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Lessons From our Ancestors About the Countryside(Five Experts Ran a Welsh farm using 17th C methods)
BBC ^ | Friday, 19 August 2005 | Megan Lane

Posted on 08/20/2005 9:03:36 PM PDT by nickcarraway

For a year five experts ditched theory for practice, running a Welsh farm using 17th Century methods. What lessons for modern living did they learn?

The BBC series Tales from the Green Valley follows historians and archaeologists as they recreate farm life from the age of the Stuarts. They wear the clothes, eat the food and use the tools, skills and technology of the 1620s.

It was a time when daily life was a hard grind, intimately connected with the physical environment where routines were dictated by the weather and the seasons. A far cry from today's experience of the countryside, which for many involves a bracing walk ahead of a pub lunch.

While few would choose to live a 17th Century lifestyle, the participants found they picked up some valuable tips for modern life.

1. Know thy neighbours. Today it's possible to live alone, without knowing anyone within a 20-mile radius (the same goes for townies). That was simply not possible in the past - not only did the neighbours provide social contact, people shared labour, specialist skills and produce. "And women were judged on good neighbourliness," says historian Ruth Goodman. "If you were willing to help others - particularly during and after childbirth - then others would be more prepared to help you in times of need."

2. Share the load. It was nigh on impossible to run a 1620s farm single-handedly, and the family - either blood relatives, or a farmer, his wife and hired help - had to be multi-skilled. Labour, too, was often divided along gender lines, but at busy periods, such as harvest time, it was all hands on deck.

3. Fewer creature comforts have some benefits. No electricity meant once daylight faded, work stopped in favour of conversation, music-making and knitting. And no carpets meant fewer dust mites, which are linked to asthma and allergies. "They scattered herbs on the floor which released scent when trodden on - this drove out flies and other insects," says Ms Goodman.

4. Eat seasonally. Today it's because of "food miles" and the inferior quality of forced products. In the 1620s, it was because foods were only available at certain times of year - and not just fruit and veg. Mutton, for instance, was in abundance in spring, soon after shearing time. This was because a sheep's wool quality plunges after eight years - thus animals of that age were killed after their final fleece was removed.

5. Tasty food comes in small batches. Today farmers' markets are a tourist attraction and many delight in regional specialities. For these producers play to the strengths of their ingredients, unlike, for instance, the makers of mass-produced cheese. This has to taste the same year-round, despite seasonal variations in milk quality. "So high-quality milk in the spring is downgraded so the finished product is consistent throughout the year," says Ms Goodman.

6. Reuse and recycle. Today we throw away vast mountains of packaging, food, garden waste and other materials. In 1620s, there was a use for everything, with tattered bed linens made into fire-lighters and animal fat into soap. Even human waste had uses. Faeces was a fertiliser, and urine was stored to make ammonia to remove laundry stains.

7. Dress for practicalities. Today fashion and social convention dictate our wardrobes. While polar fleeces and high-performance tramping boots may be all the rage when going rural, the wardrobe of 400 years ago proved more comfortable. "While the crew shivered in their modern garb, we never felt the cold in just two layers - a linen shirt and woollen doublet," says archaeologist Alex Langlands. Breeches meant no wet and muddy trouser legs, and staying covered up - rather than stripping off in the heat - prevented bites, stings, sunburn and scratches.

8. Corsets, not bras. "By that I don't mean Victorian corseting," says Ms Goodman. "Corsets support your back as well as your chest, and don't leave red welts on your skin like bra elastic does. They made it hard to breath walking up hills, but I get short of breath doing that anyway. And most people feel sexy in a corset."

9. Biodiversity protects against unforeseen calamity. While the developed world no longer counts the cost of crop failure in starvation and mass migration - the result of Ireland's Great Potato Famine in 1845 - the 2001 foot-and-mouth crisis decimated farms up and down the country as animals, the farmers' livelihoods, were put to death. The 1620s farm had grains, fruit and vegetables, and a range of animals - if one failed, alternatives were available.

9. Reliance on any one thing leaves you vulnerable. Hence the country ground to a halt during the petrol blockades of 2000, and a shortage of coal during 1978-9's Winter of Discontent caused electricity shortages. On the 1620s farm, when oxen used to plough fields fell ill, the implements were reshaped and horses did the job instead.

10. No pesticides means a richer variety of birds, butterflies and other insects, many of which feast on pests - a result as desirable for the gardener as the farmer. And the hedgerow and fields of wild flowers of the past are today making a comeback, as these provide habitats for these creatures and allow edible plants to flourish.

