Posted on 09/22/2010 7:55:54 AM PDT by Michael Zak
On this day in 1862, President Abraham Lincoln (R-IL) issued the Emancipation Proclamation. Effective at yearend, all slaves in Confederate-controlled territory would be "forever free."
(Excerpt) Read more at grandoldpartisan.typepad.com ...
“There is nothing factually incorrect with what he posted” — Indeed, the truth is on the Republicans’ side, which is why I relentlessly encourage them to use it against the Democrats, relentlessly.
Forgot to add your names to the above posts.
You really need to get over yourself.
Don’t go away mad...
Of course you can ignore them. Just look at 1984.
With very few exceptions, every Southern county turned red.
So, when the South really wanted to vote for a Conservative Republican for President -- Ronald Reagan's 2nd term -- the Southern Black vote was irrelevant.
And the larger truth is beyond spin: until Barry Goldwater in 1964, the South had voted consistently for Liberal Progressive Democrats or third party candidates for President.
Since 1964 the South has voted more Republican than Democrat, and since Bill Clinton, pretty consistently so.
But claims we've seen on this thread that the South has "always" been more conservative are not supported by historical facts, pal.
At the same time the South went from consistent Democrats to pretty reliable Republicans, my northern state went from consistent Republican to pretty reliable Democrat.
That's too bad, but my county has been consistent Republicans, and so has my family.
Indeed, if you look at more recent elections, the real divisions are not North versus South or East and West, but rather country versus city.
My county is rural, so we vote Republican.
The big cities vote Democrat, the suburbs are flip-flop'n independents & moderates.
That's the real truth of the matter.
cowboyway: "You and Zak are the kind of lying, spinning, establishment repubs that have turned a lot of us true conservatives off."
I'm not "establishment" anything, and despite your constant claims, you've proved no lies.
And who is it that's turning off whom?
McCain is a lot more conservative than Obama. If you don't believe it, call Rush and get his opinion.
Rush supported (however reluctantly) McCain over Obama.
McCain is a "moderate" Republican.
Obama is an insane Liberal Progressive redistributionist Democrat.
There was no real choice here, and the South to its credit wisely chose McCain. Good for them.
My sincere apologies, mam.
I promise to respect you just as much as you respect me. Deal?
mstar: "Hey, if you want to go the "all Republican presidents/ candidates were/are great all the time" route, I say give credit where credit is due.
Let's lift up the virtues of Nixon and his Republicans, all in position when Roe V Wade was passed on January 22, 1973, and was no moral force to stop it."
The facts are not that complicated: "Mr. Conservative" Barry Goldwater was the first Republican the South ever voted for, in 1964.
In 1968 and 1972 the South voted for the "moderate" Republican, Richard Nixon over Democrat lunatics Humphrey and McGovern.
But in 1976 the South voted for a Southern lunatic, Jimmy Carter, and even in 1980 split its vote between Carter and Reagan. Point is, the South has not always voted conservative.
Of course your devotion to the cause of Life is hugely appreciated -- you sound like a saint to me.
But remember, until recent years both parties included people who were Pro Life. For example, my state had a popular Pro Life Democrat Governor.
Now those days are gone -- Democrats have driven off their Pro Life members, and Republicans are more than happy to welcome them into the fold.
And by the way, Roe v Wade was not "passed" by Congress. It was a decision of the Supreme Court -- an unconstitutional decision for which the Court should eventually be disciplined, imho.
But you are correct there was "no moral force to stop it."
The only thing which will stop it is the election and appointment of more conservatives.
mstar: "The Republican and Democratic parties of the 60's and 70's on until the Reagan revolution had little integrity to stop America's moral downward spiral."
Democrats never had any integrity.
Republicans always had at least some.
mstar: "So if this is an attempt to market the Republican Party to the current black race of today, you might want to address the real crime against them, rather dragging out the dirty laundry of southern slavery with the intent of finding a current scapegoat."
I'm not "marketing" anything, to blacks or anyone else -- just trying to keep the historical truth from getting lost in a cloud of Southern rah-rah.
And yes, I do get a bit annoyed by some Southern posters' insulting "more conservative than thou" attitude.
mstar: "Instead you seem to defending these very same pro-abort Old Guard Rockefeller/Nixon/Ford Country Club Republicans that helped to serve up the very atmosphere that produced Roe V Wade."
