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They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious Bigotry, alive and well today
Saundra Duffy

Posted on 05/04/2007 5:46:36 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy

They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious bigotry, alive and well today

May 4, 2007 - by Saundra Duffy-Hawkins

“I wouldn’t vote for a Mormon for dogcatcher, much less President of the United States!” There’s a lot of that kind of hateful rhetoric going around since Mitt Romney decided to throw his hat in the ring – as if Mormons are some kind of hideous evil monsters. The loudest anti-Mormon shouts, sad to say, are coming from America’s so-called “Christian right”. How can Mitt Romney hope to get a fair shake in this spiritually polluted atmosphere?

There was another man running for President who faced the same dilemma – John F. Kennedy – only he was the target of anti-CATHOLIC bigotry. In his 1960 speech to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association, JFK said the following: “. . .I believe in an America where religious intolerance will someday end - where all men and all churches are treated as equal - where man has the same right to attend or not attend the church of his choice - where there is no Catholic vote, no anti-Catholic vote, no bloc voting of any kind - and where Catholics, Protestants and Jews, at both the lay and pastoral level, will refrain from those attitudes of disdain and division which have so often marred their words in the past, and promote instead the American ideal of brotherhood.” John F. Kennedy Library & Museum (Speeches, 1960). By the way, if you listen to the audio version of JFK’s speech, you will hear the hurt and frustration in his voice and the unfair treatment surely must have caused many a sleepless night.

Fast forward to 2007 where JFK might as well have been “whistlin’ Dixie”. The hostility toward Mormons today, in my opinion, is even worse than that suffered by JFK. Although it is said that JFK lost about a million votes to religious intolerance, Romney stands to lose even more if the anti-Mormon evangelicals hang together.

According to Media Matters for America - “. . . a Web-based, not-for-profit, 501(c)(3) progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative misinformation in the U.S. media” - FOX News is not reporting accurately on the level of evangelical hostility to the Romney run. Media Matters for America points out that among evangelical leaders rejecting Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson (National Day of Prayer and Focus on the Family, respectively), the Southern Baptist Convention (collectively), Pat Robertson (Christian Broadcasting Network), and Dr. D. James Kennedy (Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church in Florida). “Among many conservative evangelicals – who comprise a significant part of the Republican base – Mormonism is considered an un-Christian cult.” Media Matters for America (2007)

While stumping in Florida, a man in the audience stood up during the Q&A portion and said the following to Romney: “You, sir, you’re a pretender. You do not know the Lord. You’re a Mormon.” Media Matters for America (2007). This is the kind of un-American, disrespectful treatment Mitt Romney will apparently have to endure throughout the entire campaign – as if just being a Mormon is reason enough to open the floodgates for free flow of pent-up hatred and vindictiveness.

For the record, the Mormon bashers know full well that the official name of Romney’s church is “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints” and the members should rightfully be called “members of the LDS Church” but the words “Mormon” and “Mormonism” have an aura of negativity so they prefer to use the “M” word as if it were dirty.

Less than five minutes cruising around the official LDS website (LDS.org) will show anyone who’s interested that the Church is a Christian organization, with Jesus Christ at the Head. There are no paid clergy – all are volunteers. Humanitarian aid is legendary. Members of the LDS Church believe in strong family values; they are patriotic, they are law-abiding upstanding citizens of their community. Many LDS young men right out of high school go on two-year missions – you know, the guys on bikes – and during their mission they don’t date, read newspapers, go to movies or watch TV; but rather they dedicate two years of their lives to serving others. Many women go on missions as well, and couples, only theirs is 18 months in length but the obligations are basically the same. Most members do not shop or go out to eat on Sundays – reminiscent of the good old days when shops and stores were closed in obedience to the Commandment, “Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy”. If they can help it, LDS Church members do not work on Sundays, either, preferring to spend the day at church and with their families. Church members are encouraged to store up a year’s supply of food and water so they will be able to care for their families in the event of an emergency. The LDS Church believes in self-sufficiency and self-reliance but in the event of a financial hardship the Church distributes food and supplies through their welfare (Bishop’s Storehouse) program. Members of the LDS Church do not drink alcohol nor do they use illicit drugs; they do not drink coffee and tea. A Mormon in good standing, therefore, will not be found in a drunken stupor puking her guts out at 3 a.m. anywhere in the world. Furthermore, members of the church are encouraged to dress modestly, be polite and courteous. And members of the LDS Church are faithful tithe payers. Come on, people, what’s not to love?

