Using The U.S. Military to Round Up U.S. Citizens and Confiscate Their Private Weapons

[FortWorthPatriot]

There have been several posts on different threads where this topic has been discussed. Some FReepers say our U.S. military would not use armed force against citizens if order to do so; others say they would, going as far as saying that "the military will fight for whoever pays them to."

I thought why not just ask our FReepers who are currently on active duty what they think.

So, active duty military FReepers, here are the questions:

1. Would you obey an order from the current president to disarm U.S. citizens and force them into internment camps?

2. Do you believe that those in your chain of command would carry out such an order?

3. What do you believe is the percentage of personnel in your command that would refuse the order?

4. What do you believe is the percentage of personnel in the entire U.S. miltary that would refuse the order?

[ronnyquest]

I should qualify that statement. By police, I include BATF and FBI; the actual local police forces will be tasked, but each area will comply or not based on the conscience and relationship with the residents. Actual police forces in cities will be more likely to participate than those in small towns and rural areas. I can’t see county police and sheriffs participating; state police are more likely to participate in most states than locals.

However, we have already seen the opposition’s willingness to “bus in” non-locals to achieve their ends. Use of the civilian defense force will be no exception. “Troubled” areas will be targeted by non-locals who have no emotional attachment to the area.

[absolootezer0]

MI state police was in on it as well.

[wolfcreek]

True. I’m actually thinking of a more gorilla war.

[Atlas Sneezed]

The Federal LEO’s will follow orders during the initial phase, but as issues crop up and the popluace (and the Military) turn against them, many of them will switch sides.

---

I’d be grateful and relieved if you could share evidence that a career federal “law enforcement” officer “balked” any time or “switched sides”, say, in the last 50 years, when asked to infringe the life or Constitutional liberties of a citizen.

I hope I’m wrong, and willing to be corrected.

[absolootezer0]

snopes is your friend.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/satire/oath.asp

[Big_Monkey]

"4. I am confident enough in our military personnel to say that at least 99% would refuse to obey."

This reminds me of the Denzel/Bruce Willis movie "Under Siege". In it, Denzel portrays the protagonist, a FBI office, against Willis' antagonist, a neo-fascist Army General. But, I think in reality the roles would be reversed. It's the Federal LEO that most scare me. Look at Ruby Ridge, WACO and Elian Gonzales as examples as Jack Boot thuggery perpetrated by Democratic administrations.

As a veteran, I have tremendous confidence that there are enough patriots in the officer and SNCO ranks that they would be the buffer between the "Imperial Federal Government" and America's civilian population.

Officer's and Enlisted swear an oath to defend the Constitution. They don't swear an oath to defend the ruling political class.

[Badeye]

Sorry, I completely and totally disagree with your assessment here.

No biggie, unlike liberals we are allowed to disagree from time to time.

[ronnyquest]

Take a look at the executive orders he’s been issuing since being sworn in. Subtle, but it’s gaining momentum. Their move to consolidate power has been aggressive.

[Gilbo_3]

unfortunately, the initial orders will be justifiable in the avg officer's mind as targeting 'enemies of the state'...or hardcore dangerous 'nutjobs'...

just think Waco...

phase two will undoubtedly be trickier, and Im confident that a majority of military will 'know' the orders are wrong, but will follow along in self preservation mode...

again, just think Nazis or 'red block' anybodies...or for that matter...blue vs grey in US history...

the real rubber on the asphalt comes when we get to a blanket order [targeting whole inner-city communities like new orleans] and the ability of a handful of 'mutineers' to haul off plenty of goodies as they go AWOL from their units and decide that their conviction to God & Constitution is worthy of killing their own family and friends...

nobody can speak for another human being at that point...only time will really tell...

that is the whole point of the exercises in Comm-gress presently...trying to guage 'resistance' a little bit at a time...

my .02...

[Scythian]

Exactly, that is why all this bravado is so silly, no one will lift a finger, why? there were never be a focus point that causes it, in fact, one might say the battle has already one, it’s only the details that need carrying out. Very well said “Jack Hammer”.

[Joe Brower]

"Split the military, split the USA."

I would predict a large number of units experiencing "loss of unit cohesion" should things go this way. God help us all.

[Travis McGee]

Indeed.

[wastedyears]

Do you mean guerrilla war?

[qam1]

I’d be grateful and relieved if you could share evidence that a career federal “law enforcement” officer “balked” any time or “switched sides”, say, in the last 50 years, when asked to infringe the life or Constitutional liberties of a citizen.

