Posted on 10/25/2023 10:16:51 AM PDT by ransomnote
What are you talking about?
One piece of advice for dealing with someone who has obvious expertise in science: don't spring on them stuff you read on an antivax/anti-science website and expect them to know immediately what you are talking about.
The way such things *should* go down is that you would link to a blog that claims that Lancet has been discredited forever because of X, Y, and Z. Then I would read the blog and read the relevant Lancet articles. Afterwards, I would return and explain to you how the blog misrepresented whatever happened with respect to Lancet and what really is going on. Only then, when you cannot refute a single word of my explanation, would you get all upset and call me a Big Pharma shill/CDC hack/whatever.
This is how my interactions with people who have been hoodwinked by antivax/anti-science charlatans usually go. I have provided this sequence of events for your future reference.
I'm not buying into conspiracy theories despite your frequent accusations.
They lied. Period.
They have destroyed the trust people put in them like any liar would.
It s not conspiracy theory territory to conclude that if they were caught doing it once or twice, that they've done it before and will do it again.
It's common sense and only someone naive or totally gullible would just go on blindly trusting someone who has proved themselves untrustworthy.
Trust needs to be earned. It's not a God given right, and once it's lost is VERY difficult to get back again.
By your specious logic, cigarettes are safe too.
I don't trust Big Pharma scientists any more than tobacco scientists.
Science is not based on consensus; nor on credentials.
Nice try, troll.
EXCELLENT POINT, I smoked for 40 years and didn’t drop dead either or contract lung cancer!! SOME people would love react to the vaccine SOME will not, there have been a whole lot of athletes having an adverse effect and dying of heart attacks!!
I smell (another) govt plant.
They have destroyed the trust people put in them like any liar would.
Once again, what are the specifics? What did the journal The Lancet say that was a demonstrable lie? If they lied, then certainly, you should be able to say what the specific lie(s) is (are) or at least provide a link. You can't just post random unsubstantiated claims that The Lancet lied and expect to be convincing.
Oh, BTW, posting such claims is a big indicator that you are prone to believing conspiracies, whether you deny believing in conspiracies or not.
A little information about not only The Lancet, but every other reputable medical/scientific journal in existence. These journals exist to publish research reports written by scientists and research-trained MDs working in a variety of public and private organizations all over the world. The content of those research reports is not written by journal staff, nor do they represent the opinions of the journal staff. So, the claim that a journal "lied" is a bit puzzling, to say the least. This is like saying the office supply catalog I just got in the mail lied.
The Lancet’s reputation continues to decline: Whether its reputation in the medical field will survive its conduct relative to COVID remains questionable
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/3979181/posts
Now the world’s most famous medical journal the Lancet is accused of costing lives by sitting on a study showing human transmission of Covid-19 that was suppressed by China
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3978984/posts
The Lancet has made one of the biggest retractions in modern history. How could this happen?
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3852581/posts
A Second Major COVID-19 Study Is Retracted; First the Lancet, Now the New England Journal of Medicine
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/3852676/posts
Lancet Formally Retracts Fake Hydroxychloroquine Study Used By Media To Attack Trump
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3852150/posts
The Lancet casts doubt over its own Hydroxychloroquine study
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3851745/posts
And there are more than that if you do a keyword search on *Lancet*.
Between these examples and what we know of peer review in regard to the whole climate change hoax, peer review itself has also been discredited as well.
The scientific community is nothing more than the old boys club back slapping and high fiving each other for promoting whatever the official narrative is at the moment.
all came out.
Especially when the deleterious effects of the clot shots showed up.
Not conspiracy theories.
Spoiler alerts.
Right. There happens to be a ton of high quality research that shows the deleterious effects of using tobacco. Our everyday observations are consistent with this scientific opinion, since most of us probably know someone who died from a tobacco related illness, even though less than 10% of the population uses tobacco. My own father died of a lung disease caused by smoking.
On the other hand, the only "evidence" we have that vaccines are dangerous comes from professional antivaxxers who keep telling us they are dangerous. They can produce no scientific studies to support their claims. If we are to believe some of their wildest claims, everyone who got vaccinated is supposed to die soon. (The exact timeframe keeps getting pushed back, as we keep failing to die.) The US has 332 million people, of whom 81% or 270 million or 4 of every 5 people have received one dose of vaccine.
So, if the predictions of widespread death due to vaccine were based on the results of actual scientific studies, I would expect to see people dropping dead all the time by now. It's been over two years since the vaccines were rolled out, but where are all the dead people? Why aren't the stores empty when I go shopping? Why aren't most of my friends and family dead? Why aren't I dead?
You see, when scientists have established that something is harmful to health, there is a strong likelihood that you actually know or know of people who have died from that thing. But when a bunch of kooks make a claim that something is dangerous despite a complete lack of scientific evidence, you won't actually see or hear of anyone dying from it, because that's not happening.
Oh, I know that professional creators of antivax rhetoric love to use that word "consensus" to try to discredit scientists. However, when scientists reach a consensus, it means that they are all doing research and coming up with consistent results. For example, it rained this morning. If I were to go around asking my neighbors, they would probably tell me that the ground is now wet. If I find that 100 people in my neighborhood agree that the ground is wet, the fact that they have a consensus does NOT invalidate the fact that the ground is wet. It means that they all made the same observation.
