Posted on 09/16/2006 3:56:54 AM PDT by governsleastgovernsbest
by Mark Finkelstein
September 16, 2006 - 06:46
In a surreal clash of the sacred and the profane, the New York Times - that citadel of secularism - has declared in its editorial of this morning that Pope Benedict "needs to offer a deep and persuasive apology," for having quoted a 14th century Christian emperor who said:
“Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.”
The Times is only being fair and balanced, I suppose. After all, hardly a week goes by that you can't pick up the paper and read an editorial condemning this or that mullah, imam or ayatollah for the latest fatwa ordering the death of such-and-such infidel or the destruction of entire countries found to be an annoyance. Or not.
But the Times suddenly gets religion, if they'll excuse the expresssion, when it comes to the Pope. Oh well. At least there's one hopeful sign in all this. It was of course Stalin who dismissively asked how many divisions the Pope had. By its editorial according great weight to the words of the Pontiff, the Times would appear to be breaking with Uncle Joe. Might this be the start of a hopeful trend?
Me too
:-) I think so.
Cheering you up here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxrKPaKRdZE
Also on the subject:
The hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who, in times of moral crisis, remain neutral. - Dante Alighieri.
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction. - Blaise Pascal
At least two-thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity: idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religous or political ideas. - Aldous Huxley
Wow, nice turn of a phrase. I had to go to the dictionary for syncretist though. Good one. Perfect, actually.
Syncretism (n.) Reconciliation or fusion of differing systems of belief, as in philosophy or religion, especially when success is partial or the result is heterogeneous.
Yes. Good quotes all. And spot on as it relates to the present conflict with radical Islam.
See post #1.
+
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Monasteries and Madrassas: Five Myths About Christianity, Islam, and the Middle Ages
As Crocker says, "What would a Reformation bring to Islam that it does not already have?"
Dialog is good, but while I am waiting I will inventory my ammo.
Martin Luther was a monk, and monasteries did control a lot of land and performed other essential functions. Often, gaining control of their land was a major motivation for reform.
I agree, I also prefer the clash of cultures come now as
opposed to them advancing inch by inch. I wrote to the
head of the gay group at Harvard asking them why they were
not outraged by Khatami's appearance. They truly are insane.
As you stated, they cannot believe that people don't want to
live in peace, this is purely projection, not fact. They
cannot project their values on those that wish them dead.
Fantasy is not reality.
And, what fills the void in religion's absence? Communism and Nazism to name a few.
I believe God has indeed shed His grace on America to be the light to the world.
OK I will bite. Why was he quoting the old German guy if he didnt agree? And given that the guy had been dead for many hundreds of years, what caused it to just mysteriously pop out of his mouth. Did God make him say it? For a man of peace, I find it difficult that the pope didnt know he was throwing gasoline on a burning fire. Hell why didnt he just call for a fourth crusade to rid the Holy Land of non-believers?
Very true.
I wish people would READ WHAT THE POPE ACTUALLY SAID:
http://zenit.org/english/visualizza.phtml?sid=94748
He is being excoriated for using a quote from over 600 years ago "-- by the erudite Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologus and an educated Persian on the subject of Christianity and Islam, and the truth of both.": "Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." The Pope made clear he was quoting an ancient conversation. He made clear that this is NOT HIS words, but that of the Byzantine emperor, and that emperor then went on to make a "... decisive statement in this argument against violent conversion is this: Not to act in accordance with reason is contrary to God's nature."
The last sentence was the whole point that the Pope was making during his whole presentation: Not to act in accordance with reason is contrary to God's nature. It was one of his many starting points for his theological discussion of "Faith, Reason and the University", part of his conclusion being, "...We will succeed in [broadening our concept of reason and its application] only if reason and faith come together in a new way, if we overcome the self-imposed limitation of reason to the empirically verifiable, and if we once more disclose its vast horizons. In this sense theology rightly belongs in the university and within the wide-ranging dialogue of sciences, not merely as a historical discipline and one of the human sciences, but precisely as theology, as inquiry into the rationality of faith. Only thus do we become capable of that genuine dialogue of cultures and religions so urgently needed today..."
The reaction to the very profound things the Pope said illustrates several things. One of them is that the people are completely incapable of understanding the profound, and that Western universities have fallen short in their education responsibilities, including in their education of the NYSlimes' reporters and their readers who can't bring themselves to acknowledge that they don't know everything. Another is this illustration that people should not be given access to specialized knowledge and discussion, whether that be theological, political, or scientific, without thorough and accurate filtering. Yet another, but by no means the final, is that biased people always misunderstand what even the finest communications expert says.
Yet another thing illustrated has nothing to do with what The Pope said himself, but that in their reaction to his presentation Islam has yet to learn what was said by an Byzantine emperor over 600 years ago: "God is not pleased by blood, and not acting reasonably ("syn logo") is contrary to God's nature."
Nah...
Go to He!!.
Sincerely, Rationality.
Wilco
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