Posted on 04/01/2006 5:37:42 PM PST by Panerai
The industry's VIPs mingle at political galas and Super Bowl parties. Their product is available on cell phones, podcasts, and particularly the Internet _ there it's an attraction like no other, patronized by tens of millions of Americans.
It's pornography. And if you're a consumer, John Harmer thinks you're damaging your brain.
Harmer is part of a cadre of anti-porn activists seeking new tactics to fight an unprecedented deluge of porn which they see as wrecking countless marriages and warping human sexuality. They are urging federal prosecutors to pursue more obscenity cases and raising funds for high-tech brain research that they hope will fuel lawsuits against porn magnates.
"We don't think it's a lost cause," said Harmer, a Utah-based auto executive and former politician who's been fighting porn for 40 years.
"It's the most profitable industry in the world," he said. "But I'm convinced we'll demonstrate in the not-too-distant future the actual physical harm that pornography causes and hold them financially accountable. That could be the straw that breaks their back."
The activists' adversary is a sprawling industry that, by some counts, offers more than 4 million porn sites on the Internet, that in the United States alone is estimated to be worth $12 billion a year. A tracking firm, comScore Media Metrix, says about 40 percent of Internet users in the United States visit adult sites each month.
Porn products are featured at popular sex expositions and retail chains such as Hustler Hollywood. Major hotels provide in-room porn, and adult film stars are now mainstream celebrities. Mary Carey attended a VIP Republican fundraiser in Washington in mid-March; Jenna Jameson's "How to Make Love Like a Porn Star" hit the best-seller lists and she hosted a racy pre-Super Bowl party in Detroit in February.
(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...
"And I've know of prostitutes who (at least seem) to have found meaning in satisfaction in that career, as well."
And what kind of meaning and satisfaction were they getting out of it I wonder?
"Note that that does not mean that aren't porn stars and prostitutes who were not coerced or pressured into that career. But by the same standard there are people who go into med school, who can't hack it and have breakdowns and even commit suicide.... "
But the field of medicine, itself, does not contribute to the breakdown of society. In fact, the field of medicine contributes to society and strengthens it.
It is possible that people get in over their heads while pursuing many different careers, and one would hope they would consider a career change versus suicide.
The field of prostitution does nothing to contribute - it corrupts.
It teaches men to look at women as a set of body parts to be bought instead of recognizing her as a human being with inherent dignity.
It teaches men to contribute to her self imposed degradation.
It usually empowers her pimp to keep her enslaved to him.
It damages and destroys marriages and other relationships.
It contributes to the spread of STD's - some of them deadly.
It encourages the corruption of young men.
Where is the meaning and fulfillment?
"Heck, I came within whispering distance of a nervous breakdown and thought of suicide almost ten years ago, mainly because I had pursued the career my family wanted me to and not what I was suited for."
I'm sorry to hear that and glad to see you decided to stick around even though I greatly disagree with you.
"Different people are suited for different courses in life. There are people who are well-suited -- perhaps even best-suited -- for lives centered on sex without commitment."
How sad for those people that their ony calling would be to corrupt others, spread disease, break up marriages, and become a slave to sex addicts.
You got a reference for that?
Here may be where I differ with the stereotype of porn users... When I look at porn my fantasies are as much about the woman enjoying it as anything else.... I don't like porn where it looks like the woman has no desire to be there... It's only when it looks like the woman is enjoying herself that I enjoy it.
On several occasions, the pictorials have inspired me to write poetry, which I then send to the lady who inspired it.... And sometimes I get appreciative (non-sexual) responses.
I like to think what their personalities might be like... what they might be interested in... What they are like as people. Seeing them naked enhances the enjoyment. But I find myself putting them on a pedestal, if anything. I certainly don't look down on them for their choices.
Maybe I'm unusual among men in that....
"When I look at porn my fantasies are as much about the woman enjoying it as anything else.... "
And would it matter if, in reality, she really wasn't enjoying it?
