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Please say a prayer for the people of Great Britain

 

 Mary

1 posted on 06/02/2008 2:34:36 AM PDT by Stoat
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To: Stoat

From the UK - I am ashamed of the anti-Chritian, anti freedom and he anti-American racist abuse of the community officer. ‘Nuff said!


2 posted on 06/02/2008 2:38:45 AM PDT by vimto (To do the right thing you don't have to be intelligent - you have to be brave (Sasz))
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To: Stoat

Oh, my goodness. It certainly sounds as if they need it. They are added to my prayer list.


3 posted on 06/02/2008 2:40:11 AM PDT by singfreedom
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To: Stoat

God helps those who help themselves.


5 posted on 06/02/2008 2:49:47 AM PDT by BigCinBigD (")
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To: Stoat
 

This is sad, really.


Pandering to Islamic nutcases by Britain and France (and Canada also) is what has brought us the current Islamic mess.

Remember the Ayatollah Khomeini? He was running the show of ousting Iran's pro-modernisation Shah, from France.


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

Tolerating Islamist intolerance

 by KPS Gill


A great deal has been written on the 'cartoon controversy', but it is far from enough. The current storm of orchestrated violence and intimidatory protests across the world is symbolic of a deep and sustained intolerance among Muslims, and of rising levels of tolerance of Muslim intolerance, that jointly undermine the possibility of freedom in large parts of the world.

Crucially, it is precisely this tolerance of intolerance that has allowed vocal and violent radicalised Islamist minorities to silence Muslim majorities and to transform the global image of Islam into the grotesque parody of the faith that the Danish cartoons sought - perhaps indelicately - to reflect.

Offensive though these cartoons may have been - and they were not offensive to at least some Muslims, who saw in them, not an insult to the Prophet or the faith, but rather a critique of the unrelenting violence that has become the defining character of much of the Muslim world - the criminal incitement and calls to 'butcher/kill/behead those who insult Islam' have only reinforced the images the cartoons reflected, "allowing mass hysteria to define Islam's message".

What dishonours Islam more? A few irreverent cartoons? Or the acts of remorseless murder, of relentless violence against people of other faiths, of the intimidation and abuse of all other faiths and communities, which the Islamists - including states adhering to the Islamist ideology, such as Pakistan - routinely engage in? Why, then, does the Muslim world not rise up in rage against these fanatics and political opportunists who are bringing disgrace and disrepute to their faith? Why are the voices of criticism against extremist Islam and Islamist terrorism so muted?

Indeed, why is it that all occasional and invariably qualified criticism of these terrorists is accompanied by vague justifications of the need to 'understand root causes' and the 'hurt' caused to the 'Muslim psyche'? Is the 'Muslim psyche' uniquely susceptible to injury?

Venomous characterisations of Hindus, Jews, Christians and, generally, all kafirs, are the stock-in-trade of the discourse in some Muslim countries, often communicated through official media, such as national television channels. The ideologies of hatred against other faiths are systematically propagated in so many Muslim states - we in India are familiar with the Pakistani case, where school curricula routinely demonise non-Muslims.

And do the words or pictures or caricatures by non-Muslims do more injury to the 'Islamic world' than the hideous acts of terrorism that Islamists have been inflicting on non-Muslims - and, indeed, on so many Muslims - all over the world? Worse, after so many Muslim-majority states have simply wiped out their own minorities, or are, even today, in the process of doing so, these very states go shrieking around about 'hurting the sentiments of minorities' when something is said against Muslims or Islam.

Indeed, 'Islamic' states oppress even their own sectarian minorities - be they non-Wahabbi Sunnis in some cases, or Shia, Ismaili, Ahmadiya, or Sufi, in others - not only through systematic denial of elementary religious rights to these sects, but, as in the case of Pakistan, through state sponsored terrorist movements against such minorities - recall that the Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan was set up by General Zia-ul-Haq to target Shias in the wake of the Iranian revolution, and continued to enjoy the support of the state under successor regimes, till it got mixed up with the Al Qaeda and anti-US terrorism, and lost its status as a sarkari (state supported) jihadi organisation.

Many 'Islamic' countries have institutionalised this intolerance, outlawing the public practice of any other Faith, and made the possession of any religious icon, other than Muslim, a punishable offence. Non-Muslim minorities live in abject terror of blasphemy laws in Pakistan, as in many other Muslim countries.

The truth is, the state lies behind much of the Islamist extremism and frenzy that we are witnessing today. To return to the case of the Danish cartoons, there was no 'spontaneous outburst' of popular sentiment; it was only after the Organisation of Islamic Countries decided to whip up emotions around the issue, and states like Syria, Lebanon, Egypt and Saudi Arabia began to incite the rabble through official statements and actions, or statements by religious leaders tied to the regimes there, disseminated through official media, that the violent street protests commenced.