Science is about doing research and obtaining results that are consistent with the theory and previous research in the field.
Oh, FYI. Most "Big Pharma" activity is centered around manufacturing and sales of drugs. Most early drug development takes place at research institutes, biotech companies, and universities. There is quite a complicated process involved in taking an early drug candidate and getting a pharmaceutical company to sponsor further development. So, your distrust of "Big Pharma" scientists basically means that you distrust any scientist who does research. The bottom line is that just about all research is aimed towards the development of better drugs, no matter who does the research where.
You are a walking, talking advertisement for the reproducibility crisis.
In particular when one is dealing with complex biological systems where even the assay methods are subject to systematic limitations and uncertainties, to say nothing of the large number of unknown confounding variables, which are only (hopefully) mitigated by using large numbers of test subjects.
You know, like the safety study for some clotshot related item in NEJM which used 8 mice.
all came out.
Especially when the deleterious effects of the clot shots showed up.
Pfizerbucks $hot $hills = 0
And, now, there's this....
Yet another "we told you so" moment from the "antivaxx conspiracy theorists" who are the only ones that seem to care what happens to people.
And yes, we were silenced.
H/t @real_GGoswami https://t.co/40y1HtpyGT pic.twitter.com/l3GRUo7E7A— Jikkyleaks 🐭 (@Jikkyleaks) October 26, 2023
Hindsight is always 20/20, dingbat. The tobacco scientists hid behind the "not PROVEN!" excuse that you shot shills are, until the non-controlled data became too much to ignore, and honest studies were done.
But even with that, many of the harmful effects of smoking only manifested over decades.
But somehow, even your own father dying from smoking-related causes, doesn't keep you from raising your eyebrows and archly taunting "Where are all the dead bodies?" only a couple years after the mass introduction of the clot shots; and after a rash of notable deaths and other never-before-seen happenings, such as multiple on-air personalities passing out or having seizures on camera, or world-class athletes personally discussing their cardiovascular side effects within a day or a couple of days of the clot-shots.
Get rekt, troll.
Nice try.
Sadly people on the Internet pushing this professor’s work as being exonerated are either ignorant, willfully ignorant or insufficient intellect to understand.
It is what is is.
The full text of the letter to the editor published in The Lancet is this:
We are public health scientists who have closely followed the emergence of 2019 novel coronavirus disease (COVID-19) and are deeply concerned about its impact on global health and wellbeing. We have watched as the scientists, public health professionals, and medical professionals of China, in particular, have worked diligently and effectively to rapidly identify the pathogen behind this outbreak, put in place significant measures to reduce its impact, and share their results transparently with the global health community. This effort has been remarkable.
We sign this statement in solidarity with all scientists and health professionals in China who continue to save lives and protect global health during the challenge of the COVID-19 outbreak. We are all in this together, with our Chinese counterparts in the forefront, against this new viral threat.
The rapid, open, and transparent sharing of data on this outbreak is now being threatened by rumours and misinformation around its origins. We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin. Scientists from multiple countries have published and analysed genomes of the causative agent, severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) and they overwhelmingly conclude that this coronavirus originated in wildlife as have so many other emerging pathogens. This is further supported by a letter from the presidents of the US National Academies of Science, Engineering, and Medicine13 and by the scientific communities they represent. Conspiracy theories do nothing but create fear, rumours, and prejudice that jeopardise our global collaboration in the fight against this virus. We support the call from the Director-General of WHO to promote scientific evidence and unity over misinformation and conjecture. We want you, the science and health professionals of China, to know that we stand with you in your fight against this virus.
We invite others to join us in supporting the scientists, public health professionals, and medical professionals of Wuhan and across China. Stand with our colleagues on the frontline!
We speak in one voice. To add your support for this statement, sign our letter online. LM is editor of ProMED-mail. We declare no competing interests.
I can assure you that in no way did The Lancet's decision to publish this letter to the editor damage The Lancet's reputation or credibility among the research community.
I will point out that the scientists of China are comparable to any of their US or European counterparts. Many of them were actually educated in the US. We must never conflate the work of the Chinese scientists with the early efforts of the communist Chinese government to shut down and persecute the scientists and physicians who did the early work to characterize the outbreak and identify the causative agent.
As the letter authors pointed out, by the time this letter was published on March 07, 2020, there was already a solid body of evidence indicating that the outbreak occurred because of an animal to human transmission of a novel coronavirus occurring at the Huanan seafood market. By now, more than three years later, the body of evidence has grown considerably.
The ProMED-mail mentioned at the end of the letter is a website run by the International Society for Infectious Diseases in which infectious disease experts around the world inform each other about disease outbreaks and new developments on existing infectious diseases.
Here is a helpful hint: never expect the scientific community to validate antivax/anti-science conspiracies and rhetoric. It's not going to happen.
Due to the fact that this post is already several hundred words long, I am not going to discuss the other FR links that you posted. However, if you really insist, I am fully capable of discussing them. Just not now. It takes time to track down and read information, and I have other things to do.
And in comes another $hot $hill in a futile attempt to earn his salary.
I didn’t expect anything but an off hand dismissal of other sources from you.
Anything that goes against your or the medical community’s narrative is by default discredited by you all.
You are now DEM
Because this is state-of-the-art SCIENCE™!
Get rekt, troll.
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