\Tales from the Green Valley will be broadcast weekly on BBC Two from Friday, 19 August, at 1930BST.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: archaeology; conservative; culture; farm; history; lessons; society
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To: MarkL
Isn't she half Greek?
101 posted on 08/21/2005 5:13:09 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus ("Whatever." -- sinkspur)
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To: nopardons
I think the most uncomfortable series I ever watch were those folks living like they did at the beginning of the Iron Age.

After the first episode quite a few were ill from eating a goose that took hours to cook over the fire they made.

Even after cooking as long as they did, it was almost raw near the bone.

102 posted on 08/21/2005 5:19:56 AM PDT by mware (Trollhunter of Note)
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To: nickcarraway

Bump for later


103 posted on 08/21/2005 5:34:08 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: kalee
Her notions of insecticides are silly, but many herbs repel insects. Rue, for instance, was once used by priests to sprinkle holy water, for it was thought to repel plague. Actually, it was nominally effective against fleas.

Ring around a rosy, pocket full of posies, ashes, ashes we all fall down.

Accding to herblore I have read, the rings and rosies were the symptoms of bubonic plague (black death), and the posies were the herbs people packed in their clothing to ward off the plague (turns out, fleas). Ashes were part of quicklime preps to scatter over the contagious corpses. We all fall down...and die.

Rushes were common on floors, and were rather nasty unless fresh. Do you remember the sawdust on floors of old general stores? I can remember a few from my childhood.

104 posted on 08/21/2005 5:48:42 AM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: nopardons

"All Through the Night", of course! It is beautiful in Welsh, as well. The cadence is like English so the effect is that
of not quite being able to make out the words!


105 posted on 08/21/2005 6:17:09 AM PDT by doberville (Angels can fly when they take themselves lightly)
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To: watchin
Mutton is available year round. Yes it is.

Ever eaten mutton? It is horrible. Strong. Tough. Dreadful.

106 posted on 08/21/2005 6:23:50 AM PDT by doberville (Angels can fly when they take themselves lightly)
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To: nopardons; TAdams8591

Hmmm - went to bed before all the back and forth.

The article states "scattered herbs". Not a rotting mass of rushes and several months' accumulation of plant material. Guess someone will have to watch the program to find out whether they actually meant "scattered herbs" or "rotting mass of months' worth of plant material including rushes".

And btw, TAdams is not my protector and avenger, but I have known her to stand up for accuracy in comment posting.


107 posted on 08/21/2005 7:01:38 AM PDT by little jeremiah (A vitiated state of morals, a corrupted public conscience, are incompatible with freedom. P. Henry)
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To: lentulusgracchus

Very interesting. The book I mentioned reading up the thread about life expectancy also found that marriage in the Middge Ages was generally in the 20s or even late 20s for common people, because they couldn't afford their own setups until that age; whereas nobility often married in the teens. Because of wealth, they could afford the early marriages, which were considered more desirable. It was a very interesting book, I wish I had it with me now. It was a library book.


108 posted on 08/21/2005 7:06:22 AM PDT by little jeremiah (A vitiated state of morals, a corrupted public conscience, are incompatible with freedom. P. Henry)
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To: elmer fudd
Hmmm - according to the Grave Of Egil Skalla-Grimsson Found? (Iceland) Iceland Review ^ | 8-9-2005 story:

Professor Byock says the excavation team has gained insight into the Viking Age settlement in Mosfellsdal The excavation has unveiled information on the health conditions of the people - cancer and tuberculosis were prevalent - as well as other aspects of the cultural make up. (A.D.~900)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1466181/posts

 

109 posted on 08/21/2005 7:08:36 AM PDT by SuzyQue (Remember to think.)
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To: lentulusgracchus
Isn't she half Greek?

It doesn't matter, I don't care, she comes from Wales, and I love her accent. And best of all, MoDo hates her! :-)

Mark

110 posted on 08/21/2005 7:39:39 AM PDT by MarkL (It was a shocking cock-up. The mice were furious!)
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To: little jeremiah
"..The idea that hardly anyone lived past 40 is erroneous."

Looking back at my families and those others in their records I found three steps.

the childhood/birthing deaths, mostly due to sanitation, weakening during pregnancy, etc. Then somewhere in the 40/50's, probably due to what would today be 'job related' causes or disease. And, once past that, the folks seemed to make their 90's pretty readily. Warfare of course took a relatively higher toll of the wounded but it also leaned toward small actions and not so many apt to be wounded (Civil war excepted).

