Posted on 03/09/2005 9:47:25 AM PST by qam1
NEW YORK – They've been part of the American "uniform" for years, worn to casual restaurants, house parties, and some workplaces.
But as jeans become more expensive, they are also becoming more ubiquitous, showing up everywhere from Midwestern churches to Broadway shows. Nothing is off limits, it seems. Or is it? Among those who buy high-priced, designer denim or who simply don jeans frequently - there's debate about where it's appropriate to wear them.
The tug of war over jeans etiquette is particularly prevalent in New York City. Here, people tend to be more creative about their appearance, and are often more demanding about how fashion-conscious people should look, says Dannielle Romano, editor at large for DailyCandy.com, a fashion and trends website.
Many 20- and 30-somethings here have theater backgrounds, for example, and often say it's inappropriate to wear jeans to theater and other cultural performances out of respect for the performers and the surroundings (even though the venues themselves have no official dress codes).
"I am all in favor of the current denim revolution that we are having, but I do feel that there are times when jeans should be left at home," says Lisa Kerson, a jewelry designer in her early 30s, whose parents insisted that she look nice when going to a play or traveling on a plane. "I still get bothered when I see people wearing jeans to the theater, ballet, opera, etc.," she says in an e-mail.
Melissa Popiel also prefers not to see denim at the theater, or at an engagement party. To her, jeans are OK for a house party or a casual dinner, but not for traditionally dressy places. "I don't like going to cocktail parties and seeing people in jeans," says the advertising executive, who's in her late 20s.
Ms. Popiel estimates she owns about 15 to 20 pairs, including premium brands, and has paid as much as $200 for a pair.
Many others are also paying big bucks for their jeans - from $150 to $1,000 or more per pair. Celebrities, in particular, are making jeans their garb of choice for appearances on talk shows and at some red-carpet events.
That, say fashion experts, sets the tone for the masses, who are encouraged by features like one in the Jan. 24 edition of Us magazine, "Hollywood's 10 Hottest Jeans," complete with suggestions for buying "premium" denim ($140 or more).
The concept of designer jeans is not new, however. They were also hot in the 1970s and 80s.
Are these jeans made for parties?
Etiquette experts offer few hard and fast rules about jeans, but among them are the obvious: Leave them in the closet when you're attending a wedding, or if your workplace bans them.
"A lot of it has to do with the appropriateness of the kind of jean you're wearing," says Peter Post, grandson of manners maven Emily Post and author of the book "Essential Manners for Men."
It comes down to determining if the jeans are for fashion or work. A pair that you do yard work in, for example, are "probably not appropriate to be wearing to a restaurant that night," he explains.
Mr. Post has seen men show up in quality restaurants wearing denim, which doesn't bother him as much as how sloppy their appearance sometimes is.He recalls seeing a man dressed in a T-shirt and old rumpled jeans. "He hadn't taken any care to step it up just a notch, to say to the woman he was with, 'You know, you're really important to me. I want to look good. I want you to look at me and be proud of me,' " he says.
Dark denim is making it easier for men to comfortably wear jeans in the evenings, especially since black jeans are no longer "in." But no matter how hip a certain style may be, some places are still off-limits.
"I probably won't wear them to a funeral," says Robert Smith, a 30- something businessman in Rockton, Ill. But in the past few years he's started wearing them everywhere else - to church and to most work-related functions.
Not the fabric but how it's used
The good news for jeans devotees is that standards for judging people on their appearance are loosening a bit - at least among women under 40. A recent study by Cotton Incorporated indicates that Generation X-age women (26 to 39) are less concerned about first impressions when it comes to dressing than they were 10 years ago, and more often are taking the approach that "you can't judge a book by its cover." The reverse was true for women boomer-age and older.
Alice Harris, author of the book "The Blue Jean," attributes the rise of jeans to casual Fridays in workplaces, which shifted the way people viewed dressing.
"We've actually gone back to a much simpler way of looking at it," suggests Post of the changing attitudes. It's not that certain materials, like denim, are bad. "It's what you've done with that material."
And no,the cheesecake was NOT all that good;no matter what they claimed.
In the Runyon books it was Mindy's. In real life it was Lindy's. Thanks for that. You know, I can still remember that tile floor and the bent wood chairs. Just couldn't remember the name. Sadly, the maniacs at the Reise organization tried to bring Lindy's back a few years ago. Failed at it, of course.
Someone tried to bring back Lindy's? Of course it failed!
They tried to bring it back as a fast food or chain place. There still might be one in the Penn Hotel across from Penn Station. The trouble was, nobody even knows what it is/was. It would be like trying to bring back Childe's.
SIGH...I think that nobody else knows anything about what we are talking about,but I don't care. THIS IS FUN...a bit sad,but FUN!
YIKES! I wouldn't eat there on a bet!
Fear not, Lindy's still exists, if not in name, then at least in spirit in any number of out of the way places. So does the Bellmore cafeteria and Zum-Zums. New York remains New York -- for better or for worse.
My husband and I were just recently talking about eating at the Zum Zums,while we were courting. I also used to eat lunch at the one up by Bloomies,when I worked. Such fond memories...................ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh,that hot German potato salad was delish !
I didn't mean there was literally a Zum Zums. However, there is still (literally) a Hambuger Heaven. I meant the 2005 version of Zum Zum still exists...
The hippies changed fashions during the time of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson? Wow, please tell us more.
i differ on that opinion, i am right now sitting in a pair of navy issued dungarees (old bellbottoms) that were washed in salt water for 6 years, these, my friend are the most comfortable jeans ever produced.
i always wear dresspants and a button up shirt when i am flying, its the only way you might get bumped to first or business!
It seems now that the only time you can get a woman to wear a hat at church is on Easter Sunday. So sad. I wear either a hat or a scarf on my head EVERYTIME I go into a church. Doing my hair on Sabbath is too much work.
I have noticed that a lot of CC churches rent space from Adventists. Is there some reason for that trend?
I used to be one of those people who would dress as badly as possible so I wouldn't look like a good target to steal from but not anymore. A lady has to have some dignity.
I like hats. :-)
In the 18th century,Americans followed French and English fashions; we had no designers of our own.Dolly Madison set the trends here,when she was the First Lady and was the first one to do so.Dolly followed the FRENCH school of fashion.
I have a story for you. Once I went to Nordstroms in San Francisco (this was probably 4-5 years ago) and bought a beautiful rabbit fur/felt hat. When I asked them if they sold hat boxes to store them in, they had NO idea what I was talking about. Macy's was the same: those overgrown teenagers there didn't know what a hatbox was either.
Finally, I was in Ross one day, looking for other things and I stumbled upon some hat boxes. Unbelievable. I had to go to a place which probably never sold a decent hat to find a decent hat box.
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