So what on earth is their beef, the anti-Mormon zealots? Why is there such disdain for the LDS Church and its members? In Hugh Hewitt’s book, “Mormon in the White House?” he states his thesis that the fierce anti-Mormon sentiment among main-stream Christians stems from one or two or all three of the following factors (in order of importance):

1) “It is just too weird.

2) “A Mormon president will supercharge Mormons’ missionary work.

3) “If there is a Mormon in the White House, Salt Lake City will call the shots, at least on the biggest issues.” Hewitt (2007, p. 221-227)

Hugh Hewitt has written an exquisite book about the Romney campaign and overcoming the “Mormon problem.” It’s a good read and I highly recommend it. Of the three problem points listed in the previous paragraph, Hewitt believes – unless some unforeseen blunder destroys his chances – none of the three is insurmountable for Mitt Romney. (Plus, he has the best hair.)

Well, I’m no Hugh Hewitt, not even close; he’s an icon on the conservative radio talk show circuit. Hewitt could talk circles around me (I’ve seen him in action in Sacramento); he’s brilliant; he’s well educated, well read, no doubt a genius, plus he’s kind of cute. I’m basically a “nobody” – an overweight grandma – but after having researched for this paper, I have come to a totally different conclusion as to why there is such in-your-face angst over Romney’s religion of choice: It’s all about money, power and control (in that order). I think they’re (the evangelical religious bigots, that is) scared half to death and are revving up their attacks, not to save souls, but to save their reputations (which if tarnished would lead to financial ruin).

As I said, all one must do is browse around the LDS official web site to see what the LDS Church believes and stands for. Any reasonable person would conclude that Mormons are not evil monsters at all. In fact, they are God fearing, Christ believing, Holy Ghost following people going about doing good. “You will know them by their fruit” and the LDS has plenty of fruit and they are willing to share.

Earlier, I stated that some high-powered ministries have publicly condemned Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson, the Southern Baptist Convention, Pat Robertson, and Dr. D. James Kennedy – just to name a few. There are hoards of others. Sunday after Sunday, preachers, evangelists, reverends and ministers from all Christian denominations pound the pulpit with anti-Mormon rhetoric. I heard the message loud clear when I was a Baptist and when I tiptoed through evangelical/Pentecostal territories. Was I ever miffed when I later learned for myself the Gospel truth about the LDS Church.

Just think about it, please. If Dr. D. James Kennedy, for example, who wrote the book, The Wolves Among Us, were to admit he’d been wrong in labeling the LDS Church a “cult” that leads unwary ignorant people astray (to hell), what would become of his multi-million-dollar ministry? Suffice it to say, there’s big money to be had by sale of books, tapes, CD’s, videos, and other anti-Mormon propaganda, not to mention speaking engagements and world-wide religious crusades. We’re talking trillions, all told. I realize the anti-Mormon aspect of these ministries is but a small portion of the business, but if the truth came out, that they had been using falsehoods about the LDS Church as a cash cow, their entire empires could tumble.

The ABC News program 20/20 aired on March 23, 2007, exposed the lavish lifestyles of some of the top evangelical preachers – million dollar mansions and personal jets. ABC News - 20/20 (2007) (Again, the LDS Church has no paid clergy.)

