Posted on 08/12/2019 7:35:28 AM PDT by DUMBGRUNT
Toyota, Ford plan to keep hybrids as core part of their lineups, showing split in auto industry
“If I had a dollar more to invest, would I spend it on a hybrid? Or would I spend it on the answer that we all know is going to happen, and get there faster and better than anybody else?” GM President Mark Reuss
Last week, Continental AG , one of the world’s biggest car-parts makers, said it would cut investment in conventional engine parts because of a faster-than-expected fall in demand—yet another sign the industry is accelerating the shift to electric vehicles.
Today, auto companies generally lose money on each electric car they sell, mostly because of the high cost of lithium-ion batteries.
VW and GM are focused on all-electric cars largely because of China, where new regulations require car companies to sell a minimum number of zero-emissions vehicles to avoid financial penalties.
or now, both hybrids and electric cars are more expensive to produce than comparable gas-powered vehicles. A hybrid system can add roughly $2,000 to a vehicle’s cost, while a fully electric version is an additional $6,000 to $10,000
(Excerpt) Read more at wsj.com ...
Do they come with a standard transmission?
I only buy sticks, hate all automatic trannys.
Go back and look at the original post...
660,000 / 52 =12,692
660,000/25 = 26,400
He burned gas driving his 660,000 miles.... he just didn’t burn as MUCH driving a car that got 52 mpg as he did one that got 25.
The ACTUAL difference between the two, is how much gas and thus money he saved:
26,400 - 12,692 = 13,708.... I rounded it down to 13700 because I said ABOUT 13,700
He used 13,708 gallons LESS using his prius getting 52mpg vs another vehicle getting 25 MPG.
As such for him to have SAVED $82,500, he would have to have speng 82,500 on 13,708 gallons of gas... and thats complete BS...
$82,500/13,708 = $6.01 So, to “SAVE” 82,500 driving 660,000 miles in a car that got 52mpg vs a car that got 25mpg you would have to be spending on average $6.01 per gallon.. .and that’s BS!
The average price of gas over the last 20 years is actually below $3... in 2000 it was 1.51 a gallon for example and for a brief period it went up to $3.99 or so.. but for the majority of the last 20 years its been under $3 a gallon so even if I give you $3 a gallon as the average price, this man is OVERCLAIMING his savings by more than double.
HIS MATH IS CRAP!
Exactly.. I never claimed he wasn’t saving money, but he’s blowing absolute CRAP claiming he’s saved over 80k
what kills me is, I bought a real spare tire package and carry around my golf clubs, so I wonder what the mpg’s would be without the added weight...
We drove Suburbans for years and I modified a dog crate to just fit in the back, the same crate fits in the back of the Prius!
Adding a hitch for my bicycle mount, I noticed that EVERYTHING is ultra-lightweight.
Do you really need the bag with the FM-AM stereo and auto club ejector...?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWjvDOm2R_c
Sorry, but you are pretty much wearing some rose colored classes... the number of “charging stations” doesn’t even meet 1% of the number of gas stations in this country and MANY are in private parking garages, not at your local gas station.
You are also ignoring the other fundamental problem, in that even if tomorrow miraculously every gas station suddenly had charging stations, the electrical grid production and infrastructure cannot provide the power necessary to charge all those vehicles.
To support a primarily electric vehicle fleet, TRILLIONS of dollars needs to be spent building new power stations and upgrading the transmission and delivery systems to be able to support it. Even if congress decided TODAY to start making it priority it would be decades before that work was done.. and do you see congress making that a priority? Hell an entire town and most of its population were burned to charred crisps due to poor upkeep on electric lines out in California...
The Electric Grid in the US is beyond neglected. What you are dreaming of is DECADES away IF IT WERE A PRIORITY, and its not.
As to the average person driving 30 miles a day... Sure, but people don’t LIVE in averages. Few people are going to spend 20 or 30k for an 80% solution. 80-90% of the time I commute less than 30 miles, but 10-20% of the time I drive a LOT more.. and unless you are someone who already has a vehicle you aren’t buying a limited vehicle as your ONLY vehicle.
