Posted on 12/30/2004 2:08:16 PM PST by Marine Inspector
Carloads of Muslim New Yorkers, all U.S. citizens, were detained for hours by federal agents after they returned from an Islamic convention held in Toronto over the weekend. A Pace University student said she was asked by a border patrol officer at the Lewiston-Queenston Bridge crossing whether the wire in her bra was a weapon. A white Flushing resident said U.S. officials refused to tell her why she was being held for eight hours.
"It's just appalling," said Jean Tassi, 53. "If I didn't have on a head covering, I would have never been stopped."
A U.S. Customs and Border Protection official said agents acted on intelligence that conventioneers may have terrorists in their cars.
"We understand that most of these conferences are legitimate, but it is our duty, it is incumbent on us to verify the identity of everybody entering the U.S. - even citizens," said Kristi Clemens, a Washington spokeswoman. "I understand their frustration."
More than 30 people had attended "Reviving the Islamic Spirit" convention at the Skydome that was billed as a spiritually uplifting event.
"I refuse to be treated like this in my own country," said Miriam Soliman, 20, a Brooklyn-born finance major who said she was interrogated about her underwire bra.
Thanks, Broadsword. I appreciate your input, I was getting a bit ganged up on.
Ain't it the truth!
So, how can we get CA split into two states?
The pass is purely voluntary, but if you go through the border with multiple, unrelated adults in your car, you can expect to be questioned. I am just speculating that the drivers had passes and were bringing through other adults, but it could have been just through the regular lanes. They are working on a fingerprint data base, where you only have to put your thumb on a machine to be cleared to enter the country.
"Oh, really?
This story was about CBP officers violating regulations when dealing with NATIVE-BORN AMERICAN CITIZENS. If they didn't violate regulations, it means they had to meet a standard of evidence or reason to believe one of these citizens was trying to enter illegally."
They are muslims. That is a standard enough.
Better to be safe and inconvenience the Muzeelems than to be sorry and have said Muzylems blow up the George Washington Bridge.
"When a cop pulls over someone, they can't just do it without being able to give a SPECIFIC reason. That's what I'm asking for."
The cop can say: You are a suspicious looking Muslim. You cant get more specific than that. If it seems like racial profiling, remember, Christians, Jews, and Hindus didnt crash planes into the Twin Towers. Muslims did. It's better to be safe than sorry.
I'm NOT saying cops should harass Muslims or stop them JUST b/c they are Muslim. But if there is a suspicious looking one, better to be safe and stop them.
"Part of the beauty of having a Constitutional Republic is to limit the effect of those who would do this. So tell me why weakening our Constitution will HELP us!"
we are not weakening it. We are defending ourselves against the Forces of Darkness (the terrorists). The Muslims will still not be held without trial or anything. Detaining suspicious people for a few hours isnt unreasonable.
"Some would say you can't separate the two. And how do you tell a "true Muslim" from one who isn't. I guess I'm asking for you to clarify exactly what you think the solution is."
We need to prevent the Muslims from taking over our society and destroying our identity, replacing it with an Islamic one.
You asked me for the solution:
1. Arrest Muslims who openly condone, incite, and support terrorism. Deport them. This wont violate the Constitution because these activities are calling for the destruction of the US.
2. Dont let any more Muslims into the US.
3. Get the ones who are here to assimilate.
Directly from the article above:A U.S. Customs and Border Protection official said agents acted on intelligence that conventioneers may have terrorists in their cars.
As you see there was a report, perhaps smuggle was not actually used, but the idea is clear.
My reference to the documents pertains to way back at the beginning of this thread when CBP people mentioned that ANYONE crossing the border should carry identifying documents with them, since it makes life easier. When I have travelled to Canada with my family we carried the children's birth certificates, as well as our own ID's.
if these poor mistreated people had such documents, they should have produced them.
Additionally, there were 30 to 40 of them, and they were all together, processing that many people takes time. I am also sure that they were not the ONLY people at that crossing point that day, how many others passed through. Limited manpower means longer waits
Any reasonable person realizes this. Any reasonable person would see it as a situation that has occurred because we are at WAR, and innocent or not, this group has the same basic beliefs of our enemies, whether or not they espouse the same terroristic beliefs. The CBP were erring on the side of caution, and, as I said before, only 40 out of the 10,000 were inconvenienced. Should we presume that ONLY 40 American citizens drove? Possibly. Then how many others were subjected to vigorous saerches at the airport, where, by the way, most passengers are advised to show up 2 or more hours before their flights because of security.
And any reasonable person would have realized that the horse is not only beaten flat, it's halfway to China.
