Sad at results of Educational Testing. Any suggestions going forward? (Vanity)

Me

[MacMattico]

I've brought up education issues before. I've tried to help other people's children with school difficulties and dealing with school administration. I have an Education background. My first child is a HS student and even with all of the public school problems we encounter, she enjoys her school (for the most part) and it is a small enough place where everybody pretty much knows everyone else. My daughter has nearly a 4.0 average. I went to the same school and was happy and grade obsessed. I never could understand how people thought HS was "hard". I must have been obnoxious. Going into the Education field (not any longer there) I got an attitude adjustment and realized different people have different strengths and weaknesses, and grades aren't everything.

But you know how when it comes to your own family things can seem so hard and different? My youngest daughter is in 6th grade. She is adopted, and I don't mean to imply anything by that except that we have no record of her life before age 1 and don't know anything about who her biological parents were or prenatal care.

She has really struggled with school this year. Common core hit really hard. She will pass, but with very low grades in the grade level curriculum, and I think some of these grades have been inflated because she is such a nice, outgoing kid, the most helpful,and that she tries so hard, and her teachers just love her. But we wanted a true reflection of her abilities so we took her for some outside testing.

Her IQ came back at 81. I'll be honest and tell you this broke my heart. She is also so trusting it seems no matter how much we try to teach her right and wrong that she has no impulse control and is going to get herself into some real trouble later in life. I hate to say it but the kind of kid that you could give the whole "don't take candy from strangers" talk to and five minutes later she'd be doing just that. It takes hours to get her through homework and it's like she never was at school that day sometimes-- no retention whatsoever. We study for a history test and even though it takes forever, she'll seem to understand the material and then fail the test miserably. I can't say "you didn't study" when I studied hours with her!

So a few weeks ago I stopped studying with her and only helped with homework when specifically asked a question because I didn't want her going in with perfect homework I had basically done. I wanted them to see her real work. Needless to say, she's not doing well. We got her a tutor once a week. When going through things one on one with someone outside the family, homework is done but info not retained.

The school has said because she is passing, she will not qualify to take special Ed classes but need to pass a foreign language(starting next year) and all of the usual high school courses including trigonometry and lab sciences. I know in my heart she can't do it. I'm not sure what to do. Even homeschooling I don't think I could teach her these things, and she loves school-- sports, friends and clubs especially. Testing by the school and by the private educational psychologist we brought her to both say she is "a few points above" being given Special Education services in NY. They did give her an IEP, though, which allows her to take a test in a quiet area and she can have a little extra time, but that's not helping the situation. She did come home crying after a state test because they had her take it in the regular classroom and she needs to whisper hard words and talk out math problems if she even has a chance to get them right. Other kids were telling her to shut up, and complaining she was bothering them. Which, really, she was but she needed to do that. She cried that she had told the sub she usually takes tests away from the group but was told no.

I'm very scared, as her mom, about her future. We're not sure what to do. Some days we think she'll never be able to live on her own. And it's not her fault but taking every evening doing homework and giving her all my attention and ignoring family time has caused us all great stress. She and I get so stressed it becomes a shouting match. Which I know is so wrong. And we're not even in jr high until next year... The good thing is, they believe their to be no mental health issues.

[21twelve]

My thoughts and prayers are with you. Your letter could have been written by my wife with a few changes. Tenth grade daughter, has within the year shown anxiety disorder and OCD. Wonderful girl, but it takes her a LONG time now to get her homework done, and perceived slights can set her mood back.

BUT - she is also very kind, friendly, etc. The story about the money sounds familiar from when she was much younger.

In our state (Washington) the schools need to make allowances for kids that have trouble with learning, even if they don’t get the worst grades. BUT - you need to push them on it. We have her in counseling and the pyschologist was able to push it. We also had a dear friend and one of her teachers really step up to the plate to advocate for her. “Advocate” is a good term - the child can’t do it, and the schools don’t want to (can’t afford) to do it. So the parents (and perhaps a professional) have to.

For us, her spending all of her time studying (hence the okay grades, not A’s like before, but B’s and C’s) short-changed her on a “normal” social life. lack of sleep was becoming an issue. There were some other aspects too that forced the school to adopt some changes for her. We finally have a plan in place that gives her a few more options (taking more time on some lessons, reduced load on some lessons, etc.) Before that we had talked with her teachers and some of them made changes on their own to accomodate her. (At some resistance by our daughter as she didn’t want any special treatment.)

And yes - the long hours of studying, with me and mom helping, is wearing on the entire family.

Find others in your situation. In the state of Washington they have an “obudsman” for disabilities. Find and use someone like that. I still have a hard time that my daughter has a “disability”. “Come on - just DO YOUR WORK!” still comes out once in awhile. But as our one friend said, she has a disability just the same as a child without a leg. And you wouldn’t yell at the legless child to run faster.

One of the things my wife and I just learned in counseling with our daughter (”DBT” class) was “acceptance”. Not giving up, or giving in, but acceptance of one’s circumstance at a particular moment. Hard to do.

May God continue to watch over ALL our children.

[21twelve]

“They did give her an IEP, though ...”

