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Did Ancient Polynesians Visit California? Maybe So
SF Gate ^ | 6-20-2005 | Keay Davidson

Posted on 06/20/2005 3:27:04 PM PDT by blam

Scientists are taking a new look at an old and controversial idea: that ancient Polynesians sailed to Southern California a millennium before Christopher Columbus landed on the East Coast. Key new evidence comes from two directions. The first involves revised carbon-dating of an ancient ceremonial headdress used by Southern California's Chumash Indians. The second involves research by two California scientists who suggest that a Chumash word for "sewn-plank canoe" is derived from a Polynesian word for the wood used to construct the same boat.

(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: ancient; archaeology; california; did; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; godsgravesglyphsb; history; maybe; meadowcroft; polynesians; so; visit
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To: Clock King
" Did you know that there are descendents of African pygmies in the Philipines? They are called the "negritos", little blacks. Their ancestors came there 5000 years ago!"

They got to SE Asia 40-70,000 years ago and they are not related to African Pygmies (no more than you are).

41 posted on 06/20/2005 4:46:59 PM PDT by blam
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To: ml/nj

Silly, the map was on the Nazca Plain, easily visible from the air.


42 posted on 06/20/2005 4:49:18 PM PDT by wizr (Freedom ain't free.)
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To: Bernard Marx

According to history passed down the old way, my ancestors came from Southeast Asia. Native Americans were said to have come from the same region. They went by land while my ancestors by sea.


43 posted on 06/20/2005 4:49:42 PM PDT by MoJo2001 (Support Our Troops-->It's The Least Any Of Us Can Do...www.proudpatriots.org)
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To: G Larry
"So, how did Kennewick Man get here?"
"He was a white guy."

Kennewick Man is Ainu. Some of his kind are still alive in Japan today.

44 posted on 06/20/2005 4:50:53 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

This has nothing to do with the topic, but your dogs are absolutely adorable. Hehe!!


45 posted on 06/20/2005 4:51:52 PM PDT by MoJo2001 (Support Our Troops-->It's The Least Any Of Us Can Do...www.proudpatriots.org)
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To: fat city; Fred Nerks; Dark Skies; jan in Colorado
Hey- now I get it. When Ward Churchill claims to be a "native American", he means "Muslim".

LOL... according to Muslims, islam is the "din al fitrah" (the original religion or the "primordial religion") so way back pre-history, we all started off by being Muslims! Whooda thunk it?

I'm going to go look for the cave paintings of my great great (x10) grandma in burka now, so I may not be back for a while...

46 posted on 06/20/2005 4:59:49 PM PDT by USF (I see your Jihad and raise you a Crusade ™ © ®)
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To: Bernard Marx
The Polynesian connection is interesting in another way because it brings to mind Thor Heyerdahl's theories about Polynesia being populated by migration from the West, from British Columbia and Peru. The Kon Tiki expedition showed it was possible

Thor Heyerdahl was proved completely wrong through DNA evidence; The Polynesians are from South Asia orginally and don't have anything in common genetically with any of the South American Indians.

47 posted on 06/20/2005 5:02:38 PM PDT by Strategerist
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To: G Larry

We don't have the foggiest idea what color Kennewick Man's skin was.


48 posted on 06/20/2005 5:03:16 PM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Strategerist
That's not disputed at all. Every single scientist agrees the Hawaiians are Polynesians; genetic evidence shows they are and the languange and archaelogy confirm this obvious conclusion.

Scientists do not have an especially good record when all agree on some untestable theory. (My degrees are in Math - Physics and Math BTW. It's not like I haven't had a scientific education.) I do not deny that there is some reasonable basis for the conclusion, but I still think it is absurd to think that anyone could set out in a canoe for someplace thousands of ocean miles away. Tell me, do you think the women just went along for the ride, or do you think the men came back for them?

ML/NJ

49 posted on 06/20/2005 5:12:25 PM PDT by ml/nj
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To: tet68
Actually if they "miss Hawaii completely" they would NEVER reach one of the Hawaiian Islands.

I guess we're having trouble with the English language. If ten set out and die at sea, or someplace else (missing it completely), and one makes it to Hawaii, then the answer to my question would be eleven. Maybe you could help me find a simpler way to express this?

