Natalee Holloway - Extended Thread 2

I'm very sorry. Prayers sent.

1,081 posted on 06/21/2005 7:30:14 PM PDT by maggief

I just saw the interview----for smart girls they seem awfully quiet...and contrite. Yeah...

I have been to lots of resorts - and the teens go crazy when they are on their own. The stuff about not letting her get into a car is bogus.

1,082 posted on 06/21/2005 7:31:41 PM PDT by eleni121 ('Thou hast conquered, O Galilean!' (Julian the Apostate))

More posted by Dash's mother.

Re: HELP - POLICE?! how to contact?!

Corrine wrote: "Sherry/Weed/Rhonda - My take on the O'Reilly interview, was that he wasn't blaming these kids at all. I think they were just covering their own butts (probably coached by a lawyer) by saying that only 18 year olds were drinking. And they didn't want to smear their friend by saying she was drunk. Very understandable."

Corrine, my daughter is the girl who appeared on the O'Reilly show. I think that somehow in this post you meant to *defend* the teens and O'Reilly. But I'm afraid it came out very backhanded. Combined with Weed's post and some I've read on other boards, I can't help but publicly fume in response.

I realize that you and Weed and anyone else have the right to opinion, supposition, and speculation, but you'll understand my resentment of such statements when none of you knows anything of the facts. Corrine, you at least know I frequent this board. In fact, you know that I started the thread when I was desperately looking for information on the case. And you know my daughter was on the trip. I have posted 44 times with information, most of it relating what my daughter knew about the trip. This information has been consistent from the beginning, including the reasons my daughter said Natalee did not appear to be falling-down drunk. This was presented as an eyewitness statement, not as any sort of defense. We were as puzzled as anyone as to the circumstances as bits and pieces were coming out. This is reflected in that series of posts.

I have talked with you via private messages. I have appreciated your concern. Of course you didn't know that the girl on TV is my daughter. But you DID know my daughter was on the trip. If you had questions about the teens' statements on the on the show or were in any way skeptical, wouldn't it have been better to ask me, knowing that *I* know background circumstances and individuals at the very least? Or to post your concerns and ask for information -- from me or any others associated with the trip -- rather than writing negative suggestions?

The rest of this addresses your statements as well as Weed's post:

The comment about 18-year-olds drinking was in answer to Bill's question about Carlos n' Charlies' carding policy. She said she didn't believe 17-year-olds could get in. (The fact that Joran was underage is something that bears investigation, but the American teens had no way of knowing that.) She had no reason to "protect" anyone. I think it's amazing that she didn't jump on the "Blame Carlos n Charlies'" bandwagon that everyone else in the media has done.

She and Edward are both 18. Neither denied drinking; it was legal for them. Why should they have to "cover their own butts?"

Neither of them was coached by a lawyer or anyone else, for Pete's sake. They didn't HAVE to go on the show to face public confrontation. Why would a lawyer be involved AT ALL? Not even the adult volunteers are facing legal action. None of the parents *involved* blame the volunteers, & the Holloways have publicly stated the same. We also signed waivers absolving them. There is no legal or moral basis for a lawsuit. And neither teen is connected to the volunteers in any way, other than believing they are being treated unfairly.

The students had no idea what questions were going to be asked. They had no agenda other than wanting to address misinformation. In return for this, these 18-year-olds have been smeared and slurred by older posters. I understand that anything that is stated in the media could and should be available for debate, but how about asking for facts before slamming innocent, inexperienced teens?

How would you feel if *your* young daughter put herself on the line to defend others? I think they were brave to do so. Even though they were scared to death to be on TV -- much more so to face one of the harshest commentators ever -- they wanted to set straight allegations Bill had made the week before, allegations based on false reports and assumptions. After they offered information to Bill's producers, Bill softened and invited them on to address the issues in person.

Does that mean they were on the offensive, Weed? No. Defensive, maybe. Definitely frightened. Is that something deserving of criticism? I still don't know what Weed meant by the teens' being "cagey." I apologize for not identifying myself when responding but I wanted an answer without your being swayed by my being the girl's mother. You never explained what "cagey" is supposed to imply. And I still feel that placing the comments about the tv show in context of your other suggestions ("musical bedrooms" etc.) is reprehensible.