In Pakistan, the protests and the violence have principally been led by the Jamaat-ud-Dawa - the reincarnation of the purportedly 'banned' Lashkar-e-Toiba - which has flourished under state patronage, and that was cast by the Musharraf administration into a 'leadership' role recently in the relief operations after the earthquake that devastated parts of Pakistan occupied Kashmir.

But the 'cartoon crisis' is not unique. Even while this controversy was raging across the world, Shia minorities were being attacked by Sunni terrorists in Pakistan; in the Indian State of Jammu and Kashmir, a case was registered against the local chapter of the Bible Society of India for the 'grievous crime' of distributing "gas cylinders, three water bottles, audio cassettes and a copy of the New Testament in Urdu" to earthquake victims in a village in Uri.

In Ladakh, riots were engineered between Muslims and Buddhists because some torn pages of the Quran were recovered, leading to allegations of sacrilege. In the Aligarh Muslim University, a young girl was being threatened with collective rape for daring to protest against a diktat against wearing jeans and a T-shirt. These are only a few current and proximate examples of a remorseless oppression over the decades.

Such thuggeries are, of course, not unique to Islam. There are extremist groups drawing dubious 'inspiration' from other faiths who ape such conduct as well, and Valentines Day this year - as in the past few years - attracted the ire and violence of Hindu extremist hooligans. But these remain - fortunately - aberrations in the larger context of conduct among adherents of other faiths. They have increasingly become the dominant form of public articulation in the Muslim community.

There is an American Indian saying: 'it takes an entire village to raise a single child'. Similarly, it takes a very large community, often entire nations, to raise a single suicide bomber. For far too long, extremist Muslim discourse has been tolerated - to the point of incitement to murder - in the belief that acts of terrorism are distinct from such ideologies of hatred. But it is the wide acceptance within large sections of Muslim communities in many countries of these ideologies of hatred that produce the environment within which groups can mobilise, recruit motivate, train and deploy terrorists and suicide bombers.

Muslim liberals have long advocated 'understanding and tolerance' when dealing with Muslim sensibilities, but have seldom been known to aggressively argue for greater 'understanding and tolerance' for other faiths in 'Islamic' countries, where the record of intolerance towards and oppression of religious minorities is utterly revolting. There is a great 'Muslim exceptionalism' at work here.

The 'Muslim world' demands an absolute freedom without limits, but confers no freedom whatsoever, either on other faiths, or on dissent within its own faith. The 'tolerance' advocated by certain passages in the Quran is only something to parade at inter-faith conferences, and constitutes no part of the practice of most Muslim majority states - no doubt with occasional exceptions.

The demand, today, to impose a selective censorship in Europe on speech that is insulting to Muslims - when similar speech against other faiths enjoys full freedom - is an effort by Muslim minorities to impose, through mass violence and intimidation, their belief systems within the larger systems they have come to inhabit.

Europe would be, not only foolish, but suicidal, if it succumbs to this terrorism and coercion to invent new curbs on the media and on the freedom of speech. The democratic world must remain committed to its enlightenment values and ideals, and to the rough-and-tumble of free discourse in the 'marketplace of ideas'. All communal thuggeries, whatever faith they may claim to 'represent', must be brought to an end, and every available means must be bent to this purpose.

Personally, I think, the more fun we make of our own religions, the better it will be for the whole world, and, indeed, for our respective Faiths. I am immensely proud of being a Sikh, and am confident that no jokes or cartoons can ever undermine the eternal verities of my religion.

 http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/kpsgill/governance/06_Feb18Pio.htm

(Published in The Pioneer Newpaper, India - February 18, 2006)

 

Kanwar Pal Singh Gill

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanwar_Pal_Singh_Gill

Kanwar Pal Gill, was born in Ludhiana, Punjab, India. He began his career as a police officer in the north-eastern state of Assam, quickly earning a reputation as a tough officer. He became a household name across the country as Punjab police chief in the early 1990s, when he was credited with crushing a separatist revolt in the Sikh-majority state.

Widely given credit for addressing the terrorism in Punjab, Mr Gill was dubbed “Super Cop” after his success in Punjab. He publishes the Faultlines journal and runs the Institute for Conflict Management, as well as advising governments and institutions on security related issues. He was asked by the government of Sri Lanka last year for similar advice. Mr Gill has also written a book, “The Knights of Falsehood”, which explores the abuse of religious institutions by the politics of freedom struggle in Punjab.

He got involved in sports administration after retirement and is currently the IHF ( Indian Hockey Federation) president.

He has also been appointed as a consultant by the Chattisgarh government to help tackle the Naxalite movement in the state.

