The Garden Thread - July, 2025

July, 1, 2025 | Diana in WI/Greeneyes in Memoriam

[Diana in Wisconsin]

The MONTHLY Gardening Thread is a gathering of folks that love soil, seeds and plants of all kinds. From complete newbies that are looking to start that first potted plant, to gardeners with some acreage, to Master Gardener level and beyond, we would love to hear from you.

If you have specific question about a plant/problem you are having, please remember to state the Growing Zone where you are located.

This thread is a non-political respite. No matter what, you won’t be flamed, and the only dumb question is the one that isn’t asked.

It is impossible to hijack the Gardening Thread. Planting, Harvest to Table Recipes, Preserving, Good Living - there is no telling where it will go - and that is part of the fun and interest. Jump in and join us! Send a Private Message to Diana in Wisconsin if you'd like to be added to/removed from our New & Improved Ping List.

NOTE: This is a once a MONTH Ping List, but we DO post to the thread all throughout the month. Links to related articles and discussions which might be of interest to Gardeners are welcomed any time.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

That does it! I’m gonna go count my stash. ;)

[MomwithHope]

I actually don’t know if I will make it again. Hubby and I had fun collaborating on the recipe, juicing, testing adding, etc.

[Pollard]

I remember the name Dunstan from my fruit/nut orchard research.

History of the Dunstan chestnut and chestnuts in general.

https://chestnuthilltreefarm.com/learning-center/dunstan-chestnut-history-2/

Funny how a fungus from the Orient that destroyed the American chestnut now has us trying to grow our own chestnut market using hybrids of oriental chestnuts. Seems like most of our invasive species came from China.

The American chestnut used to get pretty big.

MO Center for Agroforestry has been working good marketable chestnuts for a while now so I'm leaning towards their varieties. PKQ is a fairly new one that looks very promising for nut production. Gideon, Qing and Mossbarger are some others.

Yeah, chestnuts are supposed to be eaten fairly fresh but can be refrigerated for a little while. Meanwhile all the stores have them sitting out at room temperature and who knows how old they are. Mostly a holiday season gimmick.

Hazelnuts are something else I've looked into. Rutger's has been working on improved varieties since the late 90s. Been looking into various fruit trees too but for some reason, don't have any notes on persimmons. I have the word persimmon in a note but nothing more. Guess I hadn't gotten around to it yet.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

I get that, FRiend.

[Qiviut]

Sent to my niece - she loved it.

[Qiviut]

We have 3 chestnut trees on our place. The largest one died last year after 2 years of drought. The other 2 bloomed again a couple of weeks ago & we do get chestnuts, but the squirrels beat us to them. The blooms have a smell that I don’t particularly care for, but the trees are pretty with the blooms on them.

We also have hickory trees on one side of the property (mostly on the neighbor but branches are over our fence). We have 3 or 4 hickories on us at the back of the property. The hickory trees are loaded with nuts this year - the squirrels will be happy.

[Pete from Shawnee Mission]

Pollard; I have not grown Rutgers, but I have seen pictures of them and glad you had a chance to try a ripe one!

I have tried San Marzano and 10 Fingers of Naples and Principe Borghese and there were lots of small tomatoes and problems with blossom end rot, at least in my garden.

Heirloom Amish paste from Seed Savers, indeterminate, produced large paste tomatoes which Mrs. Pete said were the best tasting in the garden that year. If I had a lot of room for indeterminate tomatoes they would be a good choice for canning and eating. They were not as productive as other paste varieties which you would expect with a Heirloom variety.

Good Determinate type Picus F1 (Hybrid Roma type paste, Stokes Seed) and Yaqui VFFNA Hybrid Tomato (Blocky large from Tomato Growers supply). Both grow to 36-48 inches and will need support because of the large number of fruit. I would rate the taste at perhaps 7 out of 10. (These are canning varieties) Amish paste would be 9 or 10. Both of these varieties handle heat well. (Note that Yaqui is large and blocky and it was difficult to push it whole into small lidded Ball jars.)

https://www.stokeseeds.com/ca/picus-vf-tswv-hybrid-plum-tomato-329d-group

https://tomatogrowers.com/products/yaqui-vffna-hybrid?_pos=1&_sid=20fa1bac5&_ss=r

[Pete from Shawnee Mission]

Yes Maam! I pick at 20-30% color break. The rational for gardeners to pick early is to avoid insect and animal damage and perhaps something like sunscald. You balance that against some or possible loss of some sugar and flavor against harvesting undamaged fruit. (I think the loss is minimal.)

Sugar content and flavor.