Face it, Geek, the Religion odf Peace is a becoming a Religion of PIECES, pieces of the bodies of thousands of innocents at their fanatic hands: WTC - Pentagon - Flight 93, Beslan, the US Embassies in Kenya and Nigeria, hundreds of innocent tourists in Egypt, Algeria and Israel, and the list can go on.
You cannot defend the indefensible, especially since the silence from the "Good Muslims" is DEAFENING.
I was using facts from history to show how times changem, and, even though they created a wonderful document for running a democracy, they were men who were not perfect. It does NOT diminish them in any way, although you insist I am somehow slandering them.
I think you need to check the ventilation in your bunker, your oxygen levels seem to getting low.
Hi Former Dodger.
California has MORE conservatives than ANY OTHER STATE IN THE COUNTRY, so you are going to find people like myself who are conservative here.
We go liberal at the polls so often because we also have the largest populations of liberals IN ALL THE STATES. They by my guesstimate have a 6% edge or so.
My frustration here in CA is we seem to lack a base, groundswell or development system to welcome attractive conservative talent.
I think the old guys are hampering the new talent and we get stuck losing far more than we should.
6% can be switched, and we could pull off 11% in our favor in a short time in my opinion, but we have bad leadership and to do that is tough. We have B- talent in a war zone.
Meanwhile, we have terrorists crossing as illegal Mexicans in this state.
I'm shocked that any ever get held at the border.
There is far too little will to let Mexico go through what it must to have a revolution that removes it's current corrupt government so it can get it's next corrupt government. :-)
More importantly: Why are they abondoning Christianity for a "religion: that was responsible for the slave trade that took their ancestors away from Africa, and is responsible for continuing the slave trade in Africa today (as long as they are Christian or Animist Blacks)?
If you converted to Nazism or some radical white supremist group, most likely they'd start watching you pretty close --- and certainly if you convert to islam you need to be watched.
It would be hard to figure out how to split it. You've got the Northern Group in the SF and the Marin area, and then theres the Hollyweirdos, perhaps a circular coastal cut?
You never used the word "slander" but your responses have inferred it. You pressed me on what I meant by my statements, and I endeavored to explain, even things that were painfully obvious, I will try once again.
The references were made to show that the world has changed a lot in 200 years, that attitudes have changed and that the great men that wrote the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were slightly flawed by today's standards but that this in no way diminishes their greatness, nor the greatness of the document.
You have chosen the path of an annoying flea, a nit, an annoyance more than anything else.
If that was your intent, you have accomplished it, but you have only succeeded in making yourself look and sound like a horse's hindquarters.
'night!
Wrong.
See here, for example.
There is no difference between abortion clinic bombers and the terrorist hijackers of September 11th. There is no difference between James Kopp, Shelley Shannon, and Michael Griffin, and John Allen Muhammad and Lee Malvo.
See here, for instance.
How do you explain this quote? "Five of you will chase a hundred, and a hundred of you will chase ten thousand, and your enemies will fall by the sword before you." It's from a holy book of one of the three major monotheistic religions... I'll leave you to explain how it's any different from the verses of the Koran you Islamophobes like to "prove" that somehow Islam is evil.
Five of you will chase a hundred, and a hundred of you will chase ten thousand, and your enemies will fall by the sword before you.
Leviticus 26:8
Sounds just like the Koranic verses the Islamophobes like to post to "prove" that Islam is an evil juggernaut out to destroy everyone else...
See? See?! This means those Jews and Christians are trying to kill everyone! They're only following their "holy" book when they do... /mocking_bigoted_Islamophobes
I just checked. The attacks on the WTC and Pentagon were not a dream. They were real. Some of us care. You are just a gnat in the wind.
There are special passes you can apply for that allows you to use a "fast lane" from Tijuana. Cameras snap you and your car tag as you pull up, recognition software brings up your info.
This is VOLUNTARY - you apply for it, pay for it, and supply prints, pics and vehicle info.
They have a VOLUNTARY program like that for pedestrians also.
"As you see there was a report, perhaps smuggle was not actually used, but the idea is clear."
Oh, right, this from the article that was the only one to report on the bra incident -
So lets see, you believe your interpretation of that, you don't believe the bra or the report that the white woman was held for 8 hours without being told why, but you believe the spokeswoman when she says they needed to verify the ID via prints ( which it appears they could not do, but let them in anyway )
OK, gotcha... now it's all clear....
"if these poor mistreated people had such documents, they should have produced them."
Nothing except you says they didn't - common sense says they did , as without them they would not have been let in in any case.
" this group has the same basic beliefs of our enemies, whether or not they espouse the same terroristic beliefs."
What's a "basic belief" ? - Isn't belief in God a "basic belief" ? Should we check everyone but Atheists ?
"The CBP were erring ...."
HOORAY ! you finally got it !!!! Congradulations !!!!
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