Electrics are a niche and will be for a long time to come, for MOST people.
No the gasoline engine, very small in size, is being used to turn an alternator which recharges the batteries when they reach a certain discharge point. So it only runs occasionally and not for very long at a time. The car is being driven by electric motors run off the battery. A battery than can also be charged off a charger when available, such as overnight. Very similar to electro-diesel locomotives.
Of course, if you live your n an urban area and don’t drive much, a ‘98 Caprice Classic is also a good choice.
We will see...
I am not anti electric vehicles, but I don’t see them being pragmatic, practical and the main vehicle of choice in the next few decades at least.
Even if and when they solve the charging problem, you still have to deal with the simple fact you are talking TRILLIONS of dollars and decades of time invested in the electrical system infrastructure to be able to handle charging all those vehicles.
I am no greenie.. I could care less what mode of power drives my car, but if you think I am going to purchase a vehicle that isn’t providing the same function as my existing vehicle you are fooling yourself.
The wealthy who have a second or third care will deal with the limitations of an electric as their secondary vehicle.. MOST people, are not going to buy something that provides them an 80% solution for their needs.
Yes battery tech is getting better, but as an engineer myself, I see a whole lot of rose colored glasses people who think that we will all be driving electric vehicles in a short time frame.
I never said electric cars are going away.... But the belief that they are “just around the corner of being the mainstream” is IMHO comical.
As soon as government policy STOPS propping up these abominations they’ll die a deserved death.
The tax credit phases out once a vehicle manufacturer has sold 200,000 qualifying vehicles...
If you believe that buy FCA stock. They only have one EV and it’s junk.
I was more interested in how the one you bought in 2000 held up.
We only have one and it is just three years young.
You’re biased, ignorant and wrong.
Do they come with a standard transmission?
I only buy sticks, hate all automatic trannys.
Tesla comes with a simple one-speed transmission!
Some 4wds use two different motors, one with higher torque at a lower speed for off the line.
Rapid charging shortens battery life, and presents a danger of explosion/fire.
Also electric cars further overload an already frightfully overloaded power grid, and present life threatening hazards to their users during disaster evacuations.
Electric cars are a disastrous choice across the board.
.
“We’ve saved appx. $82,500 over this time - compared to. cars that get only 25 MPG
Gas is $6 a gallon in Maine?”
And it’s been that since the year 2000! He’s a smug Prius owner so he has a need to self congratulate himself.
If we assume that the average price of gas in the last 19 years was a more realistic 2 dollars a gallon, then what he saved is roughly $28000, or about $350/year per car. But how many more thousands of dollars did he pay for the Prius over a comparable gas only subcompact?
“The lady doth protest too much, methinks”
But you are correct about the neglect of the national power grid.
.
We need to simply outlaw “plug-in” electric vehicles as a national security and threat to life issue.
Were they taxed sufficiently to offset their hazards, nobody would buy them anyway.
.
If you are using any batteries or external power supply it is not all like a diesel/electric locomotive in concept or design.
So my daughter’s boyfriend has a Tesla. In a recent trip they made between Salt Lake City and Colorado Springs, they took the Tesla. What probably should have been a 8 or 9 hour drive took them about 14. The boyfriend had to plan the drive to schedule charging station stops (I guess there is an app for that) and supposedly they have ‘rapid charge’ at some places, but not everywhere. So one of the stops took a few hours for the recharge because the rapid charge was down. The boyfriend says he gets 300 miles between charges, but I am not sure he can back that up except in the very best driving conditions. Seems really restrictive for making cross country trips.
I think the number of available charging stations works for the relatively small number of electrics on the road today, but it wouldn’t work for a larger fleet.
I am very much against any govt subsidy for this ‘transition’ to electric, and I dont think its possible to not be tax payer subsidized if you get ‘free’ charging enroute. I also think the carbon footprint (energy used) to drive fully electrics is bigger than the gas powered engine, and certainly hybrids, after the grid inefficiencies and losses are accounted for.
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