Does it matter that, in reality, a crew of people work on her to make her APPEAR that she is enjoying it?
Afterall...if porn were really a fun satisfying career - they would be some of the happiest bunch of folks ever.
In reality - they are, on average, a miserable bunch.
"On several occasions, the pictorials have inspired me to write poetry, which I then send to the lady who inspired it.... And sometimes I get appreciative (non-sexual) responses."
So...porn does have the ability to inspire people?
So..for you it inspires you to write poetry to a woman you don't know - even though you are married - because she has managed to convince you she looks like she is enjoying herself.
Is it possible - then - that porn could inspire other people to act out their fantasies in other ways? And possibly in more destructive, even violent ways?
"I like to think what their personalities might be like... what they might be interested in... What they are like as people. Seeing them naked enhances the enjoyment. But I find myself putting them on a pedestal, if anything. I certainly don't look down on them for their choices."
Why does it enhance the enjoyement when they are naked?
Why does that cause you to wonder about their personalities?
And why are they on that pedestal? You don't know them. It is a picture - a carefully crafted picture with the intent of manipulating souls like you into thinking it is something meaningful.
Meanwhile - there is your wife. She is real - you know her. Why waste time on strangers when the best thing in your life is within your grasp?
I am not suggesting we look down on these people.
I am suggesting we look at the reality of the situation.
These poor people are degrading themselves because they are desparate for money. They are contributing to immorality in the society. They are promoting dangerous behavior that contributes to disease and even violence.
"Maybe I'm unusual among men in that...."
I am not surprised at all that you are greatly affected by the images and imagine various things about the participants.That is precisely what they are trying to do.
Good night.
We went through this bit before... Or maybe I went through it with someone else. Lots of things have the ability to inspire destructive behavior. Catcher in the Rye, Beatles Music... I read an essay some years ago that blamed Robert Heinlein for (indirectly) causing the OK City bombing. Radical feminists have blamed the Super Bowl for violence against women.
Porn can inspire negative acts -- lots of things can. But it is the person who commits the negative act who is to blame, not the inspiration. As for the rest... Maybe porn stars are a miserable bunch; maybe they're not. But again, misery comes from a lot of professions.
As for the rest.... Why does nudity enhance inspiration for me? Why do I wonder about them? I don't know... it's the way I think... it may be related to why I write.
As for my wife, I do not neglect her, nor does she feel generally feel neglected... and believe me, when she does, she lets me know. Looking at porn does not make me love or appreciate my wife any less than a good performance by one of my son's classmates in a school play makes me appreciate or love my son any less. Porn is not a replacement for my wife any more than reading Shakespeare's As You Like It -- and I've loved Rosalind since I first read it -- is a replacement for my wife.
As for being affected by porn, of course I am. That's what its creators are trying to do. So do writers, musicians, and artists -- and I get inspiration from them, as well....
'Night.
What no Mary Carey pics, someone is slipping around here.
You are making the same argument gun controllers use to disarm the people. Because some extreme nutballs claim porn made them commit sex crimes, you assume every man that looks at girly pictures on the net is a sex criminal. Argue against the stuff based on what it is, filth and smut. Argue that a man who is genuinely loved and adored by his woman shouldn't need to use pornography. There you'd be entirely correct.
If a normal man is left alone with internet porn it quickly becomes downright boring after a while, much like somebody eating too much ice cream when they'd rather have a steak. Smut isn't a real woman, just pictures and movies. No smell, no touch, nothing real. Making it illegal creates curiosity, desire, and demand. Most of the stuff on the net is pretty benign, not nearly as racy as the hardcore stuff of my boyhood. People scream about all kinds of weirdness out there but that's not what most adult websites produce. Looking at one of them is pretty much like looking at any other. It's boring.