Just federal????

I’d be grateful and relieved if you could share evidence that ANY federal, state or local career “law enforcement” officer, switched sides.

It takes a real lowlife, to enforce and commit perjury in the name of most of the laws involved in the War on drugs, click it or ticket, MADD, etc.

Which is why, sad to say, the vast majority of those who became LEOs in the last 30-40 years are people with few to no principles which is just the type of people Obama wants.

[dragnet2]

1932, Bonus Army. Several killed hundreds wounded. 1970, Kent State. 4 killed, 9 wounded. National Guard opened fire with rifles. 1993, Waco. 76 killed, including 21 children and 2 pregnant women. US Army vehicles used, SOFD-D (Delta forces) on site. There have been others. Army soldiers will do as they are told until such a time they can figure out they are on the wrong side

Are you a military veteran?

Of course, that is how I know.

Most combat veterans I know would disagree with you, including me.

There are more military veterans on the streets right now, than current active members in the military.

The small list you provided are not typical scenarios, and certainly do not depict what is happening today.

Today the government is completely out of control. Even those in the military understand this. It's no secret.

If common Americans were forced, and justifiably revolted against this corrupt intrusive government, that has clearly betrayed Americans...well I just don't see the army or it's commanders turning their rifles against common Americans.

When and if it gets to that point, and I hope it does not, I will be proven correct.

One more point. For any army to defeat the people of the U.S. in a physical conflict, the only way the government would prevail, would be to literally pull out the big guns, air power etc, and level entire cities and towns killing millions at a time.

That aint going to happen.

What would happen is those on the ground, if they pushed millions of angry Americans into a corner, would see they were out numbered 500 to 1, and would quickly find themselves overwhelmed from every direction...They'd find themselves juggling flaming chain saws in short order.

Again, they only way *any* military would prevail against an armed country the size of the U.S. would be to wholesale annihilation of it's people with air power, armor, artillery etc, etc.

Ain't going to happen.

The American people are the most patient, civilized on the planet, but pushed into a corner, they can also be the meanest, most violent people on this planet.

[Centurion2000]

The American people are the most patient, civilized on the planet, but pushed into a corner, they can also be the meanest, most violent people on this planet.

Right. Asks the Nazis, militant Japanese, Mexicans or the Indians what happens when you threaten us.

We'll wipe your culture and take your land in a heartbeat.

[CodeToad]

As has been said before, no one is going to order any military unit to take weapons or arrest any lawful, peaceful American; no one. If they did, I have no doubt upper ranking officers would revolt and refuse such orders and many lower ranking members would also refuse.

What they will do is create a bogus situation and ask the military to quell it.

They know that no military member will ever disobey an order they think might not be right unless they were 100% sure they could refuse it without consequences and they were right.

If you are a veteran then you know very well the training is “Follow orders! We don’t pay you to think!” Some officer may revolt out of personal convictions, but they can easily be replaced. The vast majority of grunts will do as they are told and all they need is a simple plausible excuse to do so. There are NO grunts asking questions about legalities or civil rights or constitutional authorities. Not at first. Every single one of them will snap to and yell, “Yes, Sir!” in English or Spanish, who knows.

Now, a few days or weeks later, that dynamic will change radically. Troops will start questioning their orders, but not at first. At first they will be in yes sir mode and the shock of their orders won’t set in until they see the results. If they are shot at by Americans, they will be told those are “terrorists” or “agitators” or “rebels” that are causing the problems. Not being allowed to make phone calls or watch TV or read a newspaper, most will be clueless and follow whatever orders the propaganda suggests they should. Government propaganda and threats are powerful influences.

I have no doubt the People can win against the federal government. Hell, they number at most 4 million, including all LEO and FLEO. Against not less than 15 million well armed, trained, and military experienced Americans who no longer are funding the federal government, there is no way in Hell they can win.

[CodeToad]

“We’ll wipe your culture and take your land in a heartbeat. “

That was yesterday. Today, we have the JAG corp, a bunch of lawyers who say that is a bad policy. We are to love, coddle, and welcome the enemy now and play by civilian law enforcement rules. “Hearts and minds”. Politics kept us from wiping out the commies in Vietnam and is keeping us from putting Bin Laden in the dirt today.

I say, asses and heads first, we’ll love them later after they no longer can keep shooting at us.

