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Beyond Guns: The Deeper Meaning of Heller
Special to FreeRepublic ^ | 28 June 2008 | John Armor (Congressman Billybob)

Posted on 06/28/2008 2:11:52 PM PDT by Congressman Billybob

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To: Fee

I sorry to say it will take some NJ people, lawyers, and money to fix it.


21 posted on 06/28/2008 3:43:38 PM PDT by bmwcyle (If God wanted us to be Socialist, Karl Marx would have been born in America.)
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To: Congressman Billybob

—bflr—


22 posted on 06/28/2008 3:45:55 PM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the MSM tells you about firearms or explosives--NRA Benefactor)
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To: Congressman Billybob
“Justice Stevens is dead wrong to think that the right to petition [First Amendment] is ‘primarily collective in nature.’ ” “Justice Stevens flatly misreads the historical record.”

Well, even if he was "dead right", the word "primarily" is not the same thing as the word "exclusively".

23 posted on 06/28/2008 4:04:59 PM PDT by FlyVet
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To: Panzerlied

Shall I hold by breath to when the ACLU takes up a gun rights case?


24 posted on 06/28/2008 4:09:00 PM PDT by School of Rational Thought (Truthism Watch)
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To: Congressman Billybob
The modern Left is stung by the Heller ruling, and the left is lashing out at the moment because of it.

This is evidenced by news “articles” in which editorial comments are inserted into news stories in places like the NY Times claiming bizarre things (on their own front page!) as that DC vs Heller “won't have any significant impact” anywhere, anytime, ever.

And this “lashing out” is also evidenced in the dissents filed by Stevens and Breyer that make claims (e.g. that there were urban gun bans in 1776 America) that they can not support with evidence.

Snap!

In the above we can find solace...for the Left has overstretched itself. Their claims are being laid bare.

For another example, consider that for *decades* the academic Left has invented (from whole cloth) and propagated a “collective rights” theory to explain why the 2nd Amendment allowed gun bans.

No more!

Now “collective rights” are dead.

Individual rights have triumphed...and even wild-eyed left-wing bastions of great legal heft (e.g. Harvard Law School) will have to begin teaching individual rights while stuffing “collective rights” theories down the memory hole...or at least...after this initial period of the Left lashing out at the Heller ruling has passed, *then* they will have to begin teaching individual rights in law schools.

And notice that I say “begin.”

What a sad state of affairs that our last several *decades* have seen law schools teach rubbish instead of actual Constitutional Law.

That ends here.

DC vs Heller is a game changer.

The Constitution means what it says, and the Bill of Rights protect individual rights.

For the Left, this is a radical rethink (but then again, that's why they are the Left while we've always been right).

25 posted on 06/28/2008 4:22:47 PM PDT by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Panzerlied
I, for one, consider the nomination of new Justices to be an overriding consideration in the 2008 election

We can survive McCain's environmentalism (which is quickly fading) and we stopped his immigration bill. The Republic will be in good hands if he does nominate judges in the mold of Scalia and Thomas and Alito. He said he would. The Republic would not survive a President Obama. The SCOTUS is but one judicial appointment away from judicial tyranny. We would see a multitude of decisions 5-4 or 6-3 that would undermine the Bill of Rights. The judiciary would become a defacto legislative branch.

Vote for McCain it is damned important. After you vote for McCain have a couple of drinks and bath you will feel better about your vote. If you would like the country run by the likes of Justice Ginsburg, stay home and do not vote. There is not enough whiskey that would make you feel better about that.

26 posted on 06/28/2008 4:28:12 PM PDT by cpdiii (roughneck, oilfield trash and proud of it, geologist, pilot, pharmacist, iconoclast.)
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To: Southack

Excellent points!!


27 posted on 06/28/2008 4:35:09 PM PDT by always vigilant
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To: Fee
Everytime the feds do something favorable to the 2nd Admendment, the state of NJ freaks out and take it out on the gunowners in the state.

I have a neat idea, MOVE!!! There are better places than the Marxist state of NJ. We down south don't have such problems. We are all armed to the teeth.

28 posted on 06/28/2008 4:46:40 PM PDT by RetiredArmy (Congress in session, the White House occupied - Your freedom, liberty and rights are in jeopardy.)
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To: Congressman Billybob
"(The latest ratification was in 1992, BTW.)"

That would be for Amendment 27 - Limiting Congressional Pay Increases. Ratified 5/7/1992

No law, varying the compensation for the services of the Senators and Representatives, shall take effect, until an election of Representatives shall have intervened.

I read that to mean that if they vote themselves a pay raise once a week, they will be in violation of the constitution. Why is the date significant?

You lawyers scare the hell out of me. It's as if you dwell in a universe apart from the rest of us.

29 posted on 06/28/2008 5:23:12 PM PDT by An Old Man ("The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they suppress." Douglas)
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To: Congressman Billybob

How long has it been since a Supreme Court ruling protected the rights of anyone other than drug dealers, perverts and killers?


30 posted on 06/28/2008 5:31:27 PM PDT by Spok (Liberty lives only in proportion to wholesome restraint.)
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To: Fee; bmwcyle; tcostell; Malsua; ZULU; Renegade; britt reed; goldstategop; The KG9 Kid; ...
Yesterday, I sent the following letter to the Star-Ledger. We'll see whether they print it or not....
In an historic, long-overdue ruling, the Supreme Court has confirmed what non-liberal Americans have known for more than 200 years: the Second Amendment defines an individual right, and it is unconstitutional to prohibit citizens from exercising normal means of self-defense of their person and property.

