronymus Bosch painting of hell,” Feroli told the Washington Post.

The painting is titled "The Garden of Earthly Delights" and is believed to have been painted by Bosch sometime between 1490 and 1510.

Here's what that painting looks like. The far right panel is the "hellscape."

[abb]

And to that he said?

We began talking about fishing...

[Freedom4US]

Gentlemen...

I noticed one can get the same treatment when cashing savings bonds even with an account! It is true that savings bonds can be cashed anywhere, but they don’t like it because of the time involved even if you have an account. Even if not a customer, they are probably compensated tho not much, by Treasury or something. They are required yes, tho a stack of bonds can take a half hour? It’s nice to call them ahead of time, too - even tho I had an account (checking) it was still a hassle with all that. And paper bonds have no longer been issued it’s electronic ledger book entries only. It can only get worse as time goes by and they are less common. In order to purchase bonds (and notes and bills and other things like TIPS) one has to open a Treasury account. And then you can head back to your friendly bank, because it has to be done in person iirc!

The teller even put a one day hold before the deposit could be transferred to another named account? Get this, I had cash in hand, and if I had thought of it at the time I would have re-deposited some of the cash directly into the account! I was pondering a 1 day hold on Savings Bonds, I guess.

Pretty much all banks and institutions are not keen on doing anything financial unless one is a customer i.e. has an account. That’s not news.

[FredZarguna]

So, who was the federal employee?

From the post, which apparently you did not read very well: "... and their various running dogs ..."

[Sequoyah101]

Good and good choice.

South of I-10, “You can eat that!”

North of I-10, last words, “Watch this!”

[Wuli]

Only Obama can “default” on U,S, debt obligations and not raising the debt ceiling limit does not require, does not mandate any default; in fact, Constitutionally Obama is required to first cut federal spending ANTWHERE BUT what must be paid on federal debt obligations.

There is more than enough revenue to pay our debt obligations and to pay for some other things. Obama wants to spend as he has spent since 2009 without compromise.

Congress is not morally or Constitutionally required to NOT demand he compromise.

[Lancey Howard]

Michael Connelly BUMP!

[dalereed]

Bring on default and depression!

Keep the government totally out of any recovery attempt!

All the leaches living on credit will be wiped out and recovery will happen within a year just like it did in 1920.

If obama stickes his mulatto illegal alien nose into it the depression will last 12 years just like 1929 when Roosevwelt screwed everything up!!

[muawiyah]

There is no Bank of the United States ~ Jackson won that bottle ~ recall? So, no, bankers aren’t gub’mnt employees, and their running dog lackeys are all other bankers. A federale would kick their teeth in ~ not the other way around, and we are not talking about the gub’mnt under the Chicago street thugs of course.

[FredZarguna]

You really can’t read, can you?

[muawiyah]

So, what federal employee is involved in the decision by the bank to cash your bonds? The law allows them a certain amount of time to verify that they are legitimate, and to go through the process of matching them up with the rates over the various periods.

Do you imagine the federal employees ~ whoever they are in this ~ which isn't clear at all ~ should CRUSH THE BANKS under their jack boot heels and make the bank do it instantly?

Seriously, are your rights to take precedence over that of the bank, or the other way around?

[djf]

Years ago, and I think it was a legal requirement at the time, you could actually pay your debts with stamps. I vaguely remember my mom sending stamps in to partly cover our electric bill.

[FredZarguna]

Oh, please.

The poor, poor members of the Federal Reserve are going to find themselves CRUSHED UNDER THE JACKBOOTS of the Federal Government?

Hahahahahahahaha.

Now I know you can't read; nobody would post such absolutely melodramatic drivel if he could actually read what he just wrote.

Fed Banks receive numerous benefits at the expense of Federal taxpayers, including insurance rates on their instruments that nobody else can get, and short-term interest rates that make it nearly impossible for them to ever lose money. [Although somehow, some of them still manage to.]

They can verify the current payout on a bond instantly. I can do that on my computer at this very second with any bond I own. Perhaps you're surprised to learn that computers are actually capable of mathematical calculations, and do not exist merely so you can post idiotic piffle on web sites. If that's the case, I apologize. The online verification and calcuation has been available for about 15 years. Next time do a little research before posting nonsense.

The bank is simply floating themselves a loan at my expense because the government allows them to get away with that, among many other abuses. If you don't think that makes the symbiotic relationship between the central bank and the Federal government part of the Apparat you don't understand politics, government, or economics very well, if at all; as your silly, over-the-top defense of the Three Card Monty dealer known as the Federal Reserve proves quite well. The Fed's incestuous relationship with both the Treasury Department and the economic policy making branches of government make it a de facto player in everything our government does.

This isn't Andrew Jackson's government, and it isn't Andrew Jackson's bugaboo Bank of the United States. I only wish it were.

[FredZarguna]

Pretty much all banks and institutions are not keen on doing anything financial unless one is a customer i.e. has an account. That’s not news.

Federal Reserve Banks receive special insurance rates on their instruments and special interest rates that no one else can get because they're ultimately backed by the full faith and credit of the United States. Translation: The full faith and credit of US taxpayers.

Consequently, they are obligated by law to provide services in support of the US Treasury. If they don't like it, they shouldn't be in the Federal Reserve system, and if they can't obey the law -- which was written by bankers for the benefit of bankers to begin with -- they need to be shut down.

Your conclusion is too restrictive: Banks like to screw anyone they can, including their own customers, and even including people they're obligated to service by law. That's not news, either.

[muawiyah]

Then you would have been dealing with government employees ~ but you weren't.

Give it up. If they aren't government employees, then they aren't government employees.

[FredZarguna]

First, I'm glad to see that you've abandoned the ridiculous arguments you advanced for why I wasn't able to liquidate a US Treasury instrument in a timely fashion at an institution required by law to do so.

Unfortunately, it's too late: I've printed and framed your putative reply and it is now in the #1 position of my FReeper Hall of Shame. Congratulations! Your post was actually dumber than the previous record holder, by someone who claimed the Earth was only 6,000 years old.

The Poor Poor Bankers of the Federal Reserve, who have nothing to do with the orgiastic spending, borrowing, bailouts and corruption of the ruling class CRUSHED (YES! CRUSHED!) under the merciless boot heal of the Federal Government over the negotiation of barely a handful of small denomination EE bonds! Hahaha! Comedy Gold. I am going to take that one to my grave as a constant source of amusement, which, like this picture http://imgur.com/gallery/fHuhw will evoke a side-splitting response whenever I need one.

Thanks!

Now, if only you'd actually read my post, for the umpteenth time, I don't say they were government employees. Good luck with your remedial reading program. And by all means keep posting this hilarious crap. Life is just too short not to be filled with good yucks, especially from sanctimonious types who don't even think they can possibly be the objects of ridicule.

[muawiyah]

i’ve turned you in to management ~ BTW, you’re the guy who raised the question about federal government employees ~ not me. When you sober up read your post.

[FredZarguna]

Sober yourself up. Here's the definition of running dog, and it doesn't say anything about employee: (derogatory) one who is completely obedient, unquestioning, and submissive to the government or another party.

Thanks again for one of the dumbest exchanges in the history of FR.