N.Y. Muslim group held at border

NY Daily News ^ | 12/30/2004 | LESLIE CASIMIR

[Former Dodger]

If you took my statement as a whole it makes sense to everyone but you:

So what anti-Muslim Bigotry or violence , equal in scale to what has happened to Americans at the hands of Muslims, has occurred?

Being questioned at the border and asked for fingerprints is equal to having your throat slit, or being rammed into a building at 300 MPH?

Getting yelled at and berated for wearing traditional clothing is equal to being shot, stabbed, mutilated, set on fire and hung from a bridge (Haliburton employees in Fallujah)?

Yes, it is a ridiculous comparison, as are your comparisons, and pronouncements about BIGOTRY in this case.

Muslims ARE free to worship and dress as they like in this country, give me an example of where they have been attacked for it, unlike some Coptic Christians in Jersey City, allegedly.

Prove your point that there is a great plot against Muslims in this country, and ONLY YOU are the one voice to prevent a Holacaust from happening.

YOU are the one who does not get it, and your "logic" kind of proves that:

Your exact words were: New Yorkers have committed crimes, murder in some cases. I suppose that my going in and stealing from your house should be fine (by your logic) because that action wouldn't be equal in scale to what some NYer did to someone else. Great logic.

But NOT MY logic, see above.

I have not blamed a WHOLE group of people anywhere, for anything. I have blamed certain percentages - Islamofascists - for terrorism, and the "silent majority" of Muslims for not speaking out, but I have never said they were one and the same.

And I believe I have answered the question before, but here goes: the Border agent could not just take the word of someone claiming to be a citizen and sought some means to do so, the fingerprints were a way of ascertaining it IF they were on file. The alleged citizen was dressed in traditional Islamic clothes, and some of them were naturalized citizens, meaning they probably had foreign accents.

You're saying that the agent should have just taken their word for it?

What would you have done?

And what is SO wrong with asking for fingerprints?

And I'm still waiting for you to answer many other questions I've posed to you.

Especially the one above, which I'll repeat:

What would you have done, Gondring, if you were one of the CBP agents at that border crossing?

Please explain fully.

[ariamne]

Don't waste your time trying to get reason out of this possessed troll; he is such a possessed maggot. He is trying to bait us all into an open flame war. Have at it!

[ariamne]

PS. I was referring to the Chemist.

[Gondring]

What would you have done, Gondring, if you were one of the CBP agents at that border crossing?

Followed the regulations.

And what is SO wrong with asking for fingerprints?

Probably not too much in and of itself...but that's not what happened here. They didn't ask; they demanded.

And if you have to ask what's wrong with basing our justice system on "prove you're innocent and not a threat," or "round up the usual suspects" or "cast a net broadly and you're bound to catch a legal fish or two," then we're further apart than I imagined.

Why do we think these powers won't be misused, when the past record is so bad? As only one example, we have direct evidence that certain members of our government are not trustworthy when it comes to possession of files (>cough, cough< Hillary FBI >cough, cough<).

And since you asked "please explain fully," I'll go back to my statement above. I'd determine citizenship. If the person were an American citizen, I'd not further investigate the citizen unless I had sufficient reason to believe the citizen was ineligible for entry. Then, should I feel investigation was warranted, I'd be forthcoming with the justification.

If you have a problem with American citizens crossing the border, just because they MIGHT be terrorists based on no specific reason, then do you support police just randomly pulling over and fingerprinting people driving around the country? If not, why not? I bet some American Muslims even go to Mosques....How about fingerprinting everyone who comes out? And of course anyone appearing "Muslim" in a highly populated area should have her bra checked...

If this seems absurd, then consider how absurd it is to think that fingerprinting and checking the bra of someone already known to be American will stop anything at the border. Bra bombs would be far easier to make in the US than to smuggle in, and if you think we should change the regulations, argue that--don't argue that we should support our CBP personnel ignoring the ones that exist. Moral relativism is an unstable platform to stand upon...who determines what rules are okay to break?

[Fred Nerks]

There are more reasons than one why some people become obsessed. If a discussion or debate reaches no conclusions nor concensus, if not even a compromise can be reached, if otherwise quite reasonable, lucid individuals continue to throw oil on the fire, when all the evidence of reality is against them, one must ask: What is the motive?

Could the motive be nothing more nor less than provocation?

The majority of Freepers I believe - including myself - are attempting to learn what islam preaches, what it has in store for us, and what we must do to assure our continued safety and freedom. We do this in the light of open threat and whilst under attack. I am personally against all that islam stands for, for all the obvious reasons...primarily the preaching against the 'filthy infidel' in the mosques by imams imported from Saudi, with their evil wahhabi literature and fatwa's against us; one of which justifies a nuclear attack by terrorists.

Fatwa's which justify 9/11. The Bali Bombing. Mardid, Beslan. Fatwa's taken from the koran. Fatwa's based upon the life of mohammad.

We must continue to tell the truth. Quietly, clearly.

Those whose motives might be to silence us through provocation so a reason can be found to perhaps close down freerepublic by accusing us of hate-speech, must not, never be allowed to succeed, be their obsession religious or political.

[Gondring]

I'm waiting for former waiters to rise up and denounce Steven Michael Ekberg. And if they don't, let's start demanding to search people for castor beans if they look like a former waiter.

[Gondring]

While I agree that provocation is exactly what Islamic terrorists are about, I'm not sure the evidence points the way you're proposing. The provocative accusations seem to start on the anti-Muslim side. Look at the thread about the decapitated body in New Jersey, and see how quickly there was hatred and assumption spewed out against Muslims, before it was determined that it had nothing at all to do with Muslims.

We must be careful to keep our eyes on the REAL enemies, and use stainless methods to nail them, else we are falling into the trap of those who would have us divided.

[Nesher]

All Muslims who ae disloyal to America should be deported. A Muslim who is more loyal to Islam than they are to America should be deported. Muslims who sympathize with terrorists, or even try to find reasons for what the terrorists do, whould be deported.

[SURI]

I agree with you. We ought to wipe out any aggressors, whatever their excuse.

[jan in Colorado]

ping