Is Living Together Before Marriage Totally Accptable? ...Freeper Insight Needed

7.31.05 | mlmr

[mlmr]

So I have been trying to rent an apartment in my home...and all I have answering the ads are boyfriends and girlfriends. No matter what social status, no matter what income level, I am seeing unmarried twenty, thirty and forty year old couples who want to live together. If I question them, they don't even understand why I am asking.

These are Christians and Jews. I was so surprised to find that it would be so difficult to find a young married couple.

Tell me Dear Freeper...am I totally out of the ballgame to expect to find a young married couple? Am I expecting something that just isn't in our culture anymore?

[cyborg]

There are people who should not be parents but that's just like arguing abortion based on cases of rape. It rarely happens. One person's sinful fallen condition doesn't excuse me from my responsibilities to fulfill God's commandment to be fruitful and multiply. We will not agree on this so let's just agree to disagree.

[Petronski]

But the implication is that women are only valuable as child-bearers.

Only if you read that way.

[HairOfTheDog]

Statistically, those who live together before marriage have a higher divorce rate than those who do not.

Correlation does not equal causation. This is an oft quoted meaningless statistic, high on the list of meaningless statistics.

It's true, perhaps that more people who never live together, never have sex until the wedding night, have fewer divorces. But it's not because virgin wedding nights have some special magical affect on the length of marriage, it's because the kind of people who tend to believe in waiting till marriage also is comprised 100% of people who take marriage vows very seriously, usually for religious reasons.

On the other hand, the type of people who will live together before marriage will comprise people who are all over the board in how seriously they take marriage. Some will think it's OK to leave when they get bored, or have an affair, some will take it very seriously, as least as seriously as the chaste group.

So it's not the shacking up first that leads to divorce, it's the tendency of that pool of people to include those who divorce for lesser reasons.

Living together before marriage does not lessen the commitment of those who believe in commitment. Nor would not living together first increase the commitment of people who don't believe in commitment.

[unbalanced but fair]

Only if you read that way.

To: Hildy My definition of courtship is getting a parents' blessing to pursue the relationship. Not that it's mandatory but it's nice to have parents like who you go out with. Also, get both families involved in building the relationship. This will sound sexist but girls have a shelf life and should not go out with a man if she can't picture herself marrying him and having his children. That's my personal opinion. I do know other people who have this draconian opinion about courtship but I think mine is pretty relaxed. I've been in some courtship forums where I just shook my head and left. 121 posted on 07/31/2005 7:17:12 PM EDT by cyborg (to love,honor and obey...) [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 112 | View Replies | Report Abuse

To: unbalanced but fair Women can't have children forever. That's not sexist, it's the truth. America is filled with feminists who wished they got married and had children sooner. 153 posted on 07/31/2005 7:33:11 PM EDT by cyborg (to love,honor and obey...) [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies | Report Abuse ]

I don't think I'm the one you should be asking these questions. I've already worked out the answers with someone. Have a good night.

[supercat]

Living together before marriage does not lessen the commitment of those who believe in commitment. Nor would not living together first increase the commitment of people who don't believe in commitment.

One thing I personally believe to be very important is that something substantial should change when a couple gets married. Since I also happen to believe that there is no justification for pregnancy outside of marriage, it should be obvious what one logical change should be.

Note that this does not imply that couples should not cohabitate if they could do so without intercourse. I find it somewhat interesting that cohabitation is viewed as equivalent to intercourse when there are probably more people engaged in promiscuous sex who don't live together than who do.

[cyborg]

You're taking what I said all wrong. I'm just speaking as a girl who was single and not young. Have a nice night yourself.

[Petronski]

I don't think I'm the one you should be asking these questions.

Wow, are you trying to insinuate something? You haven't quoted any "questions."

I feel so . . . chastened. You really got me good!

[unbalanced but fair]

Just to keep things clear. You did ask me How? The quotations were the answer. Now you two run along and have fun. Good night.

[marmar]

I enjoyed your post....true wisdom and knowledge are a gift from God........they are precious and priceless...

