Posted on 04/18/2006 7:10:51 AM PDT by white trash redneck
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Israeli-made bullets bought by the U.S. Army to plug a shortfall should be used for training only, not to fight Muslim guerrillas in Iraq and Afghanistan, U.S. lawmakers told Army generals on Thursday.
Since the Army has other stockpiled ammunition, "by no means, under any circumstances should a round (from Israel) be utilized," said Rep. Neil Abercrombie of Hawaii, the top Democrat on a House of Representatives Armed Services subcommittee with jurisdiction over land forces.
The Army contracted with Israel Military Industries Ltd. in December for $70 million in small-caliber ammunition.
The Israeli firm was one of only two worldwide that could meet U.S. technical specifications and delivery needs, said Brig. Gen. Paul Izzo, the Army's program executive officer for ammunition. The other was East Alton, Illinois-based Winchester Ammunition, which also received a $70 million contract.
Although the Army should not have to worry about "political correctness," Abercrombie was making a valid point about the propaganda pitfalls of using Israeli rounds in the U.S.-declared war on terror, said Rep. Curt Weldon, the Pennsylvania Republican who chairs the subcommittee on tactical air and land forces.
"There's a sensitivity that I think all of us recognize," Weldon told the Army witnesses, including Maj. Gen. Buford Blount, who led the U.S. Third Infantry Division that captured Baghdad in April 2003.
Blount, now the Army's assistant deputy chief of staff, said the Army had sufficient small caliber ammunition -- 5.56mm, 7.62mm and .50 caliber -- to conduct current operations in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere.
But taken together with training needs, the United States had strained its production facilities, he testified.
"To fight a major combat operation in another theater will require the Army to impose restrictions on training expenditures and to focus current inventory and new production on combat operations," Blount said.
As a result, he said the Army hoped to stretch U.S. supplies to supplement the capacity of the government-owned Lake City plant in Independence, Missouri, that currently makes more than 90 percent of U.S. small caliber ammunition.
The Lake City factory, operated by Alliant Techsystems Inc., has nearly quadrupled its production in the past four years. This year, it will produce more than 1.2 billion rounds, Karen Davies, president of the ATK arm that runs it, told the panel. Lake City provided more than 2 billion rounds a year during World War II and Vietnam, she said.
The Army's needs will grow to about 1.5 billion to 1.7 billion rounds a year in coming years, Blount said.
"In the near-term, balancing training requirements with current operational needs is a manageable risk-mitigation strategy," he said.
The Army does not want to repeat its history of building capacity during wartime "only to dismantle it in peacetime," Blount added.
The Army does have a clue which is why they would not use tactics such as those you mentioned, it will have a negative not a positive effect.
right....we shouldnt use those.
we should instead use new ammo, using bullets prepared by dipping in pigs blood.
No we don't want to lose the support of the local population who we need to win the war in Iraq and to turn it into a stable western friendly nation
re :Holy psyops, Batman, don't those politicians have a clue?
The Army does have a clue which is why they would not use tactics such as those you mentioned, it will have a negative not a positive effect.
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And...how is that working out for them so far? Oh yeah, that's right...they are pouring over the borders to keep fighting. Their weakness....find their weakness. 101 in fighting ANYTHING.
I'm not going to join in the calls for bullets dipped in pig fat, or pork-blood centered bullets, because I think that sort of thing is immature, uncalled for, and even asinine.
With that said, I can't #*%*@! believe there's even an ATTEMPT to control which bullets are being fired at which targets. There is no realistic reason to do something like that.
Even if the reasoning behind this was to prevent certain Arab factions from using the Israeli bullets as "proof" to rile up their fellows to push for an attack on Israel, the argument falls short. Aren't they already going after Israel? I'm pretty sure a few bullets wouldn't change things significantly.
What a bunch of bluetards.
Here's the FR post from back then: U.S. BRASS BARS ISRAEL BULLETS - June 25, 2004
If Al Queda insurgents were backed into a corner and the only ammo they had to use was captured Israeli ordinance, they'd use it.
I give you the age-old story about the kidnapped KGB agent and the Bobbit treatment to free him. We cannot continue to apply Western values when interpreting how our actions will be received. Weakness does not gain respect in the eyes of our enemy. And it isn't the Army requesting this, it is the RATs on the armed services committee.
Satire? This is really gay.. and insane. Gee, let me see, there is a terrorist about to shoot me but I better check first to see if my Israeli made ammo isn't loaded... and I better wait until he moves away from the mosque.. and gee maybe it's prayer time...
You British can try all you want, whether or not as collaborators with the Arab world, but you simply cannot wish away that sh***y little country, Israel.
If we need bullets or other armaments to do our work in Israel or elsewhere, there simply is no moral justification to let our troops be put in harms way because we are willing to capitulate to anti-Semitism -- if this episode does not in fact constitute our outright engaging in it.
War is not a video game.
You should not be afraid of hurting the enemies' feelings.....after all, you're trying to kill them!!
I'll get MY pig blood centered bullets dipped in Holy Water first.
“I am hit — praise be to Allah! — by a Crusader, not a Zionist bullet.”
Do you really think that's high on the list of issues they have with us? From what I recall of this, it was an issue initially raised by politicians here in the US, not our military.
This is just too stoopid for words!
Remove the populations support and that is then there major weakness.
This is what are forces have been doing over there.
This has led to better intelligence gathering with more local people coming forward with information on terrorist cells and supply points. Leading to a number of successful operations.
The training of the new Iraq army is also starting to bare fruit.
And local people of started to deal with the foreign terrorists them self's, even reported on this very site.
I am all for fighting with every weapon in the Armory, but it has to be the right weapon at the right time, in the right terrine.
That suggestion regarding pig fat is a way to cement good relations with Muslims. Lighten up and think a little.
Have you heard about that film in Turkey, about the American Army fighting in Iraq, it was not enough to make the Americans seem like bloody thirsty women and child killers, after all many Arab army's are not what you would call a model of decency.
No the real punch was the Jewish Doctor trading in human body parts.
We have to be careful out there.
It would be a great piece of propaganda Americans using Israeli rounds to kill Muslims, would sen be changed to American troops killing Muslims for Jews.
I know many of you don't care and want this to be a war against Islam. Who cares about hearts and minds if we are going to kill or convert them all.
Well its not going to happen no matter people might want it to be.
You may not know it and I have not seen any mention about it on here, but it is not hidden knowledge, but America has stepped up the Soft war as well, using similar tactics perfected during the Cold War.
Why are you posting a story that's nearly two years old?
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