Posted on 01/17/2006 9:16:45 AM PST by NormsRevenge
DUBLIN (Reuters) - Scientists in Ireland may have found the country's most fertile male, with more than 3 million men worldwide among his offspring.
The scientists, from Trinity College Dublin, have discovered that as many as one in twelve Irish men could be descended from Niall of the Nine Hostages, a 5th-century warlord who was head of the most powerful dynasty in ancient Ireland.
His genetic legacy is almost as impressive as Genghis Khan, the Mongol emperor who conquered most of Asia in the 13th century and has nearly 16 million descendants, said Dan Bradley, who supervised the research.
"It's another link between profligacy and power," Bradley told Reuters. "We're the first generation on the planet where if you're successful you don't (always) have more children."
The research was carried out by PhD student Laoise Moore, at the Smurfit Institute of Genetics at Trinity. Moore, testing the Y chromosome which is passed on from fathers to sons, examined DNA samples from 800 males across Ireland.
The results -- which have been published in the American Journal of Human Genetics -- showed the highest concentration of related males in northwest Ireland, where one in five males had the same Y chromosome.
Bradley said the results reminded the team of a similar study in central Asia, where scientists found 8 percent of men with the same Y chromosome. Subsequent studies found they shared the same chromosome as the dynasty linked to Genghis Khan.
GENGHIS KHAN EFFECT
"It made us wonder if there could be some sort of Genghis Khan effect in Ireland and the best candidate for it was Niall," Bradley said.
His team then consulted with genealogical experts who provided them with a contemporary list of people with surnames that are genealogically linked to the last known relative of the "Ui Neill" dynasty, which literally means descendants of Niall.
The results showed the new group had the same chromosome as those in the original sample, proving a link between them and the Niall descendents.
"The frequency (of the Y chromosome) was significantly higher in that genealogical group than any other group we tested," said Bradley, whose surname is also linked to the medieval warlord. Other modern surnames tracing their ancestry to Niall include Gallagher, Boyle, O'Donnell and O'Doherty.
For added proof, the scientists used special techniques to age the Y chromosome, according to how many mutations had occurred in the genetic material over time. The number of mutations was found to be in accordance with chromosomes that would date back to the last known living relative of Niall.
Niall reportedly had 12 sons, many of whom became powerful Irish kings themselves. But because he lived in the 5th century, there have been doubts the king -- who is said to have brought the country's patron saint, Patrick, to Ireland -- even existed.
"Before I would have said that characters like Niall were almost mythological, like King Arthur, but this actually puts flesh on the bones," Bradley said.
When international databases were checked, the chromosome also turned up in roughly 2 percent of all male New Yorkers.
My sept, the O'Dubhda, are directly descended from this man.
That's interesting. Can't say that's consistent with anything I was taught about Genesis (that there were other people created immaculately apart from Adam and Eve), but it's been a very long time.
Neither was the first person to settle on the island.
Niall of the Nine Hostages was not the first person to settle on the island.
Black Irish.
I dare say that they own a quarry, a cement plant, a mine, a dockyard, a barge full of gravel in your very own neighborhood, and a lot more besides.
They have been very good to Trinity, where I "studied" with such diverse characters as Mary Robinson and Bob Geldof. (I believe he attended far fewer classes than I, but still far more than Bill Clinton attended at Oxford!)
No, but as I said, just as Adam and Noah were not Irish, neither was the first person to settle there Irish.
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What you said was that you would've guessed that Noah or Adam was the most fertile Irish male, yet in order for one to be the most fertile Irish male they must not only be most fertile but also an Irish male.
Noah and Adam were not Irish males.
Well I am not talking about what you were taught, I am talking about what is Written. What I was taught does not fit with what was actually Written. Then along comes DNA and it is not scientifically possible for all humans to have hatched out of just two people, so I took another look and read what is actually Written NOT what is a common claim.
You think about it, for what some 'creationists' claim took place, there was a really really quick case of evolution going on or big huge unmentioned miracles taking place given what evidence has been discovered through the magic of DNA.
Is that I nit I see in your hair?
"My wife teaches at a french school here in San Francisco"
Wow! Double whammy! :)
Not really. This could've been a very short discussion if you'd just said: "Yeah, great point! For no apparent reason whatsoever I just wanted to make a random and pointless biblical reference. Since that had nothing to do with the topic of the thread, but rather whatever unrelated motivation led me to post, I didn't stop to think that Adam and Noah weren't Irishmen. Never mind!"
But, that's not what you said. If I'd realized it would've dragged like this I wouldn't have bothered commenting. Not a big deal!
I wasn't disputing you; all I was saying is that I was a bit surprised because that's not what I was taught or remember reading, which of course I interpreted based on what I was taught. Do you mind pointing me to the relevant verses?
Pinging.
Irish ping! ;-)
LOL!
Doh! The secret of my past life is out.
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