Posted on 07/15/2006 3:20:15 PM PDT by Jeff Head
Here are the first pictures I am aware of of the damaghed IDF Naval vessel, the Saar 5. Fron these pictures, it is clear that the ship was hit at an angle that would have allowed the CIWS to engage if it was active. I am now leaning towards the systems not being engaged at the time of attack.
IMHO, if true, as some reports have indicated today (buit that I did not want to believe), it would be a fatal and inexcusable mistake in the environment the vessel found itself in...defending other IDF gunboats against air attack during shore bombardment.
Please see the following FR thread for much more discussion and assessment:
Initial assessment of C-802 missile engagment against IDF Saar 5
FYI.
Ouch! Right at the waterline.
Thanks for the ping Jeff.
If the angle of impact was from the stern quarter it doesn't
look like the Phalanx would have had much coverage.
Israel maybe very lucky in this instance and learn a lot
about how their construction holds up, fire control, etc.
Seems more than likely they weren't. Somebody's got some splainin' to do.
Who built the ship and equipped it?
That's a nasty place for a hit - near the engine room ...
FYI.
From all the different reports I'd seen, anywhere from raging fires out of control to the boat sinking, I'd say it looks to be in pretty good condition considering what its been though.
Damn. Smack on the waterline, a clean hit. Looks like they may have been lucky to save it. I'm not so sure about the CIWS being able to engage it, though. If it came from the rear quarter, it might not have been able to turn back and down far enough. I do agree that it sounds like the crew, somehow, got caught unawares. Maybe they were too close to shore, not paying attention, distracted by the first missile, or some combination.
There was something mentioned in one article about the fire continuously reigniting after the crew put it out. Seems to me I remember hearing similar stories from the Falklands war, regarding the aluminum and magnesium and similar light alloys used in modern ships where older vessels used steel. It's worth remembering that these modern ships aren't the armored juggernauts we tend to think about from World War II. They're comparatively light and fragile, emphasizing their technology, speed, and firepower over armor.
}:-)4
It occurs to me, that Israel could have placed a cheap, 3" thick, iron-or-steel decoy, about 50 meters to starboard of that boat, and It would have absorbed the impact of the missile.
Why didn't they do this??
Wow - right at the water line - good job of damage control ...
There doesn't seem to be much damage. Not much of a list on the ship, and it's helicopter is still on the flight deck.
Israel hasn't had a real "Shootin' War" for over three decades. They're about due.
I've a feeling Syria's going to get its ass kicked.... Again!
Jack.
FYI...more infor with pics.
good information Jeff. I'm no ship expert but it seems like they should be using all the high-tech stuff they got to protect themselves, and forget about the PC crap...
It was hit twice, both at the waterline.
Looks like the watertight compartments and damage control scheme worked, since the ship is still on top of the water and apparently still on an even keel.
You're right about the Phalanx engagement envelope - the Phalanx is mounted on the bow and a sea skimmer from a quartering angle would be occluded from the Phalanx system by the superstructure.
Maybe our naval architects will rethink their removal of Phalanx systems in favor of RAM launchers....
You may already be aware of a report which said the systems were not engaged. Obviously, they were not expecting a missile of this type.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.