The Knights Templar took my soul
and all I got was this bloody shirt.
Posted on 05/24/2009 10:20:53 AM PDT by Logic n' Reason
I have become very curious about the Freemasons and freemasonry in general.
How does it "fit in" with the group of Christian religions...how about islam? What are the views and opinions of those at this site?
Protestants killed LOTS of Catholics.
Catholics killed LOTS of Protestants.
Many Churches were burned, on both sides, during the “Reformation” -— and much of that strife was NOT justified by anything but a lust for power by the leaders involved.
Christians are human, and as such we are all sinners, and members of the various Christian faiths will make mistakes, and will be lead the wrong way at times.
>> Simple: It was the HISTORY that embarrassed the Church, more than any particular problem with Masonic practices in general. <<
Oh, brother. Here comes the anti-Catholic nonsense.
You asked me why the Knights of Columbus was formed.
I gave you, IMHO, a very good answer.
Now, you seem to feel that the Knights of Columbus has no valid right to exist, as it was founded for “financial” reasons? Sorry but your arguments and biases are hard to understand.
SO WHAT!
Yes, Catholics wanted a Fraternal organization, and at the same time Catholics need insurance protection that they were denied, due to bigotry.
So, what in the world is wrong with Catholics taking care of Catholics?
Frankly, you can not qualify for “fraternal” insurance rules and tax rates and regulatory issues without a religious or charitable or community purpose.
Logic & Reason
http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/NWO/33rd_Initiation.htm
Not saying it’s true......interesting though.
That was a pointless post.
I never claimed knights of columbus was masonic. And your last line is just stupid.
I have become very curious about Kraft Macaroni and Cheese and pasta meals made with cheese in general. How does it “fit in” with the group of Christian religions...how about islam? What are the views and opinions of those at this site?
I don’t care for either the masons or the KofC. What ticks me off is when a typical catholic goes on a rant about masons, but thinks it’s just fine for the KofC to exist.
Gimme a break.
Don’t be a knee jerk reactionary!
I AM Catholic.
However, you can not do a good job DEFENDING the Faith, without, First, UNDERSTANDING the Faith, and History!
The historic resistance of the Catholic Church, towards Masonry, is understandable on many levels.
However, the Church today does NOT have an out right ban on Masonry, simply warnings to keep true to the Catholic Faith and to not water down Catholicism in an attempt at “Fraternity”.
Our own Popes have made apologies about the behavior of the Catholic Church, towards the Eastern Orthodox Church, during the Schism. In fact, I would say that the Catholic Church is READY for full UNION with the Orthodox, it is the Orthodox which resist, for political reasons and a bit of pride in a few of their leaders.
You can be a devout, even Saintly Catholic, and admit that some of our Popes might not have made it into Heaven.
I have defended the Catholic Church during the Third Reich, several times on these threads.
I dare say that I defend Catholic Popes far more often than all but one or two other posters, on these threads.
However, we are NOT required by our Faith to believe that Rome has never made any mistakes.
We have had Catholic Councils which have totally repudiated and reversed previous Catholic Councils, we have had Popes who have reversed previous Popes, on matters of Faith.
We have had Popes that sired countless bastard children.
We have had more than one Pope at the same time, once I think we even had 3 Popes at the same time.
We make mistakes, sometimes.
It is not anti-Catholic to admit as much.
In fact, to “confess our sins” is the HALLMARK OF CATHOLIC TEACHING, is it not?
Those of us who are Freemasons are very clear in our understanding that Masonry is NOT an alternative religion. Discussing issues of politics and religion is discouraged in Lodge where the rituals performed are intended to teach men how to act with tolerance, grace, dignity, and a profound respect for God.
There are Christians who take the position that any institution interested in promoting morality, but which is not explicitly Christian, including Freemasonry, is anathema. That is so close-minded as to be deserving of scorn and ridicule.
Freemasonry requires ONLY that members believe in a Creator; there is NO requirement that members belong to any specific religion. The Masonic philosophical system, and the lessons of morality inherent in it, is intended to make “good men better.” How people can find something anti-Christian in that continues to puzzle me.
It is easy to understand why Catholics might take it personally.
For me? I simply do not easily associate the ignorance of one person, in a group, to the entire group.
I see Masons who say or believe stupid things as individuals.
As a “secret society” however, it is easy to understand why some would think that the odd, or even bigoted beliefs, of ONE Mason, or Knight, might be the teachings of the “group” -—
And yes, brother Knights, I am aware that the Knights of Columbus says they are “not a ‘secret society’” I simply think that particular distinction is nonsense.
I think we are, every bit as much as the Masons, a “secret society” -— and I refuse to buy the distinctions some make.
Luke 8:17
For nothing is hidden that will not be made manifest, nor is anything secret that will not be known and come to light.
Col2:8
See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the world, and not according to Christ.
Heb4:13
And no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
Great site, Ex-Mason’s for Jesus
Take a look at your local Masonic lodge sometime. No windows, or all windows are covered over.
Freemasonry is full of rituals, oaths, symbolism.....these things the scriptures warn against.
The official stance of the Catholic church is repent or excommunication for delving into Freemasonry.
