Posted on 10/19/2023 8:17:33 AM PDT by ConservativeInPA
There’s a war that Americans refuse to wage. It is a war of epic proportions and with grave consequences. If it is ever fought it could destroy many political careers. Businesses will be effected. Hard working Americans will lose their jobs. Entire industries could go away. America would be turned upside down. (How’s my hyperbole doing?)
Interest.
American interest.
What are these? How do you define an interest? Why doesn’t anyone in Congress want to debate what an American interest is?
Our elected representatives along with the administrative state reflexively reacts. The immediate response to the Hamas terrorist attacks on innocent Israelis was to call to give aid. I suppose aid sounds nicer than spending money that we don’t have and making our children debt slaves.
Tonight President Biden is going to address the nation and ask for $100 billion in spending on top of our current $7 trillion yearly spending. Biden will do that without a discussion of what is in the interest of the American people. There will be no alternatives discussed other than when Congress responds to this request. The debate will be for how much more money that we don’t have that needs to be spent above Biden’s $100 billion request.
There won’t be a discussion about what is in the American interest. They cannot even define that. There won’t be a discussion about a plan. The plan is to spend your money. We don’t even know Israel’s plan so we can debate its effectiveness and whether it aligns with our interests.
It is a reflex. It has been done over and over. It happened after 9/11. It happened again in response to the lie of WMDs in Iraq. It happened with the 2007-2007 financial crisis. Then again with COVID, followed by Ukraine and now Israel. In addition, there is a persistent reflex to the lie that we are doomed by climate change.
It’s a crisis, ergo we spend.
The only debate is on how much to spend and obviously it is more virtuous to spend more money in each instance. There is no plan. There are no defined meaningful and achievable goals.
We simply do not know what is in our own interest. We need to have a war of words to define American interests before we do anything else. I can guarantee you that most elected representatives, the entirety of the administrative state and a majority of Americans are not capable of defining interest and certainly not capable of enumerating American interests.
So, my question to you is simple. How do you define and identify an American interest. I am not looking for examples unless you first write a definition for American interest that applies to every instance of American interests.
Tonight President Biden is going to address the nation and ask for $100 billion in spending on top of our current $7 trillion yearly spending.
____________________________________________
No worries. Our strong conservative leaders in DC, led by a strong conservative Speaker of the House will certainly deny Biden’s war chest requests.
/spit
American interest — One that: (1) protects the life, liberty and property of Americans; (2) supports the constitutional protection of Americans; and (3) promotes the protection of like-minded people outside the U.S. who desire to be Americans (i.e., are looking to seek admission to the U.S. as a new state).
Hard definition indeed.
Sending billions to Ukraine, not in the working people’s best interests.
Sending aid to Israel, yes as a hedge against the middle east and Iran, but is it best for American’s working class?
I will say what is in the best interest of America is, limited immigration, energy, food and manufacturing independence. Those things are in the best thing for the American people.
Not sure that is what you wanted, but there it is.
I was with you until #3. But that’s why there should be a debate.
I wasn’t looking for examples. Tell me how I can identify an example.
American interest is the Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness (which, for me, is Property). Further, the rule of law as expressed in our Constitution must be enforced.
I support the concept of Autarky meaning economic independence and self-sufficiency for the United States. Tariffs should be used so that our essential needs can be met locally as much as possible. Foreign trade is all well and good, but actual dependence on foreign goods is bad.
And I no longer support a standing army. We have one, and we use it too much. Keep the nukes, send the soldiers home.
My thought on the independence part of my reply was an example of what is in the American interest.
That can be a long argument. But I guess the first place is in the preamble:
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
Where does Ukraine fit in? Or Israel for that matter?
And its not based on what Russia or Hamas *might* do. And general welfare does not refer to what benefits DC special interests or politicians.
Maybe we can ask the people of East Palestine or Lahaina what they think. Or citizens in New York city who have a building of full of illegalsnext door.
I also think assisting both Israel and Ukraine are in our interests. But there isn't any reason that spending on national security can't be given higher priority than other spending and other spending cut.
For example:
" SNAP spending soared from $91.8 billion in fiscal 2020 to $127.6 billion in fiscal 2021, and fell back only slightly last year."
Given the number of human hippos I see staggering around my city, a significant SNAP cut would not only help the deficit but also public health.
Similarly, Why are we spending money on aid to Gaza and giving aid to Israel when the money spent on Gaza will just be seized by Hamas? Are we funding both sides? How much in frozen Iranian assets are we still holding? Why isn't that being used to fund Israel and frozen Russian assets to fund Ukraine?
Then if you believe what you say, you need to be in support of our aid to Israel 100% but just want to see a plan for taking the cost of that support out of some places the current spending is dedicated to. That I would agree with.
However, minus getting such a thing from Biden, and if I were sitting in Congress, I am not sure I could sacrifice aid to Israel for something I have no hope of getting from Biden.
My approval of aid to Israel is not dependent on who is President. Would you be making your same argument if the situation was the same (and the budget was the same) and Trump was President?
To me the budget battle must be waged on its own, for that is the real financial battle, more than this or that program or this or that expenditure - though many programs and many expenditures do need to be dropped altogether. Those are the battles Congress needs to be engaged in, far far far more than holding up immediate aid to an ally under attack in an Iranian proxy war. Why? Because those things are systemic and immediate aid to an ally is not.
A former CEO boss use say to different people on the staff from time to time - when he thought their view of the situation was wrong - “Your looking at the hole not the donut”.
The donut is the whys and wherefores of the $7 trillion to start with, not aid to Israel.
It doesn't mean the U.S. must protect anyone and everyone around the world who fancies themselves "Americans" ... it just means that extending U.S. interests to foreign areas would be legitimate if the purpose is to pursue the territorial expansion of the United States if the territory and Congress are on board with pursuing the admission of one or more new states.
The terms which come to mind which might be foundational in defying what is “Our Interest”:
Forward or Future
Tangible/ Clearly Defined
Long Lasting / Ongoing
Broad Benefit To ????
Context
Unfortunately, politicians frame everything like a light switch, on or off, yes or no, good or bad………..and we let them.
....”Interest - Regard for one’s own benefit or advantage; self-interest.”
I am with you 100 per cent on your items 1 and 2 but not so much on number 3....I think this country is awash in immigrants, both legal and illegal....do we need more of the former and far fewer of the latter....??
Read The Declaration
Give me liberty or give me death.
You're welcome! ;-)
“Tonight President Biden is going to address the nation and ask for $100 billion in spending on top of our current $7 trillion yearly spending.”
I have seen numerous media reports where some are saying $100 million and others are saying $100 billion. I think the ones saying $100 million are trying to act like it’s not that much money.The media is trying to blow smoke again.
There’s my problem. I’m just looking for a definition and method to identify an interest. You have taken it one step too far by creating and stating an interest.
The place I am going with this is pretty simple. If we can agree on the definition of an interest, it allows us to have an argument about what is and what is not an interest. Using your #1 definition (protects the life, liberty and property of Americans;) in your original post works. You can argue about the things in your #3.
I’m not saying #1 is complete or incomplete and I’m not saying #3 should or shouldn’t be an interest.
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