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Rampaging RINOS
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette ^ | 2-10-08 | Jack Kelly

Posted on 02/10/2008 3:07:11 PM PST by smoothsailing

Rampaging RINOS

Conservatives should think twice about bolting the GOP

Sunday, February 10, 2008

By Jack Kelly, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

If you read the threads on conservative Web sites (which these days takes a strong stomach), you'll encounter frequently the acronym "RINO." It stands for "Republican In Name Only," an appellation that self-styled conservative purists apply to any Republican who disagrees with them about anything.

That epithet has been applied most frequently to Arizona Sen. John McCain. But his former chief rival for the GOP nomination, former Massachussetts Gov. Mitt Romney, also has been derided as a RINO, as have former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, and former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee. Every GOP candidate who rose above the asterisk level in the primaries has been called a RINO.

The epithet is ridiculous, because it assumes that being conservative and being Republican are identical. Teddy Roosevelt and Dwight Eisenhower were good Republicans, but they weren't conservatives. Nor were Gerald Ford, Richard Nixon, Bob Dole or George H. W. Bush.

A political party is a conspiracy to obtain power, nothing more. In democratic politics there is nothing wrong with that, because the conspiracies are peaceful, open and -- in a two-party system -- moderating. For Republicans to be successful, they must embrace moderates as well as conservatives. This means moderates get to lead from time to time.

But the dyspeptic denizens of the Right believe in addition by subtraction. To make the GOP stronger, moderates must be calumnized and driven from it. Polemicist Ann Coulter is so angry with Mr. McCain's occasional........

(Excerpt) Read more at post-gazette.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: jackkelly; mcmexico; rinos
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To: smoothsailing
Some of these media slapdicks don’t realize that Huckabee and Romney are only conservative when compared to McCain. Compare them to Gingrich, Duncan Hunter, or Reagan and they more closely resemble George McGovern or Dukakis.
101 posted on 02/10/2008 7:34:25 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: SierraWasp

I’m getting really tired of some of the rants on these threads.


102 posted on 02/10/2008 7:42:44 PM PST by BOBTHENAILER (One by one, in small groups or in whole armies, we don't care how we do it, but we're gonna getcha)
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To: BOBTHENAILER

Like, which ones are the most tiring for you?


103 posted on 02/10/2008 9:01:57 PM PST by SierraWasp (Keep compromising with 'em till we've completely capitulated all conservatism, right??? Never!!!)
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To: smoothsailing
If Mr. McCain wins despite the opposition of the RINOs, he'll owe them nothing, and it is doubtful he will have warm and fuzzy feelings about them. The conservative RINOs will have marginalized themselves in the same way Pat Buchanan did when he bolted the GOP.

If I'm to follow this statement to its logical conclusion, if McCain wins without conservative support, he'll not bother to enact conservative legislation as president, i.e. cutting conservatives out of the process. Of course, this will simply prove that conservatives were right in the first place, that McCain is a RINO mostly interested in advancing more liberal legislation. So we will have been right in not voting for him to begin with, since we will most likely be seeing the real John McCain in action.

I need a drink.

104 posted on 02/10/2008 9:47:28 PM PST by Major Matt Mason (We need a new, conservative party to get back to a two-party system.)
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To: joe whit

Actually, Kennedy would probably be a Freeper now.

Strong national defense, lower taxes, belief in G-d and country...


105 posted on 02/10/2008 9:53:08 PM PST by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: fetal heart beats by 21st day

Thank you.


106 posted on 02/10/2008 10:00:48 PM PST by DoughtyOne (That's right McStain, you'll get my vote when you peel it from my cold dead fingers.)
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To: SierraWasp

ONCE IN A WHILE????????????????????????????????????????????????

Where has this bright path been?


107 posted on 02/10/2008 10:02:14 PM PST by DoughtyOne (That's right McStain, you'll get my vote when you peel it from my cold dead fingers.)
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To: smoothsailing
Conservatives should think twice about bolting the GOP

I am not a "conservative" (whatever that means nowadays) and never once said I was...

I thought many times about leaving the GOP. Too late, I'm gone until the open border "conservatives" go away.

108 posted on 02/11/2008 12:22:43 AM PST by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: SierraWasp

the ones that start out “I will cut off my right arm. nail both feet to the floor, go on a hunger strike for 8 years, shoot my 1st born son, give up sex for 8 years, before I’ll ever vote for McCain”, or something more radical than that.

I guess the thot of Hillary legalizing 20 million new voters with all the cash she will save by bringing the troops home in abject surrender, doesn’t mean much, nor does the prospect of FORCED UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE, 2-4 new Ruth Bader Ginsburg’s on the Supreme Court and on and on, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.

That’s not to say I am ANY FAN of McCain, because I’m not. I guess to lil ol me, the enemy of my enemy is still my friend.


109 posted on 02/11/2008 5:10:34 AM PST by BOBTHENAILER (One by one, in small groups or in whole armies, we don't care how we do it, but we're gonna getcha)
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To: smoothsailing

Then there is a concept known as RINO Creep. That is , the definition of RINO may be currently changing to include those today who would not have been included earlier.

Arlen Spectre and Chuck Hagel are classic RINOS. But John Bolton? Probably not but he has been included in the black list because he came out for McCain.

It’s all ok however because tha primary process is designed to learn where the boundries are and determining the center within those boundries. One thing is pretty clear, the center has shifted and many are unhappy about that shift.

The general election is another matter. The question becomes “Will the center shift result in more coming within the boundries than those leaving the boundry?”

The answer is of course...... those around the center must work hard to prevent those on the fringe from fading away.