People have a right to view adult materials in their home. I think much of daytime television and the dopey soap operas, full of implied sex are quite vulgar. That doesn't mean they should be banned. Men will be men. And teenaged boys will do the same. That's who looks at adult stuff. Women tend toward the romance novels and soaps.
Porn on the net is a good deal safer than the seedy bookstores in crime infested areas of my youth. We went to some places that were absolute horror houses. Inside people's homes is the best possible place for looking at filth. It's a darn sight better than thirty years ago when adult shops, bookstores, theatres, and arcades were everywhere.
Keep it legal and private. Then teach our sons and grandsons the rights and wrongs of sex and relationships. Neither of my grown sons use the stuff. Porn is off our streets and in the homes of users. That's the best place for it.
That's one way to look at it, but the American Heritage dictionary, for example, defines "addiction" as "Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance" or "The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something." While chocolate won't ruin my life, the compulsion and need are there. It's a harmless addiction, but it allows me some insight into how harmful addictions work. If I don't eat chocolate, my mind starts to rationalize why I should have some.
So if you look at porn every day, your not addicted, but if you look at porn at work and keep getting fired from jobs, or masturbate 4 times a day and won't sleep with your wife then your addicted.
There are plenty of people who are addicted to substances, in the sense that they can't stop taking them, yet remain functional and hold jobs and keep their family together. There are porn addicts who don't descend quite as deeply as Bob Crane did. That does not mean that their compulsions or dependencies are not burdens that they find themselves unable to escape from. I can see where that might be quite problematic for a person trying to stop their use of drugs or pornography.
Plus porn addiction is much better than regular sex addiction, that can be messy and lead to lots of hookers.
Bob Crane's porn addiction got about as messy as it can get. Lots of hookers beats having your head bashed in, don't you think? Addictions are bad no matter what they are to because they reduce or elimate a persons ability to make rational decisions concerning their addiction. And for those who don't think it's real, you should notice that addictions follow patterns. Plenty of people get addicted to alcohol and porn but you won't see a "Knitters Anonymous" or people going away to treatment centers for their Backgammon obsession.
Arguments against porn as well as arguments regarding gun safety have valid points. I don't know any responsible gun owners who would favor allowing guns to be promoted without safeties, nor do I know gun owners who would encourage teenagers to take concealed guns to school on a daily basis.
Likewise, the promotion of pornography is foolish when it condons and promotes irresponsible behavior.
The comments about porn damaging the brain are probably better expressed by stating porn damages one's thinking processes. As one advances into pornography, those initially rare thoughts become more frequent and less denied by one's imagination, promoting the viewer to condone more deviant behavior.
Porn is a vice in that the exact same criterion of perception required to identify when one has consumed too much of the vice is eroded by the consumption of the vice. Similar to other addictions, it erodes one's ability to control their thinking, later their decisions, and finally their behavior, even in the face of obvious injury to self and others.
Sure do, empirical observation over many years.
FReepers should be able to MILF this for all it's worth.
I don't hate those who purvery, use or support vice. I hate the vice, I hate its support, but I see each individual as an eternal soul; unfortunately many make ill choices which influence others.
I am impassioned about my convictions, and I may sound "hateful" to some, but believe me, I do not hate any soul. I wish all well, but I know that to sink (or dive) into acts which incur future serious repercussions is to purchase great future suffering. As you sow, so shall you reap, it's also called the law of karma. There is not a chance that any of us will escape the exact reaction that is due us. Other than the mercy of God, which we have to beg for, and has to be the only treasure of our life.
We can't have one foot in the world of selfish illicit gratification (of any kind, not just porn) and at the same time think that we're somehow "in" with God.
And to promote that which helps others slide into debauchery is even worse than private debauchery. I hate evil; but I hate no individual.