I am just absolutely shocked at some of the attitudes I have discovered. It's incredible that O'Reilly -- a commentator known for his harsh confrontations -- treated the teens with far greater respect and civility that some of the people here and on other boards.

I'm sorry to come down so hard, but I think *that's* understandable, too.

Arbeej

1,083 posted on 06/21/2005 7:34:37 PM PDT by TexKat (Just because you did not see it or read it, that does not mean it did or did not happen.)

To: maggiefluffs

If Natalee was at the vdS home around 3:00 am, I'm concerned she was DOA or close to it.

Same here.

1,084 posted on 06/21/2005 7:36:36 PM PDT by Rippersnapper

I think your scenario is as good as any:if the father, who, as everyone by now knows, is a rising star in Aruba's Judicial System, was complicit in the crime, and an accomplice, his cries of "I will SUE to see my son!" he made recently , would seem to exonerate him from having ANY knowledge of any crime---the perfect execution of a ruse. I will tell you one thing, though----probably only a certain amount of information will come from the two brothers, and it won't be enough to hang young VDS. What is
frustrating about this case is the clogged flow of information coming from the usual sources WE are used to.
Hell, Greta Van is probably doing another non=story even as we speak.

1,085 posted on 06/21/2005 7:38:58 PM PDT by willyboyishere

I'm not sure I trust totally the girl on the left... something Ellen...

1,086 posted on 06/21/2005 7:39:06 PM PDT by johnb838 (In the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, Amen.)

SM:

dated 6/5/2005

How are you i hope you and your family is fine.(NAME DELETED) is better i tell you the truth , before it will be a shock for you later, but i think it will be a shock for you rightnow.
The missing girl natalee hollaway,I spoke to her , sunday she left with me , my brother and a friend from carlos n' charlies , it was my car like the news said she got in to, I am one of the persons of intrest , i am one the the students they've questioned and released as they claimed in the news .
Let see where to start i don't even know where to begin these last days where so crazy for me i'm very tired haven't slept good in days : The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she begged him and he still said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without or parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee was VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away, so then we were just talking etc, in the car and then she said she wanted to see sharks ,it was by the lighthouse she saw them before that can we go , my friend said ok ,deepak lets go. so on my my to the lighthouse there was music playing and noone talking for a while when i looked in the backmirror my friend and natalee were kissing and touching (his hands etc was in her blouse but nothing nude or against natalees will ) so my brother siad just leave them for a while untill we get to the lighthouse, when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights) so after like 10 min my friend is telling me that natalee fell asleep i said you kidding just wake her up and tell ask her if its holiday inn for sure she is staying so my friend woke her up and confirmed with natalee she was staying at the holiday inn, so i drove to the lobby driveway of holiday inn and then we woke her up, she got out of the car and fell on the floor my friend said damn she fell and then rushed out of the same door natalee came out and picked her up immediately, after she stood up she pushed my friend and said leave me alone or something like that i can't recall , my friend offered to help het to her room she said no. she he stepped in the car and while i was driving away i saw natalee walking towards the lobby and a gentleman with a walkie talkie and black clothes approached her and i think they were talking and i had never seen natalee again sinds.(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby) it was around 2.15 am .monday i came to work normally 4- 11 pm after work i called my friend i said whats up he said ok i'm at the raddison casino meet me there , i said ok so i went there we played poker , we had some drinks and chat and then we had enough and decided that this casino was booring lets go to whyndham hotel casino . so i drove to whyndham and as i was parking my friends dad called him and said the police is at his home with some family members its about the girl you guys went out with yesterday , so my friend said wait there i be there, so we rushed at my friends home and there was the police and nataless family and it was a nightmare sinds then. the police asked us if we knew this girl showed us a picture we said yes thats her , they said she was missing and eyewitness say she was the last seen with you guys . so they asked a few more questions and we said we don't understand we left her at holiday inn lobby drive way how could she dissapear and then natalees stepfather jumped and said ''yes thats because after she went with you assholes she lost'' and then my friends father jumped and said thats enough you can't talk to the kids like that this is not the us your out of you juristiction this is not the way i want you people out of my yard i know the law (my friends father is e judge) so afterwards another family member of natalee suggested to the police if we can id the security gard we said ok. we went there there was no suck security working there as we discribed. so then we were just standing in the lobby there were questions etc. asked by other members , and then me and my friend walked to the car natalees mom was sitting and we said mam you have to believe us we did not do anything with you daughter, she was crying and said i don't believe you 2 , i promise you i will make you life a living hell because of this . anwyas we said we were sorry again ans that we will help in any way possible.i went home 7 pm tuesday, i was then called 2 pm by the police for questioning i went gave a statement they said i was a witness no suspect the same went for my brother and my friend they were questionded and had to sign their statement also , the checked my car and i was clear to go , wednesday i was called again to show them how i drove the route that day ( i could refuse was my right i still decided to go , as did my brother and friend ) the drove us one by one and then we were free to go again.thursday morning my friend called me (he goes to aruba international school and his mother is a teacher there and he is a straight A student ) in panic and said there a re family members here at school and they are sharing flyers and the flyers said : GIRL KIDNAPPED ASK JORAN VANDER SLOOT (thats my friends name ) the principle asked them to leave and they did .so thats my part of the story yesterday and today it was quiet no treathen phoncalls what we got before and i won't mention the crazythings the newspapers etc. writes about us its to much to mention. at home my mom is losing it she is cryimg constantly , my dad bloodpressure got high also his hands are red , my friends home is a disaster also ,his mom is crying constantly also his dad is pretty cool he calmes us down and talks to us also not to worry , my brother is preety cool but on his face you see he is worried , my friend is pretty worried also. i'm pretty worried also , we have 2 lawyers one for my friend and one for me in case we get arrested and charched with something his dad can't defend hin he is a judge and he is too emotional attached .my friend has his graduation this thursday he has to go to the states in july he has a full scholarship. i had to go to vacation also end of this month.many politicians find we should be locked up rightnow.We heard a lot of false alarms that she was dead , she was seen with 2 guys , her hair is cut and is red now ,she was in a crackhouse etc, we were arrested and , my car is by the police we confessed to murder and rape, she went in a restaurant to buy food but none of those were true.So betty that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them