It’s nothing new. Severe harassment and persecution has been the lot of the LDS Church since it’s inception in 1820 when a 14-year-old boy named Joseph Smith saw visions and communed with heavenly beings. Rather than discuss the spiritual aspects of the LDS Church, however, let’s stick to facts of history. Taken from a college-level early American history textbook, Joseph Smith, upon experiencing the visions and visitations, believed “that God had work for me to do, and that my name should be for good and evil among all nations, kindreds and tongues.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 292). The textbook continues, “They were met with hostility virtually everywhere they went . . . . As the movement gathered momentum, hundreds of people joined the church; entire congregations of churches of other faiths joined . . .” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 293)

During the dark time of American history when slavery was flourishing and when Native Americans were forced from their lands, the pioneers of the LDS Church also suffered at the hands of unscrupulous politicians, governmental leaders, and angry hate-filled mobs. “In the face of relentless persecution, Joseph Smith, the founder of the church, had led his flock to Illinois. There they had established the town of Nauvoo, which by the mid-1840’s had become the largest city in Illinois with over 15,000 people. . . In June 1844, a mob of non-Mormons broke into the jail where Smith was being held and killed both him and his brother. . .The Mormons abandoned Nauvoo in the spring of 1846 as anti-Mormons pounded the town with cannon, destroying the Great Temple. In a well-coordinated migration, 15,000 Mormons moved in stages to the Great Salt Lake.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 334-335) Many walked all the way and many died along the way, including innocent babes.

Joseph Smith at one time was tarred and feathered by a mob. No jury, no trial, no judge – and they had planned to castrate him, too. On October 27, 1838, the then governor of Missouri issued an “extermination order”: “The Mormons must be treated as enemies, and must be exterminated or driven from the State if necessary . . .” Far West History (n.d.) Please note that the order called for exterminating “Mormons” making no distinction between men, women and children, and indeed women and children were subject to the extermination order.

In an event known in LDS history as “the Haun’s Mill Massacre”, precipitated by the extermination order, 30 to 40 LDS families were surprised by some 200 to 250 militia. After the smoke cleared, seventeen LDS people lay dead including a ten-year-old boy. Thirteen LDS members were wounded including a woman and a seven-year-old boy. “A few Missourians returned the next day and took plunder.” LDS FAQ (n.d.) No Missouri militiamen were killed but three were wounded. Just a few years earlier, the LDS folk who died that day had been members of other churches - Congregational or Methodist or Baptist or Presbyterian.

In l976, Governor Bond of Missouri officially rescinded the extermination order and presented apologies for the “unfortunate developments” it caused. Quoting from Governor Bond’s Executive Order: “WHEREAS, Governor Boggs’ order clearly contravened the rights to life, liberty, property and religious freedom as guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, as well as the Constitution of the State of Missouri; and . . . Expressing on behalf of all Missourians our deep regret for the injustice and undue suffering rescind Executive Order Number 44 dated October 27, 1838, issued by Governor W. Boggs. . .” Far West History (n.d.) The individuals who harassed, abused, and even murdered Mormons in cold blood were never tried for their crimes.

I read Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.’s Letter from Birmingham Jail and it really touched my heart. There he was, suffering for the Lord in jail, and these religious leaders with highfalutin titles on the outside wrote an open letter (“A Call for Unity”) in which they criticize King’s tactics and basically blame King for the racial turmoil of the time. Though you can tell King is upset and hurt by the attack – made worse because he’s stuck in jail and can’t confront the religious leaders face-to-face – his response is gentle genius. “I wish you had commended the Negro sit-inners and demonstrators of Birmingham for their sublime courage, their willingness to suffer, and their amazing discipline in the midst of great provocation. One day the South will recognize its real heroes.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 881)

King has a few choice words for the Church, too: “If today’s church does not recapture the sacrificial spirit of the early church, it will lose its authenticity, forfeit the loyalty of millions, and be dismissed as an irrelevant social club with no meaning for the twentieth century. Every day I meet young people whose disappointment with the church has turned into outright disgust.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 880)

King signs off with “Yours for the cause of Peace and Brotherhood”.

There’s an eerie commonality between what JFK and MLK endured at the hands of the religious bigots of their day and what Mitt Romney is facing today. I hope and pray that Romney will be able to fend off these undeserved attacks from the religious hypocrites with the same grace, dignity and God-inspired resolve displayed by the other two.

A few popular bumper stickers read: “Honk if you love Jesus” and “Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven” or “Jesus is my co-pilot”. Yet, apparently, these same bumper-sticker Christians are the ones waging war against Mitt Romney’s run for the Presidency solely on the basis of his chosen faith in a Church that bears the name of the Savior of the world.