Roe v. Wade was decided by a Supreme Court vote of seven to two.
The two who voted "no," White and Rehnquist, were appointed by Kennedy and Nixon respectively.
Of the seven who voted for Roe v. Wade, three were appointed by Eisenhower, two by Nixon, and one each by Johnson and Franklin Roosevelt.
Now, in all fairness, Roosevelt and Eisenhower were both long dead when this decision was made, and probably should be forgiven for the votes of their appointees.
Of Nixon's three appointees, one voted "no" and two "yes." Coulda' shoulda' Nixon have predicted that before appointing them?
And of course, Lyndon Johnson's one appointee, who voted "yes" was Thurgood Marshall. Is there some irony here?
mstar: "If you truly cared about the American blacks why do you fail to address this issue, but instead spend so much energy on a past that no longer exist?"
I'm not defending American blacks or anyone else, except conservatives and Republicans, of course.
My goal is to defend history against certain efforts to distort it. Note my tag line.
mstar: "Do hope you are not following in the footsteps of those Republicans involved postwar southern reconstruction that continued to devour American blacks for political and economic gain. Not a good place to be."
Sorry, but I have no clue what you are talking about.
Might you be mistaking me for someone else?
My respects for your father.
I only mentioned "World War Two vet" because that is how our "pal" cowboyway introduced us to his father.
I figured, if that was important to him, then maybe I should mention it to. ;-)
My spare time comes & goes. For the moment I have enough to deal with you folks.
jessduntno: "He doesn’t get that you can purge the party of the soft, limp wristed types that kill us in every crucial vote.
Either he’s really that dim and doesn’t see that, or just another RINO that doesn’t give a shit about what happens as long as “his side wins.”
He probably thinks Snowe and Collins were “wins” for us.
Still weeps over losing Arlen Sphincter.
Can’t figure out that it’s better to kick them to the curb and put in a reliable conservative."
You may not have noticed, but according to polls at least, Arlen Sphincter will soon be replaced by a far more dependable conservative.
Your post here is pure fantasy, and uncalled for.
Did you make some effort to "reason"?
Do you call insults "reason"?
“ask a black what Party, Lincoln, who freed the slaves was with, Democrat or Republican.”
Yup. A lot of people are getting (or assuming) incorrect information. My niece, who’s married to a black guy, was SHOCKED when her mom let her know that it was the Dems who opposed civil rights, and the Republicans who passed it.
Also... wasn’t it a white person who founded the NAACP?
Punkrr's contributions to this thread thus far:
"Poor pokie's manufactured outrage didn't slow him up from pinging his coven of misfits, morons, and America bashers LOL"
"How would you ever notice who is in the party pokie? You've got you own bulbous snout shoved so firmly up your own poop-chute."
"WTF does that have to do with anything dipshiite?"
"BFD Moron probably has a confederate flag in the back of his Yugo..."
"Is the real idabooby finally revealed?! (idabooby in a reflective pose) "
"What a curious post. If you don't vote Republican who do you vote for? "
"Like I said above, thanks for proving that Lost Cause Losers will never be able to get along. FIFY "
"Now there’s a Freudian slip if I ever saw one. Were you aiming your aspersions at the wrong poster, or were you referring to the wrong “talking points” when you went off half-cocked?!"
"Watch for “But but but what have y’all done lately” in 5..4..3..."
"Sorry to disappoint you cva but it will ALWAYS be known as the “Party of Lincoln”. Now what are you gonna do?!"
"So you’re stating that jamming a thumb into you own collective eye-sockets is a rational response to perceived (and self-inflicted) injustice? Bwaaaahaaa! I hope a couple of your more reasonable comrades take you off to the side and do some ‘splainin to ya ;-)"
"Amen Brother, a great post. ;-)"
"Most informative posts BroJoeK, great work. ;-)"
"Nice try Colonel, but you know the old adage; “There’s none so blind as those dumber than a rotted stump”...;-)"
"I wonder. I also wonder if some are as much a shrewish old crone in person as is presented online?"
"“Bimbos in flags”? WTF are you jabbering on about?"
"That’s funny considering that liberaltarians like pokie and starstruck wouldn’t know a conservative if their lives depended on it."
"You really need to get over yourself. "
"Don’t go away mad..."
punkrr complaining about 'flinging poo' is the equivilent of shooting your parents and complaining about being an orphan.