New Jersey's decades-old violations of this constitutionally-guaranteed right are legion -- ranging from arbitrary and capricious licensure restrictions, to prohibition of entire classes of weapons (also unconstitutional), to the threat of state and civil liabilities should a citizen exercise his God-given, constitutionally-guaranteed right of self-defense.

In all parts of this country, it has been demonstrated beyond doubt that gun-restricted areas (especially so-called "gun-free zones") suffer higher rates of violent crime. New Jersey, however, holds the right of criminals sacrosanct, deeming the lives of its citizens expendable.

AG Anne Milgram's misguided response to the ruling shows that nothing has changed. Politicians here are as committed as ever to maintaining iron-clad control over subjects (not citizens). Smart politicians would move, immediately, to lift this state's restrictive, unconstitutional gun laws, but that is not the New Jersey way. Instead, they will spend years and millions of taxpayer dollars fighting the inevitable.


31 posted on 06/28/2008 5:46:19 PM PDT by NewJerseyJoe (Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")
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To: NewJerseyJoe

You slapped them with a glove. Keep it up.


32 posted on 06/28/2008 5:50:46 PM PDT by bmwcyle (If God wanted us to be Socialist, Karl Marx would have been born in America.)
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To: NewJerseyJoe
Very well done.

A man with a gun is a citizen. A man without a gun is a subject.

33 posted on 06/28/2008 5:56:59 PM PDT by andy58-in-nh (Peace is Not The Question.)
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The Dalai Bama was on the record as saying that D.C.’s gun ban was constitutional just twenty four hours before Scalia’s opinion came down. When the decision came down he said he was in agreement with the majority. What gives? After all, he voted against the confirmation of Chief Justice Roberts and Associate Justice Alito, both of whom voted with the majority! The New Messiah is a fraud who would go back on any principle, however sacred, if politically expedient. Does he disagree with Scalia’s contention that we have a right to bear arms? What part of the majority opinion does he take exception to? Which part/s of Stevens’ dissent does he agree with? The fact is he’s a fraud and on all fours with Bill Clinton. A disgusting human being that the media fawns over. They make me sick to my stomach. The press has never been this servile. In fact, they are nothing but a bunch of servile suck ass supplicants vying to perform the Pharoah’s ablutions.


34 posted on 06/28/2008 7:02:27 PM PDT by donaldo
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To: JimRed
Innocent? You have a lot of faith in the system. Was it Carlin who said he feared bring tried by 12 people who weren't smart enough to get out of jury duty?

I consider myself smart enough to accept jury duty.

35 posted on 06/28/2008 10:08:58 PM PDT by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE is "AAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Congressman Billybob
Certainly little common ground between the majority and the minority opinions!

And certainly, even one new member of SCOTUS would change the pivot which is Kennedy. If Stevens, aged 88, or any of the other four "liberals" retires soon, then if we could even have a Sandra Day O'Connor in his place it would be an improvement. At least once in a while they would disagree with Kennedy when Kennedy was wrong - thus giving the Constitution a 5-4 win.

When you propose the likelihood of up to four vacancies before 2012, how many of those would likely be from the majority in Heller?


36 posted on 06/29/2008 5:25:23 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The conceit of journalistic objectivity is profoundly subversive of democratic principle.)
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To: Congressman Billybob
Here are some of the charges leveled by the Opinion against the Dissents: “Justice Stevens is dead wrong to think that the right to petition [First Amendment] is ‘primarily collective in nature.’ ” “Justice Stevens flatly misreads the historical record.” “Justice Stevens suggests that ‘there is not so much as a whisper’ in [Joseph Story’s Commentaries on the Constitution] ... that favors the individual-rights view.... That is wrong.’
The thing I notice in this discussion is the implication that the final configuration of the Opinion and the Dissents is arrived at collaboratively - the Opinion speaks confidently as to the exact nature of each of the Dissents. Has that always been routine?

37 posted on 06/29/2008 5:33:44 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The conceit of journalistic objectivity is profoundly subversive of democratic principle.)
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To: Swordmaker
I consider myself smart enough to accept jury duty.

I served four times over the past twenty years. I got to be foreman twice; once by luck of the draw and once by election.

38 posted on 06/29/2008 7:01:41 AM PDT by JimRed ("Hey, hey, Teddy K., how many girls did you drown today?" TERM LIMITS, NOW!)
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To: Congressman Billybob; All
Blueprint for Restoring 2nd Amendment Rights to Citizens of New Jersey

As (legal) gun ownership is dependent upon the whims of local police departments, the following MAY be in order:

1. Multiple "Citizen Xes", with no criminal background or mental defect, apply for gun "permit".

2. Gun "permits" are denied.

3. (fill in the blank)

4. Shoots an intruder in his or her home, breaking 2 NJ laws simultaneously, "illegal weapon", no "castle" provision.

5. Does NOT allow or rejects plea bargain on multiple counts.

6. Takes issue to SCOTUS on points decided in Heller:

Comments?

39 posted on 06/29/2008 8:06:41 AM PDT by britt reed (His followers believe Obama is the "Second Coming", those with open eyes recognize the Golden Calf.)
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To: NewJerseyJoe; All

Great job!


40 posted on 06/29/2008 8:07:58 AM PDT by britt reed (His followers believe Obama is the "Second Coming", those with open eyes recognize the Golden Calf.)
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