Freemasonry is know as, “The Craft”
Freemasons will say, “We are NOT a religion.” yet call the lodge a temple. They have a Worshipful Master, Masonic bible, pray to GAOTU. Yes, GAOTU = Great Architect Of The Universe.
GAOTU is whatever deity you choose to worship.
Do a little research and you will find many people left Freemasonry because it was in conflict to their Christan beliefs.
Research the writings of Albert Pike (Morals and Dogma)and Manly P. Hall.
http://www.saintsalive.com/newsletters/apr-may-00-nl/finney_masonry.htm
My former parish was full of Masons. They used to tell our priest and former priest.....we were here before you came, we will be here after you leave, this is our church.
Huh? Our church? I told my priest...is this not the Lord's church?
He told me not to pay attention to them, they have always been trouble makers in the church.
If some decision didn't go their way, they collectively began holding back funds, attempting to use church cannons to sanction or cause grief for the pastor.
My family and I fled this church...just couldn't stand it any longer. These guys were arrogant, certainly not humble, prideful, boastful......you name it.
This is what led to my study of Freemasonry. I attempted to research on a secular basis as well as on a Christian basis.
I for one am convinced that most lower level masons have no idea the true agenda of Freemasonry. To them, it is an innocent fraternity.
Read testimonies of higher level Ex-Masons...this is where you will receive the real agenda.
It is good that your father was not a freemason since it is impossible for a Catholic to be a freemason.
From the Catholic Encyclopedia:
“In view of these several reasons Catholics since 1738 are, under penalty of excommunication, incurred ipso facto, and reserved to the pope, strictly forbidden to enter or promote in any way Masonic societies.”
Again, if a Catholic becomes a mason they are by that act excommunicated.
As a Catholic I naturally know nothing about the internal workings of Masonry. I know some fine people who are Masons and some fine people who are Mormons.
Since George Washington was a Mason, obviously there are far worse things.
I can answer your question about how people find the Masons Anti - Christian.
It is simple. Christians believe that God is the Truth and the Light. The only way to salvation. That His Word is the truth.
The Masons freely accept other faiths. That in and of itself is against the teachings of the Bible.
Christians don’t need to believe in conspiracy theories to disagree with the basic Mason structure. The Masons themselves reveal enough for us to know.
The Knight of Columbus has some structure in common with the Masons, but the the foundations of the two are different. Father McGivney addressed the shortommings of the Masons and other fraternal organizations of the time and created the thoroughly Catholic organization of which I am a proud member.
Using your analogy one might think that a Trabant and a Lexus were the same because the have the same basic structural parts (frame, wheels, engine, etc.)
Born in Peterborough, Ontario, Canada in 1901, the Hall family moved to the United States in 1904. In 1919, Manly settled in Los Angeles. From an early age he was interested in occult matters and subsequently joined a number of societies: Theosophy, Freemasonry, the Societas Rosecruciana in Civitatibus Foederatis, and the American Federation of Astrologers.
After writing his first book, The Initiates of the Flame, in 1922, Hall began collecting rare books on the mystery schools and esoteric philosophy to begin assembling the text for a magnum opus of occult history. During this time he also travelled extensively in Europe, Asia and Egypt. In the search for “ancient wisdom” texts, Manly Hall's favorite place was the British Museum in London:
“The great center of learning in England is the British Museum, with its miles of bookcases, which caused De Quincy to sit and weep because he could not read all the volumes. In order to gain access to the two principal departments of the museum—one of rare books, and the other of manuscripts—it was necessary to be appropriately sponsored. I had the good fortune of becoming acquainted with General Sir Francis Younghusband, the man who led the British expedition into Tibet in 1903-1904, and camped his army at the foot of the Potola at Lhasa. While dining one day at the Officer’s Club, Sir Francis confided to me that he was known as the conqueror of Tibet, but he regarded this as a dubious honor. The real fact, he said, was that Tibetan religion and philosophy had conquered him. A note from Sir Francis immediately gave me admission to the most valuable parts of the British Museum, and I was able to examine the originals of many of the world’s most priceless books and manuscripts.” 5
In 1923, Hall was ordained a minister by the Los Angeles-based Church of the People, an occult/metaphysical congregation. As the leader of the Church of the People, Hall started a magazine titled “ The All Seeing Eye.”
By 1928, after 6 years of work and raising $100,000 for the first edition, Manly Hall finally published what has become a valuable classic for those who want to learn about the history of the occult and the “Ancient Wisdom” mystery schools: The Secret Teachings of All Ages. A quarter of a century later, the sheer breadth and scope of the work remains impressive: “pythagorean mathematics; alchemical formulae; Hermetic doctrine; the workings of the Kabala; the geometry of Ancient Egypt; the Native American myths; the uses of cryptograms; an analysis of the Tarot; the symbols of Rosacrucianism; the esotericism of the Shakespearean dramas – these are just a few of Hall’s topics.” 6
In 1934, Hall founded the Philosophical Research Society, a research institute modeled on the ancient school of Pythagoras. It was here that he made his home, he held weekly lectures and continued to publish an incredible body of work. In the year of his death, Manly P. Hall was bestowed with the honorary 33º of Scottish Rite Masonry
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