Posted on 09/17/2006 8:03:05 AM PDT by Principled
A Battlefield for Tax Reform
There are a few significant battlefields in the war for tax reform. One of them is Free Republic. What makes the Free Republic battlefield significant is that the debate is at the cutting edge. The debate on Free Republic is the most current and most knowledgeable. It is a year ahead of other significant battlefields (radio talk shows, political town-hall meetings, conversations among neighbors and coworkers.)
The trend on Free Republic with respect to tax reform is going to show up in the real world. Free Republic is a tiny segment of the world, albeit a more educated, more politically motivated, more affluent segment than most. Perhaps those are a few of the reasons that Free Republic predicts what will happen in the real world the world of radio, newspapers, network television, and most importantly - elections.
The choices are
Keep the status quo and continue with our graduated income tax
Eliminate the income tax and implement a flat income tax (although this option has negligible support)
Eliminate the income tax and implement a national sales tax
There are no other options. We are going to have taxes. The only choice is deciding the best way to have them.
Whichever choice you prefer, one thing is clear. The opponents of tax reform on Free Republic will stop at nothing to protect the status quo. Heres whats happening on Free Republic (remember its a predictor of what will happen in the real world.)
Opponents of reform randomly select perceived problems, however insignificant, and say thats the reason this reform cannot work. For example, attackers of HR 25 (the Fair Tax) have alternately said the rate is too high and then the rate is too low. Whatever seems to get traction is what they stick with. Is it no wonder the perception is that these anti-reformers are not being honest with the reason(s) they oppose the reform. This is why so many question the motives of the anti-reformers. What are they hiding?
The anti-reformers try to make the reform threads so unpleasant that people choose not to participate in them (what does this predict about the real world?)
An anti-reformer may be taking advantage of the positions he he was entrusted with by the site (modertor). By taking sides in threads, berating and belittling pro-nrst posters, by deleting threads, by locking threads, and by moving threads from news/ACTIVISM to Bloggers and Personal and to Smokey Backroom, the mod(s) in question are taking away from the greatest site on the internet. Sometimes, threads are moved to bloggers and then moved to SBR or vica versa.
Pro-nrst posters are suspended for things that dont make sense. Anti nrst posters are not suspended for things that should require it - comes to mind the picture of a dog copulating with a pig with the comment screw you pigdog I found a picture of your parents. Noteworthy is that the poster of said graphic and phrase were not suspended but rather the recipient of it was suspended for complaining about it.
What does this predict about the real world?
Suffice to say that the debate about tax reform is won by the reformers. The proof is that when educated about the three reform options, the general public chooses the nrst over 70% of the time.
The only question is whether the dishonesty of the anti-reformers will slow the progress of reform in the real world. This is NOT to say that all anti reformers are dishonest - but it is the dishonest ones who are tainting the others.
The good thing about the debate is that the nrst is the most thoroughly investigated alternative - each and every point is debated in complete detail. Problems have been identified and some changes have been made. That's a good thing. And as debate continues, the level of knowledge of any lurkers continues. As I said, I predict over 70% will choose the nrst.
I never said it was ok, nor did I say that I broke any rules, and the comment you are saying went along with the picture is also not true, so I never admitted any such thing. And I'm not in the least bit interested in what you think about whether I have embarrassed anyone.
They got me banned for a week by relying on their one jounior assistant weekend pro-fairtax "pocket mod" -- whom I think was "fired" afterwards, IIRC
Of course you didn't admit to breaking the rules. You did break them though. IIRC, the comment was "... screw you pigdog ... here's a picture of your parents ..." . Do you deny this?
Why did you ask the post be removed if you didn't think anything was wrong with it? IIRC you sais you realized it was over the line.
And I'm not in the least bit interested in what you think about whether I have embarrassed anyone.
The forum knows already.
While you're at it why don't you show us the comparative purchasing power studies between the income tax and the FairTax as we've been doing on these threads for quite a while?
Those who do NOT legally particpate in today's income/payroll tax system may see a reduction in purchasing power as they have to begin paying 100% of their taxes... snicker!
always the best research one could buy, as it were.
The anti-s, in hopes of pulling others into a flame war, are overboard in their attacks. But because we don't want to hit abuse only to have the thread moved and be accused of whining, we don't hit the abuse button.
Then, if ever we fight back, abuse gets hit instantly of course.
IMO, that is what has allowed this problem to fester to such an extent.
Actually, it's an attempt to get them to stop. Why would I want flame wars? THey cause threads to be hidden, locked, or deleted. It is in my interest to prevent the flame wars to prevent the hiding, locking, and deleting of threads.
The trouble is that one side wants flames and the other doesn't. ONe side tries to avoid hitting abuse and the other relishes it.
If all someone has to do is hit abuse to move a thread - with no qualitative judgement made on the post then no progress has been made.
Anyway, I do appreciate your attention to the matter.
'zactly.
more of it right here.
can't seem to help themselves.
Exactly. As Jim pointed out this whole thread started off as an invitation to a flame war. You really don't see that you are instigating it? That's the amazing part.
If all someone has to do is hit abuse to move a thread - with no qualitative judgement made on the post then no progress has been made.Why do you assume no qualitative judgment was made?
That's like letting the beehive continue to grow under your house... wouldn't want to instigate a bee war now! lol
I didn't.
You misunderstood the post.
How is this thread instigating a flame war?Maybe you should read what you wrote. If you don't see it as inflammatory, then we know where the problem is.
You state the opponents will stop at nothing to protect the status quo. That's a bunch of BS flame-bait if I ever heard it. Just try to get pigdog to admit the sky is up. Talk about someone who will stop at nothing.
It may have offended Rob, but it isn't my job to keep him from being offended.
I have no interest in flame wars. I do have an interest in debate. Which is why I'm lancing this pus boil. Something needs to happen.
This has been going on for a very long time, and it doesn't take much more than a room temperature IQ to figure out you're all posting from the same playbook. Geezer sounds like groanup posts like tpaine tries to copy pigdog who strokes principled and on and on and on.
Post after post from dubious sources placed in news/activism at oh-dark-thirty on a sunday morning (when no one is looking) and then playing innocent about it.
Whining over getting caught at your collective games like a 4 year old with his hand in the cookie jar insisting "he didn't do it -- it was the dog..."
Numerous incidents of hijacking legitimate tax threads with 500 line spam posts, ignoring posts that prove you wrong, berating and belittling innocent posters who just ask a simple question.
Some of you might indeed be very smart people - too bad all your collective efforts are wasted on a fools game.
Rational people call it "Two Card Monte"
Perhaps that's not "stop at nothing" to you - but it is to me.
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