Quotes

“Democracy and liberalism are not a sufficient defence and this is a fact that the ideologues of ‘freedom’ need, equally, to comprehend. There is a fatal flaw in the liberal mind. Having established, in structure and form [though seldom in substance], a system of governance that corresponds to its conception of democracy, it feels that nothing more needs to be done. The ‘Truths’ of the liberal ideology are, as the American Declaration on the Rights of Man expresses it, ‘Self Evident’. They require no proof, no reiteration, and no defence - certainly no defence by force of arms. Once democracy [or even the ritual of quinquinneal elections] is established, according to liberal mythology, the mystical ‘invisible hand’ keeps everything in place; the ‘superior wisdom of the masses’ ensures order and justice...”. This is just so much rubbish. As we should know after living with falsehoods for fifty years now. Truth does not triumph; unless it has champions to propound it, unless it has armies to defend it.”

From his book, ‘Punjab: The Knights of Falsehood’

Criticism

For some critics his success is a part of the story started by predecessor Julio Francis Ribeiro who started the “Bullet for Bullet” campaign of hitting back at militants and the strong hand in dealing with militancy adopted by Chief minister Beant Singh.
 

6 posted on 06/02/2008 2:54:27 AM PDT by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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To: Stoat
"Attempting to convert Muslims to Christianity was a hate crime."

Hoo boy!

Bye bye, Britain. Your open hostility to Christians truly spells out your doom.

Saint Paul the Apostle was arrested for spreading Christianity, was he not? Nero tortured and beheaded him thereafter.

I know the British authorities haven't gone to the level of torture and murder of Christians YET, but persecution is in effect when threats of arrest are concerned.

8 posted on 06/02/2008 2:58:04 AM PDT by Prole (Pray for the families of Chris and Channon.)
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To: Stoat

The once Great Britain is now Shira Britain.


9 posted on 06/02/2008 2:59:22 AM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink)
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To: Stoat

And yet Muslims are allowed to proselytize amongst Christians (or nominal Christians) with impunity because?

Because Christians have not said the penalty for leaving the religion is physical death, unlike Islam.


14 posted on 06/02/2008 3:09:33 AM PDT by Roy Tucker ("You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."--Ayn Rand)
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To: Stoat

This is a case where a Christian must disobey the government. As Augustine pointed, if we are compelled to do something God has forbidden, or forbidden to do something God has compelled, we must disobey. I can understand the fear of a secular Government that preaching the Gospel would spread riots in Muslim areas. But are not Muslims also people for whom Christ died and need to hear the word? It’s hard; Muslims believe as a whole they have the final form of God’s revelation, and no man can be the equal of God. However, even now Christ is working among the Muslim community, and it would be better for the British government to assure the safety of converts, rather than try to prevent them in the first place.

Maybe this will shake the British out of their complacency. If the Gospel swept through England, there would be fewer young men being stabbed and fewer young women and men binge-drinking on the streets.

Father, remember the people of Great Britain in this hour of darkness approaching! Holy Spirit, come and stir the people of Britain out of darkness to light!


16 posted on 06/02/2008 3:10:41 AM PDT by GAB-1955 (Kicking and Screaming into the Kingdom of Heaven!)
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To: Stoat

Sorry; I’m plum out of “pity factor” when it comes to the Muzzies and the UK. The people of Great Britain are getting EXACTLY what they’ve begged for.

It’s going to have to get far uglier before they even consider waking up. By then, it will be far too late.


19 posted on 06/02/2008 3:13:27 AM PDT by RightOnline
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To: Stoat
'He told us we were trying to convert Muslims to Christianity and that that was a hate crime.

He's doing it wrong. Don't ASK them if they want to convert. Just tell them if they ARE going to convert. And, if they don't, you are going to kill them, their family, and their friends. THAT'S the proper muzzl'em way!

I don't call them "muzzl'ems" without cause. They want to muzzle everyone who disagrees with them. Kind of like demorats.

20 posted on 06/02/2008 3:20:03 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault ("..this administration is planning a 'Right Wing Assault' on values and ideals.." - John Kerry)
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To: Stoat

Thanks for your prayers Stoat.

These two will get compensation and a humiliating apology. The muslims tipped their hand too early this time.


23 posted on 06/02/2008 3:58:54 AM PDT by agere_contra
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To: Stoat
that attempting to convert Muslims to Christianity was a hate crime.

Islam is a hate crime. People only need to read the koran and hadith to understand the ‘Religion of Pieces’. It is the nature of their cult religion of death. The only time they’re happy is when they’re killing, maiming, or destroying.

Sura (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution of Muslims is worse than slaughter of non-believers...and fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah."

Sura (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"

Sura (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared,"Kill any Jew who falls under your power."

Ibn Ishaq: 327 - “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”

25 posted on 06/02/2008 4:12:17 AM PDT by FatherofFive (Islam is an EVIL like no other, and must be ERADICATED)
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To: Stoat

Canterbury cathedral will make a lovely mosque.


27 posted on 06/02/2008 4:35:16 AM PDT by Charles Martel (Liberals are the crab grass in the lawn of life.)
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