Posted on 08/26/2004 4:52:39 PM PDT by AuntB
Rep. Dana Rohrbacher spoke today about his bill to stop various republicans, democrats and special interest groups from bestowing Social Security benefits to illegal aliens on CNN's Lou Dobb's program.
Though Mr. Rohrabacher's bill doesn't go far enough to address the crisis of illegal immigration, he did bring up many interesting points. Legislation, on a bi-partisan effort, is asking to give illegals Social Security benefits only after earning 6 quarters of work credit, whereas U.S. citizens must work 40 quarters to qualify. The absurdity of this is too obvious to debate.
The following is from Rep. Rohrabachers website.
No Social Security for Illegal Aliens
The federal government is thinking about giving away Social Security benefits to illegal aliens.
Various interest groups are pushing for the Social Security Administration to sign a "Totalization Agreement" with Mexico that would entitle illegal aliens to Social Security benefits. With Social Security and Medicare in crisis, this is so irresponsible it takes the breath away.
Congress must act, and act now. I have introduced legislation, H.R. 1631, that would forbid any Social Security credits for illegal aliens or work in violation of the terms of a visa. This would emphatically not affect those who have a legal right to work, such as legal permanent residents or those who have valid work visas.
Estimates vary, but even the lowest figures show adding illegal aliens to the Social Security rolls will cost the Social Security Trust Fund billions and billions of dollars. Seniors should ask why anyone would want to give those dollars to illegal aliens, draining funds available for Social Security and Medicare benefits, and reward those who break the law.
Joel Mowbray, who writes for The National Review and The Washington Times has a very disturbing article on this issue. It should send a chill through the heart of anyone concerned about the solvency of Social Security.
My legislation HR 1631:
Forbids anyone working in the United States illegally from being able to participate in the Social Security system.
This includes not only undocumented (illegal) aliens, but anyone working in violation of the terms of their visa. (Someone on a tourist visa, for instance, is excluded.)
Why this legislation is necessary:
Current law is silent on this issue. While the SSA currently will not grant benefits to workers without a valid Social Security number, this is an administrative policy. Unless Congress acts, this policy can legally be changed by the Social Security agency. The U.S. State Department has been pushing for including illegal aliens in the Social Security system to use as a "carrot" to gain the Mexican government's cooperation on various international issues (the war on terrorism, criminal extradition agreements, etc.)
The 2000 Census results show over 11 million illegal aliens living in the United States.
If even one third of these become eligible for Social Security, it will devastate the system.
* Social Security benefits are weighted to give higher proportional benefits to lower wage workers. Most of these illegal aliens are very low wage earners, so they would receive far more than they paid in. * Joel Mobray from The National Review has estimated potential costs at $345 billion dollars * It will be a bookkeeping nightmare. Many illegal aliens create false Social Security numbers, use the Social Security numbers of others, and share both false and "borrowed" Social Security numbers with many others who use them also. Determining a verifiable work history will be impossible. * Making someone eligible for Social Security would also provide benefits to their spouses and dependent children, and not only Social Security but possibly Medicare -- upping the cost of this still further. * It rewards lawbreaking and encourages further illegal immigration. Some "Totalization Agreements" serve a useful function. Large corporations, both in the United States and abroad, often assign personnel to work in an overseas office for several years. During these years, personnel are "double taxed" -- they pay both Social Security and the equivalent tax in their native countries. Allowing the SSA and foreign agencies to give credit under one system toward retirement makes sense when it involves a limited number of persons working here legally and temporarily.
This is NOT the case with illegal aliens. MILLIONS of LAWBREAKERS with UNVERIFIABLE work histories will be added to the system -- causing a financial crisis.
I fully agree with and count myself among those who object in the strongest possible terms to criminals (and make no mistake about it, that is exactly what illegal aliens are) gaining access to US taxpayer funded programs intended to benefit taxpaying citizens. Schools, welfare, and social security are all high on the list of item off-limits to illegals.
But I wonder if the totalization agreement might be misrepresented or misunderstood.
Let me tell you my experience. In 1995 I went to Korea on an assignment for my long-term US employer. During the first few years I was in Korea, my employer deducted and paid my SS-OA and SS-HI, AND enrolled me in the Korean pension system as well, as was required by law.