I for one have no clue what you keep jabbering about.
If you voted conservative, that's fine.
If you voted liberal -- well, that's your business.
But if you voted liberal and now claim it was really a "conservative" vote, well then I'm going to try to correct the record.
That's all this is about.
No need for you to be fantasizing about "establishment RINOs" or whatever. Or blasting away with unjustified insults.
Hahahahahha ... that's what I thought ... you consider Arlen a conservative ... who just wasn't reliable ... but you will get one who is MORE reliable ...
hahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahaha ...
“I for one have no clue ...”
Takes a big man to admit that, Joe. But I think you are finally right about something.
You know, you could just as easily have read that the way I intended it -- namely that Arlen Sphincter was neither reliable nor conservative, but if the polls are right, he'll be replaced by someone who is both reliable and conservative.
You could have read it that way, if you were trying to be reasonable. Were you?
What I think I understand is that you hate Republicans -- indeed you hate the whole idea of Republicans.
You hate them so much you'd rather see Republicans defeated -- by who doesn't much matter, as long as they're not Republicans, right?
And since the party most likely to defeat those evil Republicans are Democrats, you favor them, no matter what, right?
So what's the word they use for folks like you, is it troll?
“What I think I understand is that you hate Republicans — indeed you hate the whole idea of Republicans. You hate them so much you’d rather see Republicans defeated — by who doesn’t much matter, as long as they’re not Republicans, right? And since the party most likely to defeat those evil Republicans are Democrats, you favor them, no matter what, right? So what’s the word they use for folks like you, is it troll?”
Joe, what you think you understand is not what is true ... it is only what you think you understand. You have missed the point of my posts and the whole thread. Hey put some mustard on that logic ... mustard is good with pretzels.
What you did is referred to as “post hoc, ergo propter hoc” and is the sign of an ignorant man, which you don’t seem to be ENTIRELY ... or a disingenuous debater who is desperate to discredit his opponent. None of those statements follow the other, leading you to a fallacy that serves your purpose.
And you claimed you you wanted honest debate, whining about how the charts and graphs were relevant to an argument that wasn’t being made. Please, stow the flaccid ad hominem attacks .. they make you look ridiculous, but very Republican. Learn to speak truth. You’ll get along better with the Conservatives trying to save this swamp of a party and after you are through wetting yourself over what might be a Republican lost seat or two, you might catch on to why we need to do it.
I can spend my time organizing for conservative, steaming north, while you spend your time electing RINO dimwits to public office, steaming south, strengthening them and making the job of electing actual conservatives (and doing it now) even harder - because there are RINoS in their seats! And you help put them there.
You think that if we elect REPUBLICANS (instead of CONSERVATIVES) that is better than nothing.
That is where you are wrong.
Many CONSERVATIVES think you establishment republicants are suckers for voting for establishment “Republicans.”
I am one of them. Many of us also think that purging a corrupted bloated POS bureaucracy like your beloved GOP is the next best thing to “watering the tree of Liberty” without the bloodshed. So far.
So no, Joe, that doesn’t make me a troll. You have my permission to look back at the thousands of posts I have made supporting CONSERVATIVE causes over the last five years.
I understand why you would think someone not supporting an Arlen Sphincter or Snowe Job up in Maine must be crazy or a troll, though.
It’s because you are the “staunch Republican” that has watched this pitiful display of political cowardice devolve into RepubliDem tripe. I pity you.
You will see that my distaste for the Grand Old Potty of which you are so enamored knows no bounds. But that does not make me a liberal or a troll, as your Republican besotted brain wants you to do.
It does, however make me think that you are the perfect dupe for the Republican Party machine. Good luck with that.
I don’t vote for ANY politician who will go to any lengths to get re-elected.
You do. As long as they are Republican.
I don’t vote for ANY politician who will make a mockery of the Republican Party by posing as a Republican.
You do. As long as they put Republican after their name.
I no longer accept whatever garbage the Grand Old Potty establishment nominates.
You do. As long as they are Republican.
Get your head checked. The Grand Old Potty needs to be flushed. Conservatives can do it. You can’t. Lead, follow or get out of the way.
Hey, Joe. Admit it. If you had the chance, when he was a small r, you voted (or would have, if you could) for Sphincter. Didn’t you?
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