A large amount of the sugar in a tomato is produced in the leaves and transported to the tomato. Some conversion of starch to sugar will occur after picking but picking early may reduce sugar content.

Flavor and color will continue to change after picking. Tomato growers pick when tomatoes are still green because of the handling and shipping characteristics. Less likely to be damaged when boxed and shipped. They then flood a storage area or shipping truck with ethylene to force artificial ripening so the tomatoes look ripe when displayed at the grocery store.

Gardeners have more control over when to pick. "Color Break" is the technical term for the development of skin coloring in a tomato. For gardeners a good rule is to pick only after you have 20 -30% of the tomato surface displaying color and allow the ripening to consider in a window or kitchen counter. The flavor will continue to develop. ****Note....Some varieties produce more sugar than others. (Yellow skinned tomatoes according to one source.) Annannas Noire (Black pineapple) is a very sweet variety that is not black but sort of green/red mottled color which is noticeably sweet, at least to me. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tomato....Vegetable or Fruit? "In the everyday language of people, a tomato is a vegetable, while from the botanical point of view, it is a fruit. This topic was a question of debate during the 19th century at the Supreme Court in the USA, with the case of Nix vs. Hedden where the court judged the tomato as a vegetable due to the manner of its use [3]." It also discusses tomato coloration and sugar content and at least in their collection, it was yellow skinned varieties.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

I tried ‘Yaqui’ last season and would also recommend.

San Marzano, 10 Fingers of Naples and Principe Borghese have been past favorites, too.

I am really missing tomatoes this season. I have a total of five on the kitchen counter - when I should already have five DOZEN in my stew pot! :(

It’s a combo of the weather and the varieties I planted this season. Who knew it would be a Monsoon season?!?! Obviously not me, or Farmer’s Almanac.

[FamiliarFace]

*** Who knew it would be a Monsoon season?!?! Obviously not me, or Farmer’s Almanac.***

On this topic, I should mention what happened the other day. We invited friends over for dinner on Sunday, 5 pm. This couple has a very busy schedule between work, travel, and a large family. So we usually book a get-together about 4-6 weeks ahead of time.

Well, on Sunday morning, my weather app said 99% chance of rain starting around 5 or 6. It looked like there was a HUGE storm headed our way on the radar. I thought to myself, “just great! Hubby will get soaked while grilling the chicken” and “I better find an umbrella for him to use.”

Periodically checked the weather app, and it continued to say 99% chance of rain. As it got closer to the arrival time, the sky was getting cloudy. It has been clear and sunny most of the day. I thought, “I hope they can get inside before it starts pouring.”

Well, wouldn’t you know, I checked the weather app again, and THIS TIME, it indicated that there was only a 5% chance of rain, and that it has totally moved south of us without hitting us at all!! Nary a drop!

We did stay inside the sunroom for most of the time, other than about 30 minutes which we spent outside chatting and sharing updates on our families. We had a wonderful time as usual. Hubby grilled the chicken and I tweaked a southern bbq sauce with some fresh peaches from our orchard market. Fresh corn on the cob picked on Friday morning and green beans (also picked fresh on Friday morning) almandine rounded out the dinner. More rave reviews.

Our friends brought over homemade “Better than Sex” cake for dessert. Positively scrumptious! (Funny, I had never heard of this cake.)

It was a fun evening with no rain! Who knew? Not the weather guessers!

[FamiliarFace]

Thank you for the color break concept. I will have paid more for this cherry tomato plant than what I think it will produce. But then, I wouldn’t have had the fun of watching it grow and tending to it.

The shishitos have been the star of the summer. They’ve needed little attention, but are producing quite well. As an experiment, I planted two in the ground and two in large pots. The two in large pots are producing even better than the ones in the ground, so I will likely do all of them in pots next summer.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

Fun plant propagation hacks:

https://x.com/i/status/1950176217761460679

[Pollard]

I had forgotten about Amish Paste which is something I wanted to grow some day but I never intended to grow a paste type this year. One thing I did do this year was round up and clean every canning jar that had no contents. Next I need to clean out the ones with contents.

Next year seems like a good time into get back to canning. Will have to start shopping for a food mill/strainer. Start Amish Paste from seed in the shed. Pot them up and put them in the tunnel when it's warm enough and then transplant outside the tunnel when it's warm enough out there. Might have to go wild blackberry picking again. I made blackberry jam several years ago but it was way too much work shoving that stuff through a small mesh strainer by hand. Guess I was into laborious food processing for a spell because I made homemade bratwurst that same year.

Anyone got any recommendations for a food mill/strainer?