In 1999 or 2000 a totalization agreement went into effect between the US and Korea. The effect of this was that my US employer no longer had to deduct and pay into the Korean National Pension plan on my behalf, ending the double taxation.
Similarly, Korean employees of Hyundai or Samsung working in the US no longer needed to contribute to the US Social Security system. Instead, their employers simply keep up their contributions to their home country retirement system.
Of course, those individuals are not entitled to get benefits fromt he US Social Security System any more.
So, I wonder what is different about the Mexico case. It seems to me that under a totalization agreement, LEGAL Mexicans working in the US for Mexican companies would contribute to the Mexican system, whatever that is, and NOT the US Social Security system. Of course, if they are working for AMERICAN companies, then obviously they would be covered just as an American would be, and under all the same rules.
ILLEGAL aliens, i.e. criminal violators of our borders shold be elegible for nothing whatsoever.
I can't quite fathom where the huge additional monetary obligation comes from. Of course, if a MExican or any other national were to leave the US before qualifying for benefits, they shouldn't get any. After all Americans who fail to qualify under the rules don't get anything. Why should foreigners?
"Estimates vary, but even the lowest figures show adding illegal aliens to the Social Security rolls will cost the Social Security Trust Fund billions and billions of dollars. Seniors should ask why anyone would want to give those dollars to illegal aliens, draining funds available for Social Security and Medicare benefits, and reward those who break the law. "
Your reps are found at www.house.gov or www.senate.gov
president@whitehouse.gov
ping
Blame it on Clinton holdover's at the State Department. Or, this could be justified as historically similar on a GDP basis.
Yes and when you are dead you may even get to vote three times dontcha know.
"citizen" is definately the key word. Remember when there used to be such a thing as being a good citizen.
Insanity reigns supreme ...
What more can be said, things are getting worse by the day.
Your post is logical, too bad you don't work for the SSA!
"After all Americans who fail to qualify under the rules don't get anything. Why should foreigners? "
This is a hard one to swallow and there are going to be a lot of shocked people, but here's another sad fact of the SSA. Say you are 45 years old. Paid into SSA for 30 years. Your parents are sick and old, so you take 5 years off to care for them. Boom!! Hit by a bus, crippled for life. Guess what......ONLY approximately the last 5 years (NOT the last 5 years worked....the last few years period ), count toward disability benefits....NONE of that 30 years count. NONE of it.
Americans need to get involved. Unless they vote these idiots out of office, this will continue.
"The Dems are traitors and the GOP is too, it would seem. Maybe it is time for an American Nationalist Party."
No - I did not know there was a Nazi group with this name already. I am NOT advocating their views.
"Seniors should ask why anyone would want to give those dollars to illegal aliens, draining funds available for Social Security and Medicare benefits, and reward those who break the law."
Not just seniors but those of us currently paying into this crap shoot who already don't anticipate seeing a thing. Providing to illegals will be adding insult to injury as it were. So much for those who said well we need more Mexicans to keep SS solvent (wrong headed position to begin with).
This is difficult to understand --- who came up with this 6 quarters idea? And the only illegals who pay into social security did so by committing felony document fraud --- use of stolen identification documents --- and why should they benefit from committing a felony crime? Or at least it is a crime if an American citizen commits it.
Apparently Mexico's pension plan is going bankrupt much earlier than ours so this is one big huge bailout so the elites won't be run out of power there.
"Sorry, that's a little too abstract an idea for me to wrap my mind around."
Most of our elected and non elected officials seem to understand it perfectly!!! Obviously it benefits them rather than us.
Yes especially since they didn't keep their own pension system solvent --- Mexico's social security type system is going under before our own does --- why would anyone possibly really think they can save ours when they couldn't save their own?
"nation collapsed because it became diluted with outsiders who didn't assimilate and never saw themselves as being Roman. I fear that we are heading down that same road, for the same reasons."
It does appear that way.
"Citizen" is so exclusive (sarcasm)."
We are mutli-cultural don't ya know? We used to be a melting pot.
"You're showing your age."
Hardly . . . I look pretty good for the age, of course I should, I am only 29 (last year I can honestly say that) :-)
Besides --- how can someone prove it was themselves and not someone else who was fraudulently using a stolen social security number? What happens when 10 illegals claim to have used the same number for the same 6 quarters? Do all 10 get full benefits?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.