So (NAME DELETED) i will say goodbye now hope you believe me and i pray to god that they find natalee soon and find her well so that this nightmare ends for all of us and they we prove we had nothing to do with this, i hope you pray for all of us say hi to everyone there hope to hear from you soon and may god bless.........

bye bye

Deepak.

1,087 posted on 06/21/2005 7:39:22 PM PDT by maggief

Thats what I said last night. They (the media) has had just about every Aruban attorney, ex LE officer, Aruban newspaper employees, janitors, dishwashers, sewer workers, whoever they can get to fill the slot.

Well, that is just it. The authorities won't reveal any FACTS but they let and probably encourage these people to go out and do damage control, and start unfounded rumors.

1,088 posted on 06/21/2005 7:40:44 PM PDT by Rippersnapper

O
Reilly can be harsh but he really does treat his guests pretty well, maybe that's why I still watch his tv show.

1,089 posted on 06/21/2005 7:43:17 PM PDT by johnb838 (In the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, Amen.)

To: TexKat; maggiefluffs

Back to the Deepak email/statement...

The poster at SM is saying they left off parts of it because it will offend people. (notice there is nothing after she was in the car with them.)

Now this "could be" a copy of Deepak's statement to police that is now floating around. Remember one of the security guards lawyers had a copy of the statements that Deepak and Satish gave police, so it may have leaked. Of course this would be Deepak's statement on how he "felt" things went down that evening and the statement may be loaded with lies.

Both of you know that a lot of stuff is coming out Aruba through the blogs and BB's online (we have no idea what is true and what is not). Even though this looks negative on Natalee, if it is real (and it could be) it reads like a police statement by a suspect who would try to make Natalee look bad.

I did not edit it, I simply copy and pasted it and the no paragraphs also made it read like a police statement.

Also some Arubans are out to make Natalee look bad, so maybe they leaked the police statement on purpose. It seems like the bloggers get information faster these days than the MSM does, so if someone wanted to leak it why not email it out to a blogger or post it on a Blog site for people to grab and pass on. (You would think they would scan it and put it out there as a scan of the original, but the person might not be that swift.)