References

ABC News - 20/20 (2007). Philanthropic donations come from your heart, but where do they end up? Ex-money manager says "enough!" to secretive Christian Ministry spending. Glenn Ruppel & John Stossel. United States: ABC News.

Ayers, E. L., Gould, L. L., Oshinsky, D. M., & Soderlund, J. R. (2004). American Passages - a history of the United States - Volume I: to 1877 (2nd ed.). Belmont, California: Thomson/Wadsworth.

Barnet, S., & Bedau, H. (2005). Letter from Birmingham Jail. Current Issues and Enduring Questions - a guide to critical thinking and argument, with readings (7th ed., pp. 867-882). Boston and New York: Bedford/St. Martin's.

Far West History. (n.d.). The Extermination Order and how it was rescinded. Retrieved April 28, 2007, from http://www.jwha.info/mmff/exorder.htm

Hewitt, H. (2007). A Mormon in the White House? 10 things every American should know about Mitt Romney. Washington, D.C.: Regnery Publishing, Inc.

John F. Kennedy Presidential Library & Museum. (1960, September 12). Address of Senator John F. Kennedy to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://www.jfklibrary.org

Lds Faq. (n.d.). What was the Haun's Mill Massacre? Retrieved April 28-2007, 2004, from Brigham Young University Web Site: http://ldsfaq.byu.edu/view.asp?q=57

Media Matters for America. (2007). Fox News whitewashes evangelical hostility to Romney's faith. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://mediamatters.org/items/printable/200702280002


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: boggsforgovernor; cuespookymusic; election; lds; mormon; mormons; romney; whitesalamanderblues
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To: FastCoyote
YAWN.
2,641 posted on 05/15/2007 9:52:24 PM PDT by DanielLongo (Don't tread on me)
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To: DanielLongo

“I was hoping to get these guys to show how infantile religious bigotry”

Whooo yeah, I was waiting for the “B” word to rear it’s head. Daniel is now bigoted against bigots. This from a church that formed because it was bigoted against other Christians and Jews.

Caught - in - whirlpool - circular - logic - cannot - breathe - must use - miracle - underwear - to - swim - free


2,642 posted on 05/15/2007 9:53:04 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: FastCoyote
"That’s why Mormon chicks are fun to date, they are used to the idea that they will be treated like second hand sofas in the celestial plane, so they are more docile here."

Speaking of docility and second-hand sofas, I just read some fascinating articles on rape in Utah. Did you know that Utah is about 75% mormon? Well, it is. Anyway, what was I saying? Oh, yeah! Rape in Utah. According to police in that state, it's an awfully common crime and just keeps getting worse. Seems those mormon girls just won't report it. Now, I wonder why that would be? Anyway, it was right there in the Salt Lake City Trib. Pretty amazing. It was almost like a "Rapists Wanted, Apply Within" advertisement.

2,643 posted on 05/15/2007 9:53:32 PM PDT by Bonaparte
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To: FastCoyote
God just told the Prophet FastCoyote to tell you you are full of it.

Does that make you the head prophet?

And I am 100% sure of this because God told me this, unless he didn’t, in which case I don’t know where your socks are either.

They were behind the couch.

God also told me to tell you to join my banking pyramid scheme which I swear is a moneymaker for true believers. Unless the bank fails, in which case the money I printed up was just for a game of God Monopoly and not really legal tender.

If you say so, where do I sign over my life’s savings?

Hey DU, what a pleasant surprise to get a reply from you. I thought you’d given up on me after your last attempt to get me banned:)

I did not try to have you banned, I regret my part in the thread with a poster who was banned. Are we not supposed to mention names? It just seems wrong some how, like speaking evil of the dead.

I appreciate your sense of humor; I think it is almost as twisted as my own (grin) Hey, can you tell me the lottery numbers for tomorrow? Thanks!
2,644 posted on 05/15/2007 9:54:24 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DanielLongo

“Joseph Smith did have wives that were still married to other men.”

[Where did you get that brilliant piece of information?]

From excerpts of a Mormon who wrote a book about it.

http://www.lds-mormon.com/12117.shtml


2,645 posted on 05/15/2007 9:55:24 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: DanielLongo
Is that even more arrogant?