I know Victorio used to be a good economy version that had the ability to be motorized. The brand name changed to VKP but I don't know if that affected quality. Or was it the Victorio grain mill that was popular with the preppers? Now that I think of it, Country Living Grain Mill was the nice one but Victorio grain mill would do the job iirc.

I do know I've watched a video of a guy using and reviewing a Victorio food strainer for tomatoes and it seemed to work good. Skin and seeds out the side and pulp out the end into a bowl. Wonder if I can adapt it to my Oster KC power base to motorize it.

I've got a collection of Oster Kitchen Center power bases and attachments including blender, mixer, large SS bowl, mixing paddles, dough hooks, meat grinder with sausage stuffer tip, ice cream maker, veggie processor that shreds, slices and cuts french fries - short ones.

Can't believe they never made a food strainer. They made a juice extractor so I might have to get one. In fact, I see a few attachments I don't have that would complete my collection. They even made a pasta maker that will do thick or thin spaghetti, fettuccine(or egg noodles), lasagna and rigatoni. Looks quite interesting pumping out rigatoni.

Tractor tires are supposed to be here today so I guess I'm going into mechanic/welder mode.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

I got the rain shower we needed overnight so I can skip watering this morning. Score!

Looks like dry and cooler weather after tomorrow, so I will be well acquainted with the garden hose again before long. So far this season it’s only been used for a radiator flush for the big F-350, LOL!

Canning the ‘Jalapeno Pickle Relish’ this morning, and my other Mrs. Wages mixes are to be delivered today, so more pickles to come.

[FamiliarFace]

Today is a watering day for me. Not getting enough here. Plus more yard cleanup.

[Pollard]

Yeah I regret trying to grow anything under the tunnel roof. I should have just worked on the soil and tunnel structure.

My one shishito plant was the only success. I do need to peek at the habeneros. I pulled two of them because they never even successfully made a flower. They tried but the flowers quickly dried up from the heat and fell to the ground. The other two did have a few peppers but I haven’t checked them out in over a week.

Chopped down the celery to resprout and it resprouted with a full blown case of downy mildew so they’re coming out.

One big sheet of black poly for all of August, then a good tilling and then repeated shallow cultivating for new grass/weeds that pop up would probably take care of a lot of things above and beyond getting rid of grass/weeds. I can even put the micro-sprinklers back up to make sure every grass/weed seed near the surface sprouts so I can kill it.

Maybe I should resurrect the little front yard garden with strictly raised beds so I have a place to grow a little something while I finish the tunnel proper, soil and all.

Black poly for August
Uncover it
Till and smooth it
Black poly back on for Sept
Uncover it
Light overhead watering sessions
Repeated shallow cultivation until stuff stops sprouting
Shallow cultivation to add amendments

Lowes, 10x100 black 6 mil poly is $70 or 10x25 in 3 mil for $15 ea. I’ve heard that thinner is better because it conforms to the ground for better contact and heat transfer.

[Qiviut]

The load of dirt is out of the trailer & in the raised beds. One load is barely enough for 2 beds so I will have to haul another for beds 3 & 4. I figure adding compost will fill the beds to where I want them.

I pulled the truck & trailer around next to the beds & shoveled straight into bed #2. That’s the efficient way to do it, but it was in full sun & I am soaking wet & slightly overheated. I still need to get dirt out of the trailer corners & broom the tarp, but I am “done for sun” today. Once the shade hits late afternoon/evening, I’ll finish cleaning up the trailer & maybe plant something.

My niece suggested I grow a tomato or two in buckets next year. She has a small flower farm, some in raised beds, some in tilled soil. She got a load of 50% topsoil & 50% compost this year, but the topsoil has quite a bit of clay in it - dahlias aren’t thrilled. My first load of topsoil had no compost & a high % of clay. This 2nd load from a new source is much better. Anyway, she’s growing more & more veggies in buckets & likes doing it that way. I have a good spot for some buckets so maybe I’ll try it next year.

A cousin’s fiance, who farms nearby, has a large garden. One of his daughters planted 3 okra plants & he’s at a loss what to do with them. The first he picked were too large & therefore tough. I sent info for picking much smaller & offered to do pickled okra. He just got new chickens today so I’m not sure he’ll have time for picking okra! I have never done pickled okra, but the instructions are easy & I have jars, vinegar, spices, etc. already, if I can just get okra. I love okra flowers- would grow them myself, just for the blooms.

[Qiviut]

PS - I did straw bale gardening one year & it was pretty successful - that’s another option to buckets. The only thing I would do differently is make some sort of wood & wire frame to keep the bales together better during the growing season. I used what was left for compost in the raised beds the following year. I have a great, flat spot for a straw bale garden setup.