ML/NJ

50 posted on 06/20/2005 5:17:28 PM PDT by ml/nj
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To: blam

Interesting post.

(Actually, the liberals discovered California, and the rest is histrionics.)


51 posted on 06/20/2005 5:25:45 PM PDT by Rocky
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To: MoJo2001
Do you think my ancestors were unable to do this because we aren't European? I've heard this statement tossed about for most of my life. No one questions that Europeans were capable of sailing around the world, but when it comes to non-Europeans there certainly many who cannot believe that "savages" were smart enough to do it.

The "Europeans" had significantly larger vessels with their significantly greater ability to carry provisions, and probably had the collective advantage of using the Mediterranean as a proving ground. Columbus and those other trans-Atlantic guys also had a target quite a bit larger than Hawaii.

This has nothing to do with being a savage. (&FTR I do not believe that the Indians were "savages.") You seem somewhat sensitive about this though.

ML/NJ

52 posted on 06/20/2005 5:28:01 PM PDT by ml/nj
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To: ml/nj

Have you ever seen a Polynesian ocean-going canoe?


53 posted on 06/20/2005 5:32:57 PM PDT by Redcloak (We'll raise up our glasses against evil forces singin' "whiskey for my men and beer for my horses!")
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To: Strategerist
Hi, vacationing in Kaua'i here today, and I just toured the local museum. The Polynesians were among the most talented sailors of their era, no doubt. I'm blown away by their accomplishments.

The only thing that doesn't make sense is why they didn't succeed in California, they were quite adept at colonizing every livable piece of land in the Pacific.

54 posted on 06/20/2005 5:34:59 PM PDT by hunter112 (Total victory at home and in the Middle East!)
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To: Redcloak
Have you ever seen a Polynesian ocean-going canoe?

Maybe?

It's hard to separate fact from fiction at the (NYC) Museum of Natural History.

ML/NJ

55 posted on 06/20/2005 5:41:19 PM PDT by ml/nj
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To: blam

I grew up in central Ca with a Hawaiian dad...Finally moved to Waianae, Oahu in the early 80's to explore the family "roots", and was amazed by the reaction of the Hawaiians to the spanish language (I speak pretty well for a hapa-haole). My kids' friends would gather at our gate and ask me to come out and "talk dat way" They would sit there transfixed while I gave them the standard "come esta usted" and "mi nombre es Paco" etc. I often have said that Hawaiians could be adventurous Mexicans with long canoes!


56 posted on 06/20/2005 5:42:53 PM PDT by Ekoa
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To: ml/nj

I'm really not sensitive to the issue. I've grown up learning both sides of these opinions. I will kindly disagree with you. I believe my ancestors were quite capable of sailing the vast oceans. I believe they were just as competent in navigating the oceans as any of their European counterparts.

I figure God will let us all know when we're all ready to know the answer.


57 posted on 06/20/2005 5:47:02 PM PDT by MoJo2001 (Support Our Troops-->It's The Least Any Of Us Can Do...www.proudpatriots.org)
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To: Ekoa

Great post!
Although, I know one of my Polynesian FReeper relatives would not find your post to be amusing in the least. My oldest had an opportunity to visit Hawaii, American Samoa, Tahiti, Tonga, New Zealand, and Australia this summer. He would be taking the summer to find out more of his Polynesian roots. My son is absolutely not interested. My little one was ready to go the day it was mentioned to him. He is too young to go, but I believe he'll love the experience in another 5 years.


58 posted on 06/20/2005 5:53:11 PM PDT by MoJo2001 (Support Our Troops-->It's The Least Any Of Us Can Do...www.proudpatriots.org)
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To: Strategerist

Interesting. Do you happen to have a cite for that? I'd like to know what Indian populations were tested, etc.


59 posted on 06/20/2005 5:54:27 PM PDT by Bernard Marx (Don't make the mistake of interpreting my Civility as Servility)
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To: Publius6961; A Balrog of Morgoth

So, only whites can sail to places far away? How tacky.

Were the Phoenicians white?


60 posted on 06/20/2005 5:54:31 PM PDT by stands2reason (It's 2005, and two wrongs still don't make a right.)
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