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Posted on 08/09/2011 5:59:42 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
Governor Rick Perry on evolution, in an interview with the Associated Press:
"There are clear indications from our people who have amazing intellectual capability that this didn't happen by accident and a creator put this in place. Now, what was his time frame and how did he create the earth that we know? I'm not going to tell you that I've got the answers to that. I believe that we were created by this all-powerful supreme being and how we got to today versus what we look like thousands of years ago, I think there's enough holes in the theory of evolution to, you know, say there are some holes in that theory."
Synopsis of your post: MOST people believe that the Word of God lies. Good position
When God created something He declared it “very good”. When something is very good it stands to reason that the same overall structure would be used for something else. That does not demand that one of those “very good” species “evolved into a different species. If you want to believe that one species “evolves” into a different species I won’t even attempt to stop you. I’ll just retain my belief that when God said He created each “after it’s own kind” He spoke truth and take Him at His word. That word was spoken approximately 6700 years ago so if you want to cram some kind of “evolution” into that time frame have at it. I’ll simply discount whatever you say from now on pertaining to anything scriptural.
See post 42. I’ll just apply it to your posts as well.
My example of from wolves to poodles was just to illustrate a point that appearance and characteristics of a species is subject to change. I did not cite that as an example of evolution. The Wolves to domesticated dogs conversion was accomplished by humans using selective breeding techniques. In other words they exaggerated naturally occurring mutations and variations to accomplish the the type of dogs desired. Some were bred for size, others for looks, and some others for specialized tasks such as catching mice in grain storage, herding cattle, or hunting wild animals.
Evolution on the hand happens by survival of the mutants who are most likely to survive changing environments.
Your post did, DID, use the word ‘evolution’ in relation to the example of dogs from wolves.
Evolution presupposes a change in form to create new animals.
A something that changes into something else that is not the original something.
A non-human that is changed over time to a human. Sorry can’t buy into that.
Evolution is a non-starter.
In fact, one example of a form change that bothered me is this:
I have a large snake, about 8 1/2 foot Yellow Anaconda. Near his vent are two spurs, which, if you looked at his skeleton, are connected to bones that could be said to be vestigial legs. That could be said to be evidence of this ‘evolution’ thing that people seem to hold so dear.
Yet, to show how the Bible can show the folly of man, I re-read the account of Adam and Eve, written by Moses under inspiration by the Holy Spirit.
Moses describes a snake that must have had legs, because, due to the serpents lies to Eve, God commands that from then on the serpent would go upon his belly. WHY would God have had to command that unless snakes had legs then? What would Moses have known of ‘leggy’ snakes 6000 years ago, as by ‘evolution’ it would take millions for that transformation?
You may breed dogs to accentuate certain desirable characteristics, yet in the end, they are still dogs. When you can breed dogs and produce non-dogs then you might have some ammo to defend the THEORY of ‘evolution’.
Oh well, I’ll still vote for him. I’ve accepted that the Republican party is going to fall for this Intelligent Design garbage, but it’s so far to the outside of my circle of concern that it’s almost completely irrelevant.
Wolves-—>Dogs....man made evolution on steroids. This is not conjecture, there is actual evidence of this change starting 10,000 years back, which is a very small time period in terms of geological clock.
Humanoids-——>modern man....natural evolution at much slower speed, around a million years span.
Observing behavior of some modern humans, that 2nd evolution is still not complete :-)
Why do they even bother answering these questions. They should just shoo them aside and say something like, “Let me say something about the economy...” and then launch into what he did to attract businesses away from California.
Why do they even bother answering these questions. They should just shoo them aside and say something like, “Let me say something about the economy...” and then launch into what he did to attract businesses away from California.
Well then it should be easy for you to take a bunch of apes and selectively breed them into chess masters. You can do it much faster than nature can. How would you propose to start? What trait would you select for? How about making the chimps play against each other round-robin style, and then breeding the ones with the top scores? How many generations does the theory of evolution say it would take before we get the first 2500+ banana-eating grandmaster?
Nonhumans into non humans? Don’t think so.
Wolves into dogs is still canines, change in form but not a change into a non-canine.
