Fascism at Berkeley-Muslim Student Association out in full force to disrupt Daniel Pipes' lecture

Chronwatch.com ^ | February 16, 2004 | Cinnamon Stillwell

[Luis Gonzalez]

Here's one custom-made for you.

A Grand Strategy Of Transformation

[Coroner]

Just type Turkey in the search and you will find that nonmuslims dont have it so good in Turkey.

[Luis Gonzalez]

Look at the charts, there are great numbers of Muslims in both those countries.

You all equate "Muslim countries" to countries in the Middle East, not realizing that the vast majority of Muslims live OUTSIDE those countries.

The problem is a geo-political one.

[Luis Gonzalez]

So, why live there then?

Is your concern how people in Turkey are treated, or how Turkey conducts itself as part of the larger world?

Personally, I wouldn't live in Turkey.

[tkathy]

Simple solution. ALL so called moderate Muslims should speak up. All the time. They have a duty to their children and their own future.

[nuconvert]

Yeah.
It's good the radicals reveal themselves. Shows people the difference between the moderates and them. Especially when Pipes is there saying it in their faces.

It seems to me these radical groups shouldn't be allowed on campuses. Especially during these times.
I don't know if you read Yoni's report on his experience a few days ago, at a speech given on his college campus by an ex-Black Panther member . It's worth a read. I hope he informs every other university in the country about what that woman said and how she and her cohorts acted afterward. Here's a link:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1077680/posts?page=19#19

[Valin]

We will defend the peace by fighting terrorists and tyrants. We will preserve the peace by building good relations among the great powers. We will extend the peace by encouraging free and open societies on every continent." It's worth comparing these goals with the three the Clinton administration put forth in its final NSS, released in December 1999: "To enhance America's security. To bolster America's economic prosperity. To promote democracy and human rights abroad."

The differences are revealing. The Bush objectives speak of defending, preserving, and extending peace; the Clinton statement seems simply to assume peace. Bush calls for cooperation among great powers; Clinton never uses that term. Bush specifies the encouragement of free and open societies on every continent; Clinton contents himself with "promoting" democracy and human rights "abroad." Even in these first few lines, then, the Bush NSS comes across as more forceful, more carefully crafted, and—unexpectedly—more multilateral than its immediate predecessor. It's a tip-off that there're interesting things going on here.

Very good! Thanks for the link.

Strange. I didn't see anything in this piece about nuking anybody, banning any religion or deporting people because of their faith. Of course I just scanned it

[wtc911]

Yep, there are large numbers of muslims in both India and the Philippines but neither one can be honestly classified as a muslim country and both are actively at war with those same muslims to whom you want to attribute democratic stability.

There are over 22 intra-border conflicts in the world right now. All but a very few are muslim incited, including those in muslim countries like Egypt which has seen over 1200 deaths in the past ten years.

And keep you assumptions about my knowledge of the world to yourself. At no time did I ever equate muslim country with the mideast, as you assert we "all" do. I know full well that muslims are almost everywhere. I also know that wherever they are there is also violence inspired by them.

[Valin]

A thought.

"The problem is a geo-political one."
We (and the administration) are talking politics(if that's the right word), the nuke Mecca crowd are talking theology.

[wtc911]

LG...you cite Turkey as having a modern history of elections where power is turned over to the winner. What about the four coups d'etats in Turkey since their first free election in 1950....1960, the elected leader overthrown and executed....1971, same thing....1980...the bloodless coup of 1997?

That qualies for you as a stable democracy? As a shining example?

[<1/1,000,000th%]

Another nut-job hovered near the entrance shouting to anyone who would listen about how Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr. ''were against Zionism.''

Nice post!

And that's the Reverend Martin Luther King Jr.

[nuconvert]

Did either of you actually read this article?

Pipes is trying to make the following points:

"He even brought up the fact that members of the MSA are currently under investigation for possible ties to terrorism.

"Their reaction to his speech was telling.

"When Pipes brought up the need to support moderate Muslims over those who subscribe to militant Islam, they booed.

"When he brought up the need to improve the status of women in Islamic countries, they booed.

"When he warned that peace in the Middle East would never be achieved as long as the Palestinians continued to subscribe to a ''cult of death,'' they booed.

"When he mentioned Middle East Studies professors who have been arrested under terrorism charges, they booed.

"When he discussed the need to combat Islamic terrorism, they booed.

"When he referred to the perpetrators of the 9/11 attacks as subscribers to militant Islam, they booed "

Are you trying to argue with Mr.Pipes'? He's pointing out the the fact that there are radicals and moderates. And that they differ a great deal. You think you've studied this issue more than he has?
Isn't it clear from the reactions he gets that there are big differences between the two?

[nuconvert]

The "nuke Mecca" crowd are talking bigotry.

[Rebelbase]

"We should target these countries with a series of thermonuclear detonations until the muslim populations are zero."

No thanks, take your blanket hate statement to LP or other bigoted forum.

[evad]

Sound familiar

Yup..sounds lie the korean, err koraan, err queeran...err wtf it's called.

[tubavil]

No islam, no terror.

[Tailgunner Joe]

What is the secret of Turkish democracy?

The secret is that Kemal Ataturk was anti-Islamic and banned public displays of piety such as the veil and fez because they were sign of "ignorance" and "backwardness."

Turkey is democratic despite its Islamic nature.

[Luis Gonzalez]

Religious fanatics on either side are the enemy.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"The secret is that Kemal Ataturk was anti-Islamic and banned public displays of piety such as the veil and fez because they were sign of "ignorance" and "backwardness."

Whatever works.

We ban the Ten Commandments from public display.

Hmmmmmm...