Is Being a 'Truther' Really a Bad Thing?

Vanity

[lquist1]

This is my first (and maybe only) writing in FR, but I wanted to address this issue about Obama's eligibility to be POTUS....

[Nea Wood]

The way I see it, if we birthers are such weird kooks, there’s an easy and inexpensive way to shut us up and prove us wrong...just produce the real birth certificate.

[Non-Sequitur]

It boils down to whether he listed himself as a foreign citizen when applying for a student loan.

Why would he do that? I was in college in the 70's and I don't recall student loans as being all that hard to get - though I eventually got Uncle Sam to foot my entire bill. Many of my peers in high school got student loans without any trouble at all. As easy as it was for U.S. students to get loans, I imagine it would be difficult if not almost impossible for a foreign student to get a U.S. bank to lend them money. I can certainly speak from experience as the father of a college student that currently we've gotten dozens of come-ons for student loans, and I've seen nothing in any of them that offer loans to foreigners. It's all U.S. students only.

And another thing, Obama went to college in the late-70's and early 80's. That was the beginning of Affirmative Action. Every college in America would have been throwing scholarships and grants at aany qualified black student to attend their school. Foreign citizenship wouldn't have helped there.

But it also pertains to his claims of openness and transparency that he promised during his campaign yet he won’t even allow those to be released.

I'll grant you that the refusal to provide his birth certificate goes against the whole openness and transparancy promises, though I understand his political reasons for doing so. However, college records are irrelevant to the matter.

[LucyT]

Thanks, Jet Jaguar.

Ping to #1 and #15.

.

[cripplecreek]

[backhoe]

[thecodont]

Your 2: Obama has NOT, repeat NOT, released a “Certificate of Live Birth”. That is one of the problems. He has only released, and done so in an informal way, a very different document called a “CERTIFICATION of Live Birth”. There is a huge difference between the two documents and it would help keep things straight if the proper terminology was used consistently.

We need a glossary of "birther" terms.

[Spunky]

"No, they’re sometimes called ‘birth certificate truthers’"

Maybe they are sometimes called that,(I myself have never heard that) but the majority of people who hear or see the word "Truthers" know it refers to those who think 911 was an inside job.

[Quix]

AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!

Though I think TRUTHERS is about 911

and BIRTHERS is about OThuga.

[Quix]

If I understand the field at all, I think

TRUTHERS

is a whole lot broader and more complex than you asserted.

[Quix]

INDEED.

IIRC, his sister asserts the same thing.

[MHGinTN]

I had a person who speaks the language the grandmother was speaking in that interview listen to the exchanges (they are now quite garbled) and concluded that the grandmother was referring to both Baracks, and that senior was in Hawaii when junior was born within her sight. Your milage may vary. I do not speak that language sge was speaking so I can only talk the friends word for it.

[Quix]

GREAT IMAGE. THANKS

FWIW, I came across this 911/new info thread while looking for UFO stuff on ATS:

I haven’t read much of it but it looks to be a bit above many threads on the topic with purportedly new evidence from newly declassified docs from the Commission.

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread484473/pg1

[John Valentine]

I was using sarcasm.

[lquist1]

Thanks for all your responses. I’m sorry for mixing up the terminology. For some reason, I thought people were calling us ‘truthers’ and I’d forgotten that this term was used for 9/11 conspiracy nuts. So, I guess we are ‘birthers’ then.

I guess I also had a few of my facts incorrect, but I still think that we as conservatives should be concerned about this and push for it to be resolved by at LEAST having Obama authorize Hawaii to release the REAL birth certificate to a court that is handling one of these cases, just to clear it up.

I’m confused about one thing, iowamark, you say that Obama’s paternal grandmother, who apparently signed a sworn affidavit saying she witnessed the birth of Obama in Kenya, was taking about his father, Barack sr. Wouldn’t she have been the one GIVING birth to Barack’s father? How could she claim to have witnessed it?

Your overall point is valid though, it does seem unlikely to me as well that Barack’s mother would have been in Kenya.

But then there are other issues to resolve, like how he could have attended his school in Indonesia, which required him to be a citizen of that country, when Indonesia doesn’t allow dual citizenship. Wouldn’t he have had to renounce his US citizenship at that time?

[SunkenCiv]

Not “Truther”, but “Birther”. “Truthers” are those colossal d-heads who think 9/11 was engineered by the US gov’t, or some shadowy agency, or by the Jews. As far as I’m concerned, anyone who believes that to be the case should be strung up with piano wire and left for the buzzards to clean the carcass.

[iowamark]

Obama’s paternal grandmother, who apparently signed a sworn affidavit saying she witnessed the birth of Obama in Kenya

Sarah Obama is not actually Obama’s grandmother, she is one of the plural wives of Obama’s grandfather. Obama’s Muslim grandfather and father each had multiple wives. Despite the many birther claims, I do not believe that Sarah Obama ever signed any such affidavit. This is a constant pattern with the birther claims.

But then there are other issues to resolve, like how he could have attended his school in Indonesia, which required him to be a citizen of that country, when Indonesia doesn’t allow dual citizenship. Wouldn’t he have had to renounce his US citizenship at that time?

Once again, a false claim. There are many foreign students in Indonesia. It is irrelevant anyway. Even if, during childhood, his parents had signed some document giving up his US citizenship or if Lolo Soetoro had adopted him, Obama could have reclaimed his US citizenship upon reaching adulthood. The fact that he returned to Hawaii for high school indicates a desire to be American.

[lquist1]

Alright iowamark, I guess you have some good points. I still think there’s alot of uncertainty about this whole thing, and I find it very curious that he refuses to authorize Hawaii to release an original copy of the B.C. to a court that could put this whole thing to rest.

Anyway, let’s keep fighting like hell to defeat his policies and hope we can send him the way of Jimmy Carter.

[Redwood Bob]

“There was no “travel restriction” to Pakistan, only a warning.”

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In 1981, there were no travel warnings, merely an advisory on how 30-day tourist visas were available at the airport. IIRC, there have been warnings at other times. FWIW I recall a 1986 warning that the Khyber pass area was becoming dangerous due to tribal fighting.

[Redwood Bob]

Obama’s paternal grandmother Sarah Obama has signed a sworn affidavit saying she witnessed his birth at a hospital in Kenya...

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I’m sure if Granny Sarah had signed a sworn affidavit saying she witnessed his birth at a hospital in Kenya it would be posted on the masthead of World Net Daily and every birther website, and would be trumpeted everywhere. Please provide link to this sworn affidavit.

[Robert DeLong]

Don't post something I didn't say, as if it were a direct quote of what I had posted, and then ask me to link to something I didn't say or post. I never said she signed a sworn affidavit, I said that she told Corsi that she witnessed his birth in a Kenya hospital.

Here's a link to that story.