Non-humans, chimps, lemurs, turtles, etc, can’t, won’t, didn’t change or evolve into humans
“There are clear indications from our people who have amazing intellectual capability “
Meaning, I suppose, there are claims of clear indications from (those of) our people, i.e. my co-religionists” (Amazing to whom? In comparison to Rick Perry? Then why are they not announcing their candidature?)
“that this didn't happen by accident and a creator put this in place.”
This would seem to be a reference to Scientific Creationism, a bankrupt and incoherent pseudoreligion in which whatever cannot be explained at present is attributed to the intervention of a Creator. This is a matter of faith, and not a conclusion to be drawn from an interpretation of geology or astronomy.
”Now, what was his time frame and how did he create the earth that we know? I'm not going to tell you that I've got the answers to that. I believe that we were created by this all-powerful supreme being”
By which all-powerful supreme being?
“and (concerning the question of) how we got to today versus what we look like thousands of years ago”
It is revealing that he specifies the time frame of thousands of years ago. We certainly looked and talked much the same as we do today thousands of years ago. It is more a question of tracking ancestry over more than a billion years, unless one is a young earth creationist.
”I think there's enough holes in the theory of evolution to, you know, say there are some holes in that theory..”
If only a complete evolutionary record, in which every single ancestor were itemized, in a list extending back to the first common ancestor, were sufficient evidence, then evolutionary theory is indeed irrefutable, and thus outside the realm of science. However that implicit standard cannot be met by any human knowledge. If this criterion were applied generally, it would be very similar to saying that, since the entire sequence of events leading to the collapse of the twin towers is not known in every single detail, then there must be a cover-up, and the official story is a conspiracy.
OK, I get your point, you believe that Rick Perry either is a Creationist or an Intelligent design supporter.
Does this disqualify him to be President in your eyes?
God created evolution.
Would that be the short answer Rick Perry should have given?
When I say it, it usually ends the conversation.
Well, it’s none of my business, as I am not an American.
But I am a scientist, so it is my personal preference that political leaders should not have a distorted view of the natural world. Maybe you (and others) are right; it doesn’t matter what they believe, so long as they attempt to provide good government.
So how do you explain polystrate fossils? Or the wolemi pine? Or the coelacanth? That’s just for starters too.
101 Evidences for a Young Age of the Earth...And the Universe
http://creation.com/age-of-the-earth
Center for Scientific Creation - In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood
http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/IntheBeginningTOC.html
I cannot explain those things since I’m not exactly sure what needs explaining. I have seen tree trunks standing in a flooded swamp...sometimes the trees can be 100s of years old (unless you dispute dendrochronology), and perhaps, under rare conditions, subject to subsidance and burial by a series of sedimentary deposits. It certainly isn’t common, nor are coelecanths (possibly a few hundred left) or wolemi pines (100 in the wild, but you can buy the seeds on-line). What is your point? Many islands and isolated ecosystems harbor rare endemic species. Sometimes isolated rare populations survive for a long, long time. Sort of like anachronist young earth creationists clinging to survival in the world of modern science.
And I mean real science, not phony degrees from mail-order bible colleges, like those brandished by (most of) your experts.
For your part, you have a lot of explaining to do, if you think the earth is only 6500 years old: a sedimentary column two miles thick, all neatly sorted in a matter of forty days on the crystaline granite crust, which somehow disappated all the heat from its transition from a molten state, all in a matter of a few years, basking in the light of seemingly distant stars and galaxies.
You, Sir, make me sad, as there will be no disuading you of your folly. A matter of pride, I expect. Which is a sin, perhaps the original sin.
By the way, why do young earth creationists always waffle about the age of the earth, giving some range between 6000 and 10000 years. What is wrong with Bishop Usher’s calculation? If your chronology is so damned accurate, you should be able to give a specific year for creation, and for the flood of Noah/Uttnapushtim. This would have an interesting consequence; you would haev to become very precise about when all the various independent methods for chronology suddenly become unreliable, i.e. at odds with your interpretation of the biblical account; there is not not very much time between the biblical flood and known dynasties in Egypt.
Oh, what’s the point!
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