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Fighter Pilots Reveal Why You Don't Want To Mess With The A-10 Warthog In A Dogfight
The Drive ^ | 26 Jan 2021 | Jamie Hunter

Posted on 01/26/2021 3:41:06 PM PST by DUMBGRUNT

Pilots discuss how the A-10 Warthog's tight turning radius coupled with its big gun means it can sting even the best fighters in a dogfight.

While the “Warthog” isn’t optimized for the air superiority role and lacks key capabilities, such as high-speed, radar, and radar-guided long-range missiles that make its fighter brethren such air-to-air supremos, even the greatest fighter pilots are rightfully wary of getting into a close-in turning dogfight with a ‘lowly’ mud-moving A-10.

the U.S. Air Force Weapons School at Nellis Air Force Base in Nevada, actually teaches the art of Basic Fighter Maneuvers (BFM) in its bi-annual A-10 class, just in case pilots find themselves in a sticky situation with a pouncing enemy fighter.

Colonel Denny “Gator” Yount retired from the USAF in 2011 with an impressive 3,852 hours in the A-10. He says that of the many highlights in his career, specializing in A-10 BFM at the Weapons School as an instructor ranks as one of the most rewarding. “The air-to-air guys have a radar and they are a lot faster than we are, but they quickly learn that it doesn’t pay for them to get into the proverbial phone booth with us for a close-in dogfight.”

“BFM was one of my natural inclinations,” Yount continues. “I was always pretty good at it, having started out as a T-38 Talon Instructor Pilot.

Yount says: “The fighters generally stay high and try to point their nose in, trying to get the shot, and then get the hell out of there — because we can’t chase them out high and we can’t run them down. But if they stay in the turning fight with us in our environment we are very happy to do that all day long.”

(Excerpt) Read more at thedrive.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Military/Veterans
KEYWORDS: a10; aviation
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To: stanne

I met a guy once who transitioned from F-16 to A-10’s when the NG air wing got changed.

I asked if it seemed to be a letdown? He told me he loved the A-10 more.


21 posted on 01/26/2021 4:38:09 PM PST by cyclotic (The most dangerous people are the ones that feel the most helpless)
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To: DUMBGRUNT
In the good old days when they still had airshows, watching the A-10 demo was an eye opener. They could dance that thing back on show center before they cleared the end of the runway. The tight turn radius was really evident.

Couple that with even a golden BB hit with the 30MM and it would be enough to humble any Gen 4 fighter jock and maybe even a few Gen 5s.

The NVA proved that maneuverability beats brute force with MiG 17s and it is a lesson that needs to be re-learned each generation.

22 posted on 01/26/2021 4:39:16 PM PST by pfflier
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To: DUMBGRUNT

That is why the enemy will destroy all 243 of them with over the horizon missiles that travel 10 times faster than the A-10 can fly. And, the A-10 pilot will never even see them coming due to their speed so he will not have time to try to avoid them.

And there you have it. In a high end fight against a technologically advanced enemy, the A-10 is worseless.


23 posted on 01/26/2021 4:40:26 PM PST by joma89 (Buy weapons and ammo, folks, and have the will to use them.)
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To: DUMBGRUNT

Hmmm be a good airframe for navy to revamp in to a new Missileer

Douglas F6D Missileer


24 posted on 01/26/2021 4:42:15 PM PST by tophat9000 (Tophat9000)
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To: Kozak

No matter what direction the A-10 still pulls a tighter circle at anything close excluding a harrier B and the A-4.

The Mig-21, F-5 and A-4 were about the same with the teen fighters, if you did not pull lead in half a circle in a F-16 you better change the type of fight. The A-10 would not fair well with the A-4. The all aspect sidewinder on the rail keeps most interceptors away from flights of A-10 with/without 4 ship F-15 protector.

Combined packages of the USAF keeps most flights safe.


25 posted on 01/26/2021 4:48:40 PM PST by protoconservative (Been Conservative Before You Were Born )
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To: DUMBGRUNT

26 posted on 01/26/2021 4:49:44 PM PST by PIF (They came for me and mine ... now its your turn)
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To: Mariner
That’s why they’ll kill it from 40 miles out. Or even 5 miles with a Sidewinder.

The A-10 also carries Sidewinders as well as an Electronic CounterMeasure (ECM) pod to fool or jam incoming missiles.

27 posted on 01/26/2021 4:52:29 PM PST by T.B. Yoits
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To: DUMBGRUNT
It was some years ago after the Chicago Air & Water Show that about 10 A-10 Warthogs flew over my far Southwest Suburban Chicago home on their way to an airport just south of me. They were maybe 1000 feet up in the air and the distinct growl of their jets was quite loud and I looked up to see them flying overhead with the nose gun turrets pointed down.

