Posted on 08/01/2022 9:00:05 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp
For some time I have wondered how to explain the cause of the Civil War in simple terms that are easy to understand. I now see that Ayn Rand did it years ago. Laws passed by a Northern controlled Congress routed all the money produced by the South into Northern "elite" pockets.
Do the elites speak for you right now? Do you support the homosexual agenda, the green agenda, or any other liberal nonsense?
“BS. Slavery was the largest source of revenue.
Selling and buying human beings.
You’re entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts.”
Got proof? Didn’t think so. Calling your opinion a “fact” doesn’t make it one.
How was the North going to buy most of the European goods by only producing 28% of the total trade value with Europe?
Of course I think it was the South's money. They produced it didn't they?
Indeed. I just replied elsewhere that women were counted as a population census, despite most not permitted to vote.
I am aware of that. But when they got into power, they didn't try to end it through legal means, such as a constitutional amendment.
LOL! Funny! The Southern states LEFT BEFORE THE FIRST REPUBLICAN WHO “GOT INTO POWER” could even act.
I wish you knew more about the Civil War, so you could comment from a more defensible position.
In the mid 1800’s the Yankees sold all of their slaves “down the river” for huge profits then they became virtue signaling abolitionists. Yanks are hypocrite scum.
Did not say that. Clearly they wanted at least the status quo where they couldn't be outvoted by powerful interests in the North. I'm sure they would have preferred to have even more control of congress than "status quo" but that could not happen.
Going independent, governing themselves and keeping most of the money they produced looked like a very attractive alternative to them.
“Correct, they did so without passing through the agreed Constitutional processes.”
And, they did so without passing through the agreed Articles of Confederation processes.
So the states seceded and nothing bad happened.
The northern states supported secession. And the southern states supported secession. They all agreed to secession and nobody went to war.
And when the new union was created, the states did not repeat the use of the failed word perpetual in the U.S. Constitution.
I enjoy these civil war threads. I think others do too. :)
Amazing how 150 years after the Civil War, all the Northerners now want to move South. Now even the car companies are building factories down there while Detroit looks more and more like a war-ravaged ruin.
The "elite" Liberals in the North are still living in the Hamptons and Martha's Vineyard. Life is still good for them because they don't have to live with the consequences of their policies that only hurt regular people.
It only lasted 6 years. 1781 to 1787. Then everyone tossed it out.
I would love to hear how you changed your mind. Don’t need details from sources, just how it started, and what things swayed you as resources, etc. perhaps even any logic you realized when thinking of it more?
The Tenth Amendment gives the right of secession, when the federal government completely ignores it.
And, of course, there’s that very first line of the Declaration of Independence.
Even after the Confederacy was desperately short of Soldiers, it was still enough of a "cornerstone" so that many refused to even consider recruiting slaves into the Army. It would have cut against the entire purpose of the Confederacy's existence.
"You cannot make soldiers of slaves, or slaves of soldiers. The day you make a soldier of them is the beginning of the end of the Revolution. And if slaves seem good soldiers, then our whole theory of slavery is wrong."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howell_Cobb
For example, on one of our last road trips, we stopped at one of those Panera Breads. Big mistake. Menu items were pretentiously described (Napa Almond Chicken Salad sandwich) and way overpriced. It took people in line up to five minutes to decide what they wanted. Then you had to sit down and wait for it to be made. Finally we had to walk over to the pickup area to grab it because the waitstaff were overwhelmed. It was $32 for a breakfast for two. Coffee was self-serve and awful. Not even very hot.
Waffle House is always no-frills and super friendly. After taking your order, the waitress walks to a certain spot on the floor and screams your order at the line cooks in some kind of code. Within minutes, you get simple solid food that fills the belly. Breakfast for two more around $15 and while the coffee is rather pedestrian, it's super hot and always consistent.
Also, Waffle House is ranked number one in this survey and I agree 100%.
I think most people hate something that costs twice as much as something they could buy elsewhere. US Northern manufactured goods were priced much higher than their European counterparts because of the protectionist policies implemented by Washington DC that put high tariffs on goods manufactured in Europe.
Without the protective tariffs, The US goods would have been priced cheaper, and then people would have gladly bought them.
Do you have an American manufactured Television set or Computer in your home? American car? Phone?
Why not?
Fascinating. Thank you for that.
I found it fascinating too. The guy that created that map did so to "prove" that the Southern states weren't paying the tariffs.
Because I had already learned they produced the vast majority of the trade, the map made me immediately realize that something was sending all the money to the North.
I eventually learned that "something" was American law designed to favor Northern interests. (Because they controlled congress.)
South Carolina was the very first. States like Virginia were objecting more in principle to the idea that South Carolina couldn’t leave if it wanted to. So, the determining factor remains slavery. No dispute over slavery, fugitive slaves, etc. no secession.
It’s not merely about being snobby or “down to earth”. It’s the food. It’s cheap. And I mean, it tastes cheap. I’d prefer a waffle from frozen Eggo (previously Aunt Jemima) over WH. For God’s sake, the item they specialize in should be real good!
I’m not against the whole concept. I draw the line when the food is very poor.
I eat many cheap places, including fast food. I don’t care about the price, just the quality.
The South had an unfair benefit with its complete emphasis on slavery.
At the time of the Constitutional convention, the vast majority of states were slave states. All states agreed to these rules and if states wanted to throw away the 3/5ths representation that slavery gave them, they had a right to do so.
But why would you call the benefit "unfair" if they all agreed to it?
The debate at the time reveals that had they not agreed to it, there would have been no Union. It might have saved everyone a lot of trouble in the long run for the slave states to remain in their own separate country.
I believe this is true.
Lincoln’s war hurt everyone, then and now.
Something I have come to realize. It's still hurting the USA. Our leviathan Federal government is a consequence of that war. So is "gay marriage", "abortion", banning prayer in schools, and a whole host of other troubles.
What is the basis of your opinion that Ayn Rand was - in her 1957 statement - referring to conditions/causes leading to the civil war?
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