I am humble and Proud of it! /Humor
2,646 posted on 05/15/2007 9:58:17 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DanielLongo

“OK, maybe you’re not entertaining.”

That’s cause you can’t see my Magician’s Assistant in her thong costume who pulls the Urim and Thumim out of the bag for my special readings.


2,647 posted on 05/15/2007 10:03:10 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: FastCoyote
" - must use - miracle - underwear - to - swim - free."

LOLOLOL!!!

... meanwhile, way out on the planet of Kolob, God-Guy gazes down in wonder -- "Ugh, these puny, helpless Earthlings, caught like insects in the Whirlpools of Circumlocution. Fortunately, their bizarre behavior no longer startles me! They taunted me and they scoffed, but now I am beyond their pathetic mortal screeching, these mortals who do not even know how to use miracle underwear! Hahahahaha! Wife number 7! I have a task for you! Submit! HAHAHAHAHAHA!"

2,648 posted on 05/15/2007 10:04:27 PM PDT by Bonaparte
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To: FastCoyote
Is ther any particular reason you keep posting a three dollar bill? (Grin)

You do realize that it was common back then to set up a bank in a city and print money on it, right? As for the book of zelf, I prefer The book of Lemuel.

My kids enjoy The Book of Mormon By Dr. Suess

"If you can't laugh at your own religion, others most certanly will do it for you" - My Dad.
2,649 posted on 05/15/2007 10:08:08 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: Colofornian

“That’s because you’re so considerate, Tanty.”

Heh, you flatter me. Believe me, this is really hard; it’s been a great learning experience in filtering my responses.

We programmers don’t tend to have such a filter built in. Gets us in trouble, sometimes.


2,650 posted on 05/15/2007 10:13:04 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: FastCoyote
If you won’t accept my evidence that Joseph Smith was a fraud, then I won’t accept any evidence that calls into question my Godliness.

I have a zit that appeared on my cheek, today, I believe it came out just so you can show your power, can you make it disappear by tomorrow?
2,651 posted on 05/15/2007 10:13:26 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: FastCoyote
So the righteous will sit in God’s throne

Resisting Bathroom humor-- ARGH!

Must invite mother to look at this thread... Ahhh, reenforcement of good taste has been established.
2,652 posted on 05/15/2007 10:17:23 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: FastCoyote
“Harry Reid is a MINO (Mormon in Name Only). It’s so embarrassing.”

I am privy to a lot of his quasi mafia and land deal shenanigans, he is true dirt.


All religions have members that embarrass them, if not, I can always join.
2,653 posted on 05/15/2007 10:21:03 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: Bonaparte
If I've got this straight, mormons do not believe that reaching the highest level of exaltation in celestial heaven is the same as being god's equal. A mormon guy believes that where God is today, he will be tomorrow -- but he won't be God's equal, because by that time, God will have "evolved" beyond that stage of his development. Kapeeeesh?

Essentially correct, for a simplified version.
2,654 posted on 05/15/2007 10:26:22 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: DelphiUser
My power is far greater than FastCoyote's, at least when it comes to zits, it is. As fast as he can make it go away, I can make it return. So fast, in fact, that you will never even know that it was gone.

Even God-Guy of Kolob is powerless to stop my nefarious scheme for covering the planet with zits, BWAHAHAHA!

2,655 posted on 05/15/2007 10:33:26 PM PDT by Bonaparte
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To: Bonaparte

“Shifting the topic of debate from the subject under discussion to personalities is one of the many dishonest tactics employed by those who know they can’t win on the basis of factual, reasoned argumentation.”

That’s true; but it’s such a -human- reaction. I am starting to learn, though, just how unnecessary it is.


2,656 posted on 05/15/2007 10:40:21 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: FastCoyote
FC, I gotta stop having so much fun, Grin

You win. We are all gods. Does that mean I can sleep in tomorrow?

Stop time and sleep as long as you want, no one will even know you did it.