I cannot tell you how broadly I smiled as the A-10 Warthog is my favorite military plane. I've read so much about it and having friends who were in Iraq for Operation Desert Storm and their stories about it, it's just stuck with me. I can remember pointing up in the sky and telling my two sons to look up at them.

Many people have no idea how redundant that plane actually is. Half its support systems can get knocked out and that plane will still get the pilot home safely. I've read accounts of half of a wing missing from an A-10 Warthog and it still making it home. Same for electronics systems getting knocked out and still getting its pilot home.

I've no idea who designed that plane, IMO they clearly had returning the pilot home safely in mind. So much to learn from the design and engineering of the A-10 Warthog.

28 posted on 01/26/2021 5:02:05 PM PST by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: Kozak
The Hog will just wait until the other jock peaks and is on the way down then blooie.

I flew Air Combat USA with ACM trainers; dog fights are basically flown in an egg shape both vertically and horizontally and around 300kts. A Hog will also head down into ground clutter where the AIM can't see them.

29 posted on 01/26/2021 5:02:59 PM PST by SkyDancer (Remember Ashli Babbitt!)
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To: DUMBGRUNT

That is a manly aircraft...


30 posted on 01/26/2021 5:20:40 PM PST by rlmorel ("I’d rather enjoy a risky freedom than a safe servitude." Robby Dinero, USMC Veteran, Gym Owner)
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To: stanne

They train at Whiteman, here in Missouri. I wonder how many times I have been a target out in the field with a tractor???


31 posted on 01/26/2021 5:40:40 PM PST by taterjay
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To: usconservative
The A-10 can lose (not all at once) half a wing, an engine, or the elevator on one side, and still fly.

Also, the cockpit is surrounded by a titanium "bathtub" to protect the pilot from ground fire.

It was designed to survive these:


32 posted on 01/26/2021 5:42:14 PM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: DUMBGRUNT

A-10 will die BFR every time. It’s not worth squat against a first tier opponent.


33 posted on 01/26/2021 5:47:14 PM PST by ChuckHam
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To: rlmorel
That is a manly aircraft...

A manly, masculine, manful aircraft indeed.


34 posted on 01/26/2021 5:48:00 PM PST by Steely Tom ([Voter Fraud] == [Civil War])
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To: DuncanWaring
Also, the cockpit is surrounded by a titanium "bathtub" to protect the pilot from ground fire.

Yep, I remember that. What a great purpose built plane!

35 posted on 01/26/2021 5:48:41 PM PST by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: ChuckHam
It’s not worth squat against a first tier opponent.

You've missed the point entirely of what an A-10 Warthog was built for.

36 posted on 01/26/2021 5:49:39 PM PST by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: usconservative

Nope, I know exactly what it was built for and it excels at that. I was a member of the Flying Tigers during the first Gulf War and I saw what it can do and how it was limited.


37 posted on 01/26/2021 5:52:36 PM PST by ChuckHam
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To: usconservative

“Many people have no idea how redundant that plane actually is. Half its support systems can get knocked out and that plane will still get the pilot home safely. “

And do not overlook the titanium bathtub the pilot sits in, to protect from ground fire.

“It can take far more than a 0.50 cal round. A 0.50 cal round is about 12.7mm. The bathtub has been tested (and proven in combat) to withstand up to 57mm explosive rounds.”

https://www.quora.com/Does-an-A-10-really-have-a-titanium-tub-for-the-pilot-to-sit-in-What-kind-of-hit-can-it-actually-take-Can-it-take-a-50-cal-explosive-or-armor-piercing-round

A long wait in an airport, I purchased a magazine totally about the A-10.
And I learned many fun things.


38 posted on 01/26/2021 5:55:44 PM PST by DUMBGRUNT ("The enemy has overrun us. We are blowing up everything. Vive la France!"Dien Bien Phu last message.)
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To: PIF

Nice find!
Thanks.


39 posted on 01/26/2021 5:58:11 PM PST by DUMBGRUNT ("The enemy has overrun us. We are blowing up everything. Vive la France!"Dien Bien Phu last message.)
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To: Steely Tom

Shot the 30mm at targets at 12,000 feet. Accurately.
Punched through light armor with training rounds and not the armor piercing round.
Can shoot farther if needed on the ground or A/A.
A/A can engage with the gun much farther than the 20mm pop-gun.

More tomorrow.


40 posted on 01/26/2021 6:02:55 PM PST by Hulka ( )
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