Posted on 10/01/2004 8:09:48 AM PDT by outlawcam
I was browsing through the posts today about the debate last night, and something jumped out at me that I wanted to bring up for discussion among fellow FReepers.
There are many people here (including me) who recognize polls as valuable tools. There are other people (including me) who recognize that polls can be used to manipulate public opinion. Why else would we FReep unscientific polls? Who else would possibly care what a poll says? Polls don't elect anyone, but votes do, yet we get into a frenzy to discredit those polls that don't agree with us, and we trumpet those that do.
We're in the midst of a battle against terrorists. This battle will take strong values and rational thinking to win. But in order to persuade others to utilize their brains, we appeal to their emotional sense of belonging by manipulating these polls. What does that say about us? What does that say about the voting population that can be manipulated in this way? What credibility do elections have if the difference between the votes candidates receive is based on that manipulation?
I'm of the opinion that polls are virtually never reported responsibly (doing so would take too much space for a regular paper). I also have come to realize that manipulating voters with polls is never right, even if it is in favor of the candidate I support; it does an injustice to our system of government. We are no longer self-governed, but we instead make choices based on what others can manipulate us to do or what we can manipulate others to do. Can that result even be considered self-government?
Therefore, I will never FReep another poll that deals with the candidates of a pending election again. I will, when the situation arises (and there are plenty of these available) reason with those who wish to entertain rational discussions, but I'm done with polls.
I would like to open this up for discussion. Who agrees with me, and who disagrees with me? If you disagree with my assessment of polls, please tell me why we FReep. If you disagree with my decision to not participate, but agree that polls are manipulative, please give me your assessment of the effect poll reports have on self-government.
Hmmm... not very convincing. What if I don't mind the website getting money? "Real results"? What are you talking about? It's meaningless, particularly when you are freeping a poll that the opposition has already freeped.
I agree, and those are the SCIENTIFIC polls, these childish popularity polls are for the same kind of people who watch day time TV.
I guess they give some people the false feeling that they are doing something useful, oh well.
The libs load on the polls and vote heavily.
The lamestream media latches onto any poll that's heavily
loaded with Bush haters and libs. (sorry, redundant)
They then report this dismal news the next day in the news in order to sway public opinion of people who want to be a part of the crowd.
So, we have to insure there's as little of that unchallenged as possible.
That's your business.
"Real results"? What are you talking about?
There's an election on Nov. 2.
Why FReep polls? Because I love pi$$ing on liberal fire hydrants, that's why!
I agree with you; I've been thinking the same thing. It makes it seem like we can't prevail on ideas (which we certainly can) and so have to stuff the ballot boxes.
You pointed out something I already knew: that I selected subjects that I thought this fell under, as well as vanity. You didn't say how this was improper; you only left the impression that it was without an explanation. I responded with my reasoning for why it was proper.
And you got off topic from any debate with your comment "Take the mote out of your own eye".
You accused me of being condescending after you just were. Then you dismissed me entirely and seemed to be leaving. I wasn't debating, just pointing out the truth that you had just been what you accused me of being.
That's debating?
I suppose it's proper to point out hypocricy when it is evident in a debate, but it is off topic. Had I thought you were interested in a debate about the topic, I would have been glad to engage in one with you. You seemed to be offended that I would even broach the subject in a vanity post. You never addressed the topic in any one of your posts in any rational way.
No wonder you support some of the people you do. I can see how you agree with his style. LOL
And I'm the condescending one? Okay.
This is interesting in several respects. First, why do you equate FReeping a poll with stuffing a ballot box? Second, if we don't FReep polls, what is likely to happen in the election?
Online polls are 100% fallacy precisely because they can be "FReeped" or "DUed," ( or whatever those knuckleheads call it, ) or "Whatevered" by whatever-special-interest group. Most of those online polls let you vote multiple times if you know how to manipulate the "cookies" on your computer.....BUT they are SO much FUN! It's like having an FR meeting at vote.com. :-)
Okay. We've got a couple "entertainment purposes only" responses. So you don't think doing it has any practical effect in elections?
"I'm a pretty calm guy."
--George W. Bush
;)
At first I was puzzled by the "Freeping Polls" policy, as you were. Now I think it's only the Freepers' way to show they're not swayed easily but shoggy statistics news media tend to throw in our face in every Western democracy as if it was hard facts and not wild-ass guesses.
I don't think people would SERIOUSLY envision and condone some kind of political manipulation through freeping - if only because people here tend to believe in democracy and be wary of any attempt at mind control.
To show the power of the FreeRepublic.
Great point. In fact, that is at the heart of my objections with polls. It is not so much the polls themselves, because as I stated, they can be useful. They are misused, IMO, by the media, and THAT can be manipulative. Would you agree?
Maybe. Rathergate was a great example of that power, IMO, and that was done through examination and reason--not polls.
I agree.
Freeping is essential.
Do you think they do or could influence elections significantly?
No it takes the tool (the pool) out of the liberals hand if the poll does not go their way. The more you deny your enemy. The easier they are to defeat.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.