Posted on 05/15/2006 4:13:02 PM PDT by devane617
Edited on 05/15/2006 4:38:26 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
I searched but did not see a thread already open for tonights speech. I think this is the most important speech the President will probably make for the remainder of his term.
Mod Note:
This could turn into a whack-a-troll thread. All immigration trolls that would like to participate should post here. It'll be interesting to see if we mods can whack the trolls faster than they can sign up new accounts.
Jim
Whatever. I heard the speach. I read the speach. And your comment just doesn't hold true when compared to the speach. It's just that simple. Bush said plain loud and clear "I will not sign legislation that proposes amnesty". If you still contend he supports amnesty, then you're beyond talking to really.
You are correct...
If firm beliefs in giving away our country, state-by-state, honoring criminals with rewards, and bsically ignoring the borders of our country, a known point of entry for criminals and terrorists cna be called a vision.
As for me and my family, we will choose to hope for something better......someone who doesn't want to sell out the US to Mexico (or anyone else).
If firm beliefs in giving away our country, state-by-state, honoring criminals with rewards, and bsically ignoring the borders of our country, a known point of entry for criminals and terrorists cna be called a vision.
As for me and my family, we will choose to hope for something better......someone who doesn't want to sell out the US to Mexico (or anyone else).
If the Muslims take over France, we will be the first country they nuke. And then we will be over there AGAIN, saving the French!
~LOL~ Lou Dobbs for Amnesty????? He wants the borders closed down tighter than a drum.
What you said is sure what I'm hoping and prayin gfor. :) Snow might just be the best thing that has happened to the administration since they beat kerry.
"The idea that we are going to deport millions of people simply isn't going to happen. That's reality.
Ah, at least a pragmatic FReeper!"
Why don't you name some prominent politician who says we are going to round up millions of people. Or did you just make it up?
Nailed it
"Would you suggest that Sen. Sessions has gone soft on illegals?"
Me, PERSONALLY?
I like Mexican immigration.
I like Latinos.
They're my co-religionists. They think as I do on many things. They drive down the cost of things.
I don't CARE about the border all that much.
So I have no opinion either way about Sessions.
Ask the BorderBots.
THEY care PASSIONATELY about this issue.
I imagine that they would say that fencing the high traffic areas FIRST is of course a very smart idea, but eventually you have to fence the remote areas, because that's where illegal immigration would move TO.
They'd probably point out that Israel's security fence, which has been almost completely effective at blocking terrorist crossings, would cost about $8 billion if erected the whole length of the Mexican border. It would stop practically all overland immigration, and would save more than it cost every year in reduced social welfare expenditures. Those are tangible things.
Anyway, that's what I'd expect they'd say.
I can't rightly say what they'll DO in November, but I have an inkling that a lot of them will stay home. We'll be able to get a bead on this when we see whether or not Bush gets a spike in the polls. I don't think he's going to get much, because I don't think the Border Conservatives, other than a few like yourself, came home to him tonight at all.
I know you have been posting about it for a while...I think we tangled on the Miers threads, but to blow this issue up to the proportion that it might cause us to lose the house or Senate is mislead.
Everyone on this thread wants better border security, myself included. Bush laid out a plan for better border security, and asked Congress to pass something coherently close. I would think you would be pleased.
A large wall, rapid deportation of illegals is not going to happen. I don't think you could get it past most Republicans much less Dems.
Gee, I wonder why that is? Could it be that, after years and years of wanting something done, the Congress is finally going to do something and the President has challenged them to do it in two weeks? The fact that the only reason the gooberment is doing anything is because of the illegals marching in the streets just makes it a little more intense.
That's a very important point: when those 12 million people (or at least the adults) register for the guest worker program, they cannot be allowed to vote. This registration of illegal immigrants to vote is just outrageous and we have to make sure that doesn't happen. Otherwise we'll be outnumbered in more states, as has already happened in CA.
And how many would-otherwise-be illegals use such a card for an initial entry and nothing more, never returning to Mexico, never applying for a renewal, just living, working, buying a house and doing everything that an illegal does now? And why not?
You think people are stupid? If you will not arrest and deport an illegal immigrant now, why would anyone, from Mexico or anywhere else think you are going to arrest and depart them as a ten-year expired "guest card" holder.
They know damn well that your intent to enforce any laws in the future is directly related to your willingness to enforce the laws you have now.
The numbers of guest workers in any guest worker program will be constantly increased, under special interest pressure in congress from the employers who love its wage-depressing influence. It will in less than a decade become a massive program.
Every nation on either end of such massive guest worker programs is a testament to the social and political destructiveness of such programs - they are all politically and socially dysfunctional countries - Phillipines (massive worker exporter), Saudi Arabia, UAE, Dubai (massive guest worker importers). You have a multi-million semi-permanent stateless group or "workers" who are socially detached from the nation they have full political rights in and politically detached from the nation they spend most of their time in.
A massive guest worker program is a time bomb inside of a trojan horse.
Aaarghh! 24 in 16 minutes! Thanks for the reminder!
We have some friends who recently went to cancun and made the mistake of strolling off the beaten (tourist) path and almost ended up in jail -- had to pay off the cops big time -- all for wandering into the wrong part of the area.
I don't mind the program either. I don't know a lot about it, but I think that the DNC and MSM are spinning this like they did the "NSA Wiretapping", which they called Domestic Surveillance and Warrantless Wiretapping or Eavesdropping.
it is a TERRORIST SURVEILANCE Program.
The Dims and MSM make it sound like Bush and the NSA are personally listening to all your phone calls and/or screening your telephone records. There is NO way in heck that there is the manpower, equipment, time and/or desire to listen to phone calls of all Americans. It is simply logistically impossible. There was a caller on a local talk radio show the other night that said he was w NSA (used a fake name and the host said he had no way to prove or not if this guy was who he said he was, so we should all just make up our minds). The guy sounded credible to me.
He said he had worked on this program and they have special training and can only analyze/look at certain data. All they get are strings of numbers/digits (a guy from a phone company confirmed this). The data doesn't say SC placed a call(from this #) to OV at this # and they talked for x minutes. They create algorithms and analyze the data for, among other things, spikes in calls, etc. IF they find a spike - they may look further and/or if other situations arise and they feel the need to get caller info - he has to go to his supervisor to look at additional data (I believe to get the actual names and #s of the callers and callees they may get a warrant as well). The Dims and MSM are really spinning this one, but, the funny thing is that something like 66% of Americans who took a poll the other day said they didn't have a problem w it (the Dims are deeply troubled and deeply saddened).
Best,
SC
We can't find Bin Laden. How are we going to find 12 million people who aren't trying to do anything more than live just like the rest of us?
There are murderers that we can't find, rapists, burglars, bank robbers. OJ can't find his wife's killer :->
It's not like there are 12 million people out their with little transponder chips that identify them as illegal immigrants. And all they needed was a half-decent birth certificate and they can get driver's licenses and social security numbers -- and after that they are indistinguishable from you and I (that is, if you and I were legal immigrants from mexico).
You can catch mice in your house if you give them something they want, like cheese.
You can "catch" the illegals already in the country if you give them a reason to be caught. Temporary worker program is something we can give them. A chance at citizenship is another thing you can give them.
If the only thing you offer is deportation, it's going to be hard to get them to give up. The I.D. program is a great idea in the long term, but it's not going to happen tomorrow. Border security can stop new people, but does nothing about those already here.
You made me chuckle (a little).... ; )
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