Sorry - I should have read your post better. You obviously know what you are doing. But it IS so frustrating.

[freerepublicchat]

I can’t offer much, but one trick is to make sure closed captioning is on for every television program she watches. It can help reading skills.

[TChad]

A little humor, that I hope is not too out of place:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/developmentally-disabled-burger-king-employee-only,462/

The story precisely describes the real situation at a local restaurant. The best employee is developmentally disabled.

[MacMattico]

Thank you. She does have a wonderful heart and doesn’t let things bother her. I love her to pieces! I just want the best for her, and want to know the best way to go about that.

[MacMattico]

That’s ok! She’s got an IEP but is not in the Special Ed program, which I didn’t know was possible until this year. The private Educational Psychologist said the school was doing us a favor because with her test scores being above the cut off (just above) they didn’t have to give her the IEP. This at least allows her extra time for tests in a quiet place. And a resource class (basically a study hall with teachers and aids to help) 3x a week.

[MacMattico]

Thank you. My thoughts and prayers with you also. My daughter has always loved going to school, but that is starting to change as we get into the higher grades. I think it’s becoming overwhelming. We will work on it!

[MacMattico]

I’ve come to the realization that we all have different qualities and challenges. My older daughter with the high grades is much less happy go lucky and probably couldn’t deal with the challenges younger daughter does. Older daughter was furious when we were ecstatic that younger daughter had a report card that showed she had worked hard. Older daughter was mad that she wasn’t given more credit for her grades being so much higher. I think she’s finally understanding younger daughter works just as hard or harder to achieve what she does.

[cynwoody]

A little humor, that I hope is not too out of place:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/developmentally-disabled-burger-king-employee-only,462/

The story precisely describes the real situation at a local restaurant. The best employee is developmentally disabled.

A quick-serve savant! What a concept!

Methinks the pay scales at the Onion must be substandard. How else would their reporter have gathered such an accurate picture than by having had to work at a joint like the Frontage Road BK?

[Innovative]

Sorry to hear about your troubles with your daughter.

Since nobody said it so far, I will: do NOT put faith into her IQ test. From what you say, the way she approaches things and tests may have resulted in a low number and some people just can’t take tests.

DO NOT GIVE UP on her.

Is she able to follow logic and rationalize? Explaining to her WHY she needs to do whatever may help her understand things.

There are people who just have difficulties taking tests — did you try to give her a “test” informally at home — not call it a test, just review some material you just went over, ask her questions about what you just covered to see if retention is really the problem or test taking.

Maybe you can teach her to NOT talk out loud when thinking her math problems through.

What I see from the limited info is that on one hand you truly love her, and want to help her, but on the other hand, you are accepting judgments of others which may be totally wrong.

I recommend turning over a new leaf, so to speak.

You also mention that socially she is active. There are many jobs where social skills are more important.

Did you check out some other options for help?

I just did a search on the internet and came across:

http://www.brainbalancecenters.com

they say they can schedule an assessment of your child and are able to help with childhood learning disabilities, etc.

I don’t know anything about them — but the main point I am trying to make is for you to keep your hope, do not give up and keep searching for help for your child.

Good luck and best wishes

[don-o]

I will ping my Missus - she may not be able to respond until later. She will be able to share some experience with our adopted son.

My thought is to concentrate on those things that your child has demonstrated an affinity for. First among these is cultivation of the virtues. Second is to teach her to work and to realize the benefits of what her work can bring to herself and to others.

And the bottom line - “Love never faileth.” Never does.

[jltate]

I apologize in advance for the wall of text, but your post really struck a chord with me and I felt I needed to respond.



The first thing to remember is that IQ is irrelevant. I cannot emphasize this enough. It is in no way a pre-ordained measure of success. It was designed by deeply flawed people who for whatever reason were hubristic enough to believe that how smart a person is can be compiled down to a single number.

As a systems engineer whose job is to focus on how unrelated parts fit together in a larger design, that is quite possibly the silliest concept I've ever heard of. Nothing in science, engineering, psychology or biochemistry is this clear-cut, so how on Earth could something as complex as "the capacity to learn" be?



99.99% of us are blessed by God with this incredibly amazing learning computer inside our head, and your daughter is no different in that regard. Some of us need to take a little more time to learn the same thing as others, but all of us are capable of the same level of intellect as long as we don't give up in self-defeat.

The most important thing for you to do is to stop focusing on the minutia of school work and instead find out how she learns most efficiently. No-one else can do this because no-one else has the amount of time that you have with your daughter to do so. Once you discover what works best for her your job will then be to train her to apply that method herself to what she needs to memorize in school. I realize that I may be making it sound easy, but I'm speaking from hard-earned experience and it will be very difficult for both you and her.



I floated through high school and ended up a complete failure in college before I realized that everything I thought I knew about learning was wrong. I cannot learn by reading, seeing or hearing. There's a hard limit on the number of topics I can learn simultaneously. Taking notes makes me forget. It took a long time and a lot of tuition before I figured out on my own how to manage these hurdles, but 8 years later I left college with a masters in electrical engineering. I'm a year and a half into my professional career at almost 30 years old but darnit, I did it.