[Petronski]

You're living up to the first half of your name. You're definitely unbalanced, and you don't wear it well.

The quotations were the answer.

They might be the only answer you are able to give, but they are no answer to the question.

[endthematrix]

LOL! Yeah that cooking and cleaning thing is a myth!

[DefiantZERO]

Is there a reason why you can't just believe and practice your own way and leave others alone? Do you really expect to convince people of your own opinion by alienating them, not having enough respect to at least speak to them in a decent way? The venom in this topic is outrageous. Obviously, none of you could ever even be friends with a neighbor who happened to live with a partner outside of marriage, past or present. It's your way or the highway, and quite frankly, if I was someone trying to make a decision about how I wanted to live my personal life, your behavior would actually encourage me to take the highway.

[DefiantZERO]

I think you're being very, very arrogant by believing you know how everyone's relationship will progress. My wife and I were sexually active before we were married, yet we're happy and bonded.

People on one side of this debate seem to think they know the answers to everyone's life, and it's getting extremely annoying.

[DefiantZERO]

I don't quite get your point. Are you trying to shield your children from the fact that people who aren't married do live together? Wouldn't it be better, rather than trying to give them such a sheltered life, to discuss living arrangements, or whatever, with your children and tell them why you disagree, or agree, with those actions? I've raised my son to be aware of as much out there as possible, and hopefully given him the tools to make informed decisions in accordance with our values about his life and how he wants to live it. I can assure that your children will find out about couples having premarital sex sooner or later.

Exactly. Unfortunately, I think a lot of people with the mindset of sheltering their kids from everything they don't like are hoping that by the time their kids grow up, they'd have succeeded in getting the government to ban all those things, and get them all listed as capital offenses.

[DefiantZERO]

Perhaps they stayed together "for the children." Not being sarcastic. In fact, the stats do indicate that the adult children of parents who stayed together--even when they might have preferred not to--are emotionally and otherwise better off than the children of those who sought greener (and younger and sexier) pastures. But living for others is evidently not your cup of tea. Which is why your marriage, like the marriages of so many people today who shack up to "test the merchandise," will probably not be what a marriage can be--and why your children will no doubt suffer for it.

This is unbelievable. How DARE you pass your own judgement on his marriage's future? Where do you get off acting like you know anything?? Last I checked, fortune-telling wasn't a Christian practice. You, sir, are absolutely disgusting. Would you stand in a neighbor's yard and shout at him that his relationship is doomed if he happens to live with a girlfriend or fiancee instead of a wife? I bet you would. I feel sorry for you, and your arrogance and inflated self-importance. Oh, and how exactly are people going to "live for others" capably without occassionally taking the time to think "Am *I* happy?". If everyone allows themselves to be miserable for someone else, guess what? Everyone's miserable!!! The person you're trying to make happy by neglecting yourself is neglecting theirself for someone else, and so on and so on! Ugh..

[Petronski]

Is there a reason why you can't just believe and practice your own way and leave others alone?

Of course, but the very title of the thread is a question, an invitation for opinion.

[DefiantZERO]

So instead a child should grow up in a home where the parents hate each other, don't want to speak to each other, and snipe at each other whenever they can, so that the child grows up thinking this is what a marriage is supposed to be about? Good one.

[the invisib1e hand]

i'm only here for the keywords...

[DefiantZERO]

Coming in here and posting an opinion is very different to coming in shouting about everyone who doesn't see things their way being "wrong", "evil", "sinners" and all but demanding that their way be the only way. There's a little thing called civilized debate.

I noticed that everyone here who was of the opinion that living together before marriage can have it's acceptable purposes and situations said just that. The traditionalists are always the ones passing judgement, and outright insulting people who think differently.

[the invisib1e hand]

So instead a child should grow up in a home where the parents hate each other, don't want to speak to each other, and snipe at each other whenever they can, so that the child grows up thinking this is what a marriage is supposed to be about? Good one.

no, parents should grow up and be civil to one another, so that children learn how to get along with people they disagree with; even love people they disagree with. duh.