Posted on 09/13/2022 9:40:12 AM PDT by Red Badger
California lawmakers have passed a measure cracking down on the future sales of new gasoline cars. The rules call for the ban of new gas-powered cars by 2035, with target guidelines to phase out the cars in increments. It is the first ban of its kind, and states nationwide are expected to enact similar policies.
David Popp is a professor in the Public Administration and International Affairs Department in Syracuse University's Maxwell School. Popp's research interests are in environmental policy and the economics of technological change. Much of his research focuses on the links between environmental policy and innovation, with a particular interest in how environmental and energy policies shape the development of new technologies that may be relevant for combatting climate change.
Popp says, "While I support efforts to increase the use of electric vehicles, I worry that an all-out ban on gasoline-powered vehicles would be going too far. Electric vehicles are great for day-to-day commutes, for example, but many consumers are still concerned about the lack of range batteries have for a family road trip. The California policy appears to provide some leeway by allowing hydrogen powered vehicles. But hydrogen vehicles are still an expensive option and fueling stations are limited.
"Whether manufacturers will work to improve the viability of hydrogen vehicles is not clear. The cost of producing hydrogen fuel is a limiting factor, which requires investments from energy producers as well. Automakers have already committed to producing more electric vehicles. A mandate like this helps reassure them that there will be a market for these vehicles. Improvements are likely, but limits on range and charging time may be difficult technical challenges to overcome. It does appear that plug-in hybrid vehicles would be allowed under the California regulation. If so, that could provide an alternative for consumers concerned about range, assuming manufacturers choose to make such vehicles available.
"The 17 states that currently follow California's vehicle emissions standards face a challenging choice. A policy change like this cannot be adopted in a vacuum. New charging infrastructure will need to be built, particularly for people who don't live in single-family homes and can simply plug in a vehicle when they return home. Charging infrastructure will also be needed along interstates and other places where drivers may go on longer road trips. Will states not participating upgrade their infrastructure as well? Additional charging stations mean new electric grid capacity will be needed. For consumers choosing hydrogen vehicles, refueling stations need to be built. And there is no guarantee hydrogen is a clean fuel. Hydrogen can be produced using renewable energy, but it can also be made using fossil fuels.
"Any state choosing to follow California's lead will must be prepared to make the necessary investments to make electric and hydrogen vehicles work in their states. Simply mandating their sale will not be enough."
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Can we evacuate from hurricanes in electric vehicles? Provided by Syracuse University
“. I stated facts.”
-—————YOU POSTED-————
“and boils off at a rate of approximately 1% of the container’s rated capacity per day.”
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I get that you an electric vehicle fanboy.
However, the article is written by a prof in Syracuse, NY where they have killer cold winters.
Electric vehicles are going to be a disaster there.
But—some lessons will just have to be learned the hard way.
From your link:
Hydrogen boil-offs in shipping. When you have a gas stored as a liquid by keeping it cold at reasonable temperatures, the cryogenic liquid turns into gas with any heat coming in. With ammonia and LNG, you can run compression and cooling equipment and return it, as they are liquids at much higher temperatures than hydrogen with its 24° Kelvin boiling point. The way to deal with this is to create the biggest, spherical, vacuum-insulated tanks possible, but even so, the boil-off rate is 0.2% per day. Shipping hydrogen tanks ones are likely to be worse because they can’t be as big. At the scale of trucks, the surface area to volume ratio leads to 1% losses per day.
I actually work with this kind of stuff, boy. Don't try to BS me. You're babbling about giant "storage" tanks ... I'm telling you what actually happens down at the user level. And your link even agrees with me. Funny ... Don't like it? That's your problem, not mine.
Worse, that 0.2%/day boil-off rate you're bragging about (even if it's real, which is dubious) is still infinitely greater than the boil-off loss rate of liquid hydrocarbon fuels. Your link again agrees with me.
I bet you didn't expect me to read your link, didja?
I'm done with you, loser. You may have the last word if you like.
“However, the article is written by a prof in Syracuse, NY “
-————Wrong—————
Daryl Lovell
Manager, Media Relations at Syracuse University
“Worse, that 0.2%/day boil-off rate you’re bragging about (even if it’s real, which is dubious) is still infinitely greater than the boil-off loss rate of liquid hydrocarbon fuels. Your link again agrees with me.”
0.2%.
“You’re babbling about giant “storage” tanks ... I’m telling you what actually happens down at the user level.”
No, your first explicitly referred to STORAGE.
“And to store enough of it to do useful things, it must be stored a high pressures.”
“And your link even agrees with me. Funny ... Don’t like it? That’s your problem, not mine.”
So 0.2% per the link is OK by you?
“Don’t try to BS me.”
No BS. Just facts. Facts you have not refuted.
“Syracuse, NY where they have killer cold winters.”
-——————PREVIOUS OUTDOOR EVENT————NEXT OCT 1————
Discussing the Realities of Buying Electric Vehicles
FEBRUARY 2021
I am still looking for comments about metal hydrides.
They are not close and will never get close to an electric grid to support any significant number of CA EV’s.
I can see California in 10 years.
Empty freeways, people riding bicycles, empty stores, restaurants closed, sewage running down the streets, and Democrats doing their damnedest to blame Republicans for the disaster........................
Better pick up the pace of depopulation...
You are pushing this fairy and elf technology very hard.
Good luck with it!
You left out unicorn snorts!
“You are pushing this fairy and elf technology very hard.
Good luck with it!”
No. Just educating you on the facts. I had nothing to do with your RTS buying electric busses.
I live in another state—not NY.
I plan to entertain myself watching electric vehicles break down on the highway during winter here in the Northeast.
This is gonna be a gift that keeps on giving.
“We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality.” Ayn Rand
For any young people looking for a new career—you want to drive a tow truck—with all the money you will be making you can form your own tow truck company.
“I plan to entertain myself watching electric vehicles break down on the highway during winter here in the Northeast.”
Really weird
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