The way it stands in my mind is that this "might be" a "cut-off" copy of what Deepak wrote in his police statement.

1,090 posted on 06/21/2005 7:43:42 PM PDT by stlnative (I have tons of sharp cheese to hand out to the Natalee thread whiners. :-)

To: maggiefluffs

Have you seen "Dash" on FOX or read her posts on SM? Unless I've missed it she has far from "winced." She's eating up her 15 minutes of fame, more concerned about how she appeared on TV. It's my understanding that "Dash" is a casual friend of Natalee. I'll quit there.

I'll second that!

1,091 posted on 06/21/2005 7:46:46 PM PDT by Rippersnapper

To: maggiefluffs

will read your post (I was busy writing you, when you made it)

1,092 posted on 06/21/2005 7:47:02 PM PDT by stlnative (I have tons of sharp cheese to hand out to the Natalee thread whiners. :-)

There are several things in that email that perplex me. But, what I get is a feeling that this woman (and perhaps all the parents and chaperones) had a very "hands off" attitude about the kids. She said:
"She (her daughter)and Edward are both 18. Neither denied drinking; it was legal for them. Why should they have to "cover their own butts?"

I don't know about other parents, but even if drinking were legal at 18 in another country I would not want my child drinking. Maybe in Italy, some wine, with dinner and our family, that would be it.

However, I also know that when kids go off to college, still only age 17/18/19/20, they drink. It is hard to stop them. But I would never, ever make a statement like this mother did, appearing to approve of her 18 year olds drinking there...while, of course, they cannot do the same in their own country. Unless, this mother allowed her kids to drink at home, too so drinking in another country was not an issue to her, no matter what their age is.

1,093 posted on 06/21/2005 7:49:05 PM PDT by CitizenM ("An excuse is worse than an lie, because an excuse is a lie hidden." Pope John Paul, II)

Reilly can be harsh but he really does treat his guests pretty well, maybe that's why I still watch his tv show.

To be honest the only reason I watch The Fuctor is to hear butthead read his e-mails at the end of his show. I really anticipate and enjoy the ugly e-mails he gets.

I keep e-mailing him myself, but I guess my e-mails are much too pithy for him to read on his show. Lol!!

1,094 posted on 06/21/2005 7:52:50 PM PDT by TexKat (Just because you did not see it or read it, that does not mean it did or did not happen.)

Sorry to hear of your husband's illness. Will say a prayer for him.

1,095 posted on 06/21/2005 7:53:07 PM PDT by Rippersnapper

duct tape can be used for alot of things including windsufing and that would explain why it would be handy in ones car..

YEah, I always keep a roll of duct tape, a roll of plastic sheeting, a shovel, some knives, and a saws-all in my white panel van. Oh, and some prophylactics (gloves and condoms). You never know when they'll come in handy.

1,096 posted on 06/21/2005 7:55:27 PM PDT by johnb838 (In the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, Amen.)

However, I also know that when kids go off to college, still only age 17/18/19/20, they drink. It is hard to stop them.

That says it. I am not going to judge any of these people. We do not know what she said to her daughter, we don't know what went on. I'm just sure she is very happy that it is not her daughter that is missing.

1,097 posted on 06/21/2005 7:58:01 PM PDT by TexKat (Just because you did not see it or read it, that does not mean it did or did not happen.)

brigette do you have the link to this e-mail?

1,098 posted on 06/21/2005 7:59:35 PM PDT by TexKat (Just because you did not see it or read it, that does not mean it did or did not happen.)

To: maggiefluffs

I think it is real (from Deepak, that is) and I see now it is not a statement but reads like one (probably because he had already wrote one with police by time he wrote this.)

I am surprised it took this long to get out.

1,099 posted on 06/21/2005 8:00:07 PM PDT by stlnative (I have tons of sharp cheese to hand out to the Natalee thread whiners. :-)

To: maggiefluffs

What is Betty short for? Anyone check Deepak's Tickle page for this person? I think the email's a hoax but...

So betty that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them

1,100 posted on 06/21/2005 8:01:05 PM PDT by chet_in_ny

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