110 posted on 02/11/2008 5:24:59 AM PST by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 . "You can't be that way"......... Clint)
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To: bert
Your's is a reasoned assessment and I thank you for posting it.
111 posted on 02/11/2008 9:42:31 AM PST by smoothsailing
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To: BOBTHENAILER
It's really hard to argue with your macro logic, however, McCain needs to learn one more lesson in his old age... "You can draw more worker bees with honey than you can with vinegar!"

He is wrongly CONvinced that we need him more than he needs all of us because without all of us, he's gonna go right down the same exact cliff that Bob Dole went off!!!

So then all the horrible stuff you pointed out is gonna happen anyways if he doesn't straighten his hand and that's a really shiddy thot!!! (we git ta be mavericks, too)

112 posted on 02/11/2008 11:26:46 AM PST by SierraWasp (McCain's NOT a RINO! He's a CONTRA CONSERVATIVE!!! (he's also contra-constitutional like Schwartzen-)
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To: smoothsailing

Oh, okay. And the 2 thirds of Primary voters who dont like McCain? Are they deranged too?


113 posted on 02/11/2008 11:28:41 AM PST by Nonstatist
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To: smoothsailing
The epithet is ridiculous, because it assumes that being conservative and being Republican are identical. Teddy Roosevelt and Dwight Eisenhower were good Republicans, but they weren't conservatives. Nor were Gerald Ford, Richard Nixon, Bob Dole or George H. W. Bush.

That's something to mull about for a long time. Theodore Roosevelt was a progressive, and by today's standards, no good Republican. TR would have said that he was acting to prevent revolution, and therefore conservative in his own way, but most conservatives today would disagree with that.

For the rest of Kelly's list, the times were different then. Democrats had a strong desire to change the country, and in opposing them, Eisenhower, Ford, Nixon, Dole, and Bush were in a sense good "conservatives," though the Conservative Movement of their day wouldn't have thought of them as its favorite candidates.

Today, when conservatism also implies a desire for change -- if only to get things back to how they were -- it's easier to paint those old Republicans as not really conservative.

With the changs that followed the end of the Cold War, it's getting harder to hold on to that "Movement" sense of things, though. There may not be any one "Conservative Movement" right now.

But the basic point -- that in a two party-system, a party has to be bigger, wider, and more than an ideological movement or faction or tendency if it's going to win elections -- is undoubtedly true.

114 posted on 02/11/2008 1:09:14 PM PST by x
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To: Eagle Eye

Well, when push comes to shove......<br


115 posted on 02/11/2008 1:14:50 PM PST by Riodacat (Legum servi sumus ut liberi esse possimus.)
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To: SierraWasp

You make some very good points that I have rassled with myself regarding McCain. As I said, I/m no fan or cheerleader and indeed he needs to come a LONG WAY-OUR WAY before he ever will git the workin’ bees to carry his water, but in the mean time, I’m thinkin’ it would be wise to listen to the sharpening of the RAT knives and prepare to feel their steel if’n we don’t put ‘em down.


116 posted on 02/11/2008 7:05:45 PM PST by BOBTHENAILER (One by one, in small groups or in whole armies, we don't care how we do it, but we're gonna getcha)
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To: BOBTHENAILER; Grampa Dave; dalereed; Ernest_at_the_Beach; tubebender; Jim Robinson
I hear ya and I'm not startin a runnin debate with you. It's just that I resent and resist people tryin to complel me to vote for some Republican lout out of fear of some leftist(s) that is perceived as monolitic unbeatables in timid people's eyes!

It seems to me that if I were to capitulate and vote my vote for the lout who appears quite beatable precisely like one of his Viagra pushin, Arab lobbyin Senitorial predecessors and then the leftist(s) beat him anyways because all he's got goin for him is pure unadulterated fear...

I just doesn't make any more sense that those who hounded me not to vote for Tom McClintock because it would be a vote for Bustamonte, or not to vote for anyone but Schwartzenswindler because it would be a vote for Angelides, now try to tell me that not voting for McCain is a vote for Obama or Clinton, the Commonistas!!!

This jaded argument looks really stupid now in hindsight to even the most cynical political genius on FR!!! This stampeding of FReepers in packs toward or away from this one or that one by some ridiculous "king maker" wanna be's is beyond stupid anymore... way, WAY beyond!!!

I don't honestly know what I'm gonna do as of yet and I think I'll just keep my powder dry until someone gives me a real reason to vote FOR them, even if that excludes Presidential candidates. Right now, if I had to vote for President, I'd write in Dick Cheney!!!

117 posted on 02/11/2008 11:05:07 PM PST by SierraWasp (McCain's NOT a RINO! He's a CONTRA CONSERVATIVE!!! (he's also contra-constitutional like Schwartzen-)
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To: SierraWasp
I'd write in Dick Cheney!!!

and thus the debate ends

118 posted on 02/12/2008 4:59:27 AM PST by BOBTHENAILER (One by one, in small groups or in whole armies, we don't care how we do it, but we're gonna getcha)
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To: x

“But the basic point — that in a two party-system, a party has to be bigger, wider, and more than an ideological movement or faction or tendency if it’s going to win elections — is undoubtedly true.”

True no doubt, but the Reagan coalition was always center right...through times moderates and independents have trended center-right. Now there is a change.

I’ve been saying for 20 years that people are underestimating the socializing (indoctrination) of our citizens in school, universities, and media. The long payoff for the liberals/socialists is coming in now - and it’s going to get worse because conservatives don’t know how to play the game being played out in the media and educational system. All we do is complain about it. You never see any substantial programs or movements (that are funded)to counter the misinformation out there. We have talk radio, but it’s not enough - we are losing big and the losses are becoming huge (the fall of the conservatives in the GOP).


119 posted on 02/12/2008 5:10:21 AM PST by rbmillerjr (Big Government Evangelicals.....leading conservatives to Landslide 2012)
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