With as devoted a mother as she has, there is not a doubt in my mind that when your daughter puts her mind to it 110% she will succeed in whatever she decides to do with her life.

Beyond what I've already said, the only other advice I can give is that you must not give up and you must not give in to despair. If a child believes they can't do it then they can't. Take the belief you say is in your heart that she might not be able to do it and replace it with an irrational, unyielding belief that she can and, in time, she will.

[jocon307]

“The great boxer M. Ali had an IQ of 78”

I find that extremely hard to believe. I never thought Ali was a genius, but he always seemed sharp and articulate, until the decline of his later years obviously.

Of course I never met him in real life or anything, but one saw plenty of him in live interviews, etc.

[abclily]

One of the authors of Common Core stated this week that the program was written to lower white privilege. Common Core’s purpose is to pull smarter students down and ruin their education.

Advice: Home school. Teach your children traditional reading, writing, and mathematics.

[ConservativeMind]

There are nutritional items to consider to improve memory.

Standard essential nutrients we don't get in high enough quantities:
Magnesium, Vitamin K, Vitamin D, Omega-3s (salmon) -

Magnesium May Improve Memory
http://www.webmd.com/brain/news/20100127/magnesium-may-improve-memory

Does Vitamin D Deficiency Cause Memory Loss?
http://www.livestrong.com/article/446931-does-vitamin-d-deficiency-cause-memory-loss/

Higher vitamin K levels associated with improved verbal episodic memory
http://www.lef.org/newsletter/2013/1001_Higher-vitamin-K-levels-associated-with-improved-verbal-episodic-memory.htm

Omega-3 Intake Improves Memory In Young Adults
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/252198.php

A lot of research has been done on common foods, so investigate things like blueberries (encourages neuron growth) and white and green tea. Nootrophics:
These are alao known as "smart drugs." Natural derivative examples include Sulbutiamine, Citicoline, Alpha-GPC, among others. Both I and my wife can vouch that these help with focus and memorizing. Other exist that appear to be completely engineered, and these also work, but I would always keep ingested items for kids as close to naturally available options as is possible.

[chajin]

She'd seriously say “no I just practiced yesterday”. I don't know what that means.

This is not diagnosis, but rather a possibility: her frontal lobe is "lazy," so the limbic center is not being sufficiently controlled for her to focus. If this happens to be the case, something like Vyvanse would "wake up" the lobe, putting it in gear to control the limbic system.

It's quite possible that your daughter has a higher IQ--probably not above average, but higher than 81--but that she could not focus while taking the "IQ test," causing the score to be lowered. Find a female Christian child psychologist in your area and let her do a workup on your daughter; if it isn't what I'm guessing here, there are other possibilities and other options.

P.S. My 17yo daughter is adopted, and my 29yo biological son was/is a certifiable genius (National GeoBee, International Baccalaureate, Rose-Hulman). Her elementary school years were plagued by the same issues as your daughter has, and she kept comparing herself to her brother, even though we never did it, and always told her she was her own person and God had His own plans for her. She is dual-enrolling in local com-col and senior year of high school, knows she wants to be a nurse, and has her education all mapped out ahead of her. I am praying a similar future for you and for your daughter.

[wintertime]

Re: IQ tests

TRUST YOUR GUT FEELINGS about your daughter's abilities and then act according to those feelings.

IQ test are unreliable.

Re: What to do

Consider homeschooling. You know your daughter, her strengths and weakness, far better than any school functionary. **You** can best prepare her for life as an adult and cultivate her talents.

Re: Impulsivity

So?...Do you think that being around gangs of impulsive school kids it the best way to curb impulsivity in your daughter? I don't think so. She needs the quiet reassurance of **your** CALM presence on which to model her behavior.

Re: School friends

Your daughter does not seem likely to be moving toward academic excellence. This means she will not be making friends with, or associating with, those kids who are tracking in the AP ( Advanced College Placement) courses. If she is impulsive will be likely be running with the worst elements and dregs of the school.

Every parent who I have know who has had a wayward child has given me some variant of , “ It was his friends he met in school”.

Re: Academic Excellence

A successful life is often built upon solid character, honesty, and reliability. These the very qualities that are least likely to be nurtured in a the government school kiddie factories.

[Nifster]

That is why I said you will have to FIGHT. You have to keep going at it. Is there any way you can home school? zI know some parents ( more than a dozen over the years) and they had to keep fighting. Be your child’s advocate. Go in with the results. Find out what the criteria are for special ed. I would think her IQ would make her eligible for help.

This is what happened when we let the feds decide what education should be. Not a real surprise all things considered.

I wish you well. It is a long up hill battle

[firebrand]

So there are good lessons for everyone here. I’ve heard kids complain when their parents are complimented on the kids’ achievements. “Good work, Mom!” people say when the kid gets some kind of success. “Hey. I did that. Not my mom.” They don’t say it that rudely, but they do love to get praise and credit for what they do. Not for every little thing but for the more important victories.

[firebrand]

Can you give a source on that Common Core remark? I believe it but would like to cite it to others. Thanks!