Saying that if you don't like porn don't watch it is like saying you can live in the middle of a garbage dump and keep your house clean with no flies or rats. The atmosphere of sexual debauchery permeates our culture and there is no evading it. Kids are affected. Even if you turn your own TV off, throw it away, get a filter on the computer - their friends' families don't, the other kids at school don't, and so on. Sex divorced from marriage is destructive, that's its nature. It's like fire - which can cook food and warm the house, or burn down buildings and cause pain and death. Sex is one of the most powerful bodily and mental urges, and when in the confines of marital commitment, creates families of children and bonds husband and wife. When used outside of marriage commitment, it creates unwanted children, aborted children, heartbreaks, hardness of heart, and exploitation. Anyone who disagrees with me is a fool.
That deserves another bump!
IIRC, the SCOTUS has upheld zoning restrictions that limited adult businesses to something like less than 2% of a town's area. There have been numerous cases allowing local government to banish adult businesses to industrial areas and other zones away from residential uses.
States and local communities are also free to limit the display of pronography in public. I can't think of any place in this country where the publuc display of pornography would be legal.
So, I don't see how you can conclude that states and local governments do not have the power to regulate public sale and display of pornography.
That's a useful distinction for a doctor to make, especially if they are treating an addiction with medication. But in the broader sense, a chemical substance addiction shares many similarities, with respect to psychological compulsion to do something, with a purely psychological compulsion and both are, broadly, "addictions" in the common non-specialized sense that most people use it.
Truthfully the only people who become addicts carry an addiction gene. This is the reason why most adults can drink alcohol, yet around 10% become alcoholics. The same goes for marijuana, and even porn. If you don't carry the genes for addiction you will not become an addict. You can become dependent on drugs, but once you get off them, your not going to go back.
I think that 10% become problem alcoholics but I suspect technical alcoholism rates are higher than that. My family has had several functioning alcoholics who had a compulsion to drink every day but were never violent or abusive and could hold jobs and so forth. I'm aware that it's genetic, which is why I don't drink alcohol and never have. I don't want to know the hard way whether I'd be an alcoholic or a bad one. It also may be why I can feel the mild addiction to chocolate as a compulsion because I may be susceptable to addictions. Maybe you don't have those feelings but others do. Perhaps someday we'll be able to sort out the people who can't handle certain things from the people who can. Right now, we can't. And if you are susceptable to addiction, what is harmless experimentation to someone else can create a spiral of destruction that ruins your life.
For example Rush Limbaugh, he took basically an opiate (thats what most prescription pain killers are) but could stop after he detoxed and he isn't going back. An addict can't just stop, even if you got all the drugs out of his system he'll be driven to go back. The only way for an addict to stay clean is to completely stop taking anything that gives them a high.
And, as any alcoholic will tell you, avoid being exposed to the temptation of your addiction because the memory of how it felt to take the substance nver totally goes away. A single drink can bring back an alcoholic's alcoholism. A single pill could get Rush Limbaugh addicted to pain killers again.
And just as food compulsions are difficult to overcome because one must eat food to live, sexual addictions are also difficult to overcome because sex and the sex drive is an integral part of most normal lives. And images designed to create a sexual response in the viewers have become very mainstream, which is what many conservatives mean by the "pornification" of the culture. It's difficult to avoid sexual images even if you want to. Even if they are not "porn", per se, they could lead someone back down that path.
I know alot of Christians think addicts are just weak willed sinners but its just not the case. They are still responsible for their actions however.
People must be held responsible for their own actions, even if they can't help themselves. That's one of the things that can help a person fight a compulsion, too. That's something a lot of liberals have trouble grasping. Letting people evade responsibility because of compulsions only makes their problems worse.
But that still doesn't mean it's not useful to help people avoid those things that will drive many to compulsion because the cost in destroyed lives, no matter who is ultimately at fault, is very high. And Bob Crane didn't only wreck his own life. He damaged the lives of two wives, several children, and others he came in contact with. That's why such compulsions are important to others. Their negative effects often don't confine themselves to the person with the compulsion.
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