I don't really see it much differently today other than the improvements in childhood/child bearing survival...and maybe fewer nonogenarians (? 90 year old people).

The article is about low tech solutions to problems that always have and always will affect our lives; without them we'd be an endangered species. (more of an endangered species)

111 posted on 08/21/2005 7:51:24 AM PDT by norton (tagline and state flags pending)
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To: SevenDaysInMay


My greatgrandmother once said that "people were mean years ago." Of course she didn't live in 1650s(more like the turn of the century), but it explains allot. People were harder years ago, because they HAD to be.


112 posted on 08/21/2005 8:07:48 AM PDT by LauraleeBraswell
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To: SuzyQue
"Professor Byock says the excavation team has gained insight into the Viking Age settlement in Mosfellsdal The excavation has unveiled information on the health conditions of the people - cancer and tuberculosis were prevalent - as well as other aspects of the cultural make up."

But it depends on the kinds of cancer. Some have been with us forever, but other kinds of cancer that are now common used to be quite rare. Certain aspects of our modern diet and the chemicals we are exposed to contribute to this. Other diseases such as hypertension and diabetes are also largely modern phenomenons. The diets and activity levels of our ancestors prevented them from occuring.

113 posted on 08/21/2005 10:24:12 AM PDT by elmer fudd
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To: elmer fudd

Yes, but I think that's a bit of quibble. If many people didn't live into old age then they didn't have time to develop many of the "modern" cancers, like prostate cancer. And, since they may not have know what a person died of, we don't know how prevalent cancer or TB was unless we find a preserved skeleton with clear evidence of either one. A numbers game.

My main point is that a modern lifestyle may have a few drawbacks, but, on the whole, we are so much healthier that it doesn't even compare.


114 posted on 08/21/2005 10:34:48 AM PDT by SuzyQue (Remember to think.)
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To: nopardons
A stalker???? You're a liar as well. While I myself have been "stalked" on these threads, I have never responded in kind. And if I was was going to stalk someone it would be someone far more interesting than petty you. Frequently, if we happen to be on the same thread, I ignore your comments unless you happen to post to me first, because of your habitual nastiness and your intellectual dishonesty.

But when I noticed your bold-faced error on this thread, I sought to correct it knowing full well you would fail to admit it and point the accusatory finger at me, even though it's blatantly evident, in black and white for all to see.

115 posted on 08/21/2005 10:43:24 AM PDT by TAdams8591 (Member since December 1998)
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To: SuzyQue
"My main point is that a modern lifestyle may have a few drawbacks, but, on the whole, we are so much healthier that it doesn't even compare."

No argument with you there. There are literally hundreds of diseases that used to be common and are now very rare. When was the last time you heard of someone with ricketts or leprosy?

116 posted on 08/21/2005 10:47:03 AM PDT by elmer fudd
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To: Shalom Israel

Sheep are just walking lawnmowers; as they trim one area another grows; as long as one has an area as large as the herd there's no extra work.


117 posted on 08/21/2005 11:20:28 AM PDT by Old Professer (As darkness is the absence of light, evil is the absence of good; innocence is blind.)
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To: elmer fudd

Well, actually, I have heard of some cases of ricketts in developed countries lately. Seems that sun-phobia "You'll get skin cancer!!!" has caused some children to suffer from a lack of vitamin D. Shows that media hype probably CAN cause some diseases.


118 posted on 08/21/2005 11:28:00 AM PDT by SuzyQue (Remember to think.)
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To: Old Professer
Sheep are just walking lawnmowers; as they trim one area another grows; as long as one has an area as large as the herd there's no extra work.

Partly true, but not entirely. In addition, land in Wales is scarce enough that it's doubtful many farmers could afford to let useless animals eat their grass. The space freed up by their slaughter can be used for more productive sheep instead.

119 posted on 08/21/2005 11:29:10 AM PDT by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: nickcarraway
Know thy neighbours. Today it's possible to live alone, without knowing anyone within a 20-mile radius (the same goes for townies). That was simply not possible in the past - not only did the neighbours provide social contact, people shared labour, specialist skills and produce.

Literally, "neigh" (or "nigh") = near. "Bour" (or "boor") = peasant, farmer.

120 posted on 08/21/2005 11:33:51 AM PDT by JCEccles
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