And if we are all gods, then Christ has just been reduced in size to a midget - he was just luckier to get his god wings sooner than I did. OK, I am going to quote from the :Catholic encyclopedia on line from an early Christian theologian named Hippolytus, who is reported to be the great grandson of John the beloved. His works predate the Nicene creed and he wrote an entire series called a ”Refutation of all heresies” This clip is from book ten
Such is the true doctrine in regard of the divine nature, O you men, Greeks and Barbarians, Chaldeans and Assyrians, Egyptians and Libyans, Indians and Ethiopians, Celts, and you Latins, who lead armies, and all you that inhabit Europe, and Asia, and Libya.6 And to you I am become an adviser, inasmuch as I am a disciple of the benevolent Logos, and hence humane, in order that you may hasten and by us may be taught who the true God is, and what is His well-ordered creation. Do not devote your attention to the fallacies of artificial discourses, nor the vain promises of plagiarizing heretics,6 but to the venerable simplicity of unassuming truth. And by means of this knowledge you shall escape the approaching threat of the fire of judgment, and the rayless scenery of gloomy Tartarus,6 where never shines a beam from the irradiating voice of the Word!

You shall escape the boiling flood of hell's6 eternal lake of fire and the eye ever fixed in menacing glare of fallen angels chained in Tartarus as punishment for their sins; and you shall escape the worm that ceaselessly coils for food around the body whose scum6 has bred it. Now such (torments) as these shall you avoid by being instructed in a knowledge of the true God. And you shall possess an immortal body, even one placed beyond the possibility of corruption, just like the soul. And you shall receive the kingdom of heaven, you who, while you sojourned in this life, knew the Celestial King. And you shall be a companion of the Deity, and a co-heir with Christ, no longer enslaved by lusts or passions, and never again wasted by disease. For you have become God:7 for whatever sufferings you underwent while being a man, these He gave to you, because you were of mortal mould, but whatever it is consistent with God to impart, these God has promised to bestow upon you, because you have been deified, and begotten unto immortality.7 This constitutes the import of the proverb, "Know yourself; "i.e., discover God within yourself, for He has formed you after His own image. For with the knowledge of self is conjoined the being an object of God's knowledge, for you are called by the Deity Himself. Be not therefore inflamed, O you men, with enmity one towards another, nor hesitate to retrace7 with all speed your steps. For Christ is the God above all, and He has arranged to wash away sin from human beings,7 rendering regenerate the old man. And God called man His likeness from the beginning, and has evinced in a figure His love towards you. And provided you obey His solemn injunctions, and becomest a faithful follower of Him who is good, you shall resemble Him, inasmuch as you shall have honour conferred upon you by Him. For the Deity, (by condescension,) does not diminish anything of the divinity of His divine7 perfection; having made you even God unto His glory!7
Elevating Man does not diminish God that is fixed thinking, everyone does not get smaller slices of the pie, but gets to bake their own pie, kapisce.

But, since I am a god, can I send you to hell? Sorry, nope while you are a God, you are not My God, so I don’t have to obey you.

About the quote here, this is actually pretty close to the Mormon view.
2,657 posted on 05/15/2007 10:41:31 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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To: Bonaparte

“In fairness to mormonism, I don’t think its doctrine states that mormons will be equal to God, but that they will be rewarded for their mormon practice, marriage in temple, good works, etc. with becoming gods in their own right, creating life, populating and ruling over their own planetary dominions and so on.”

Your post is a fairly accurate representation, although such things really aren’t the focus of our religion. We tend to worry more about faith, repentance, and following Jesus. Everything else tends to sort itself out.


2,658 posted on 05/15/2007 10:46:44 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: FastCoyote
Thanks for the link, but that page almost crashed me, trying to install something to my drive.

It's probably an account I've already read excerpts from anyway.

Back then, I don't think they had Burger King bathrooms, but that didn't stop Old Joe. I know, I know, he voted against it, before he voted for it, but I don't hold that against him. He prayed for guidance and God told him to deny it, then told him later to admit it. What was he supposed to do? Well, okay, he could have just kept praying till he got the answer he wanted, kinda like one of those black 8-balls or democrat re-counts after losing an election, but all that praying takes time and he had all those wives to satisfy. Joey, you're such a guy!

2,659 posted on 05/15/2007 10:47:44 PM PDT by Bonaparte
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To: DelphiUser

Placemarker!


2,660 posted on 05/15/2007 10:49:01 PM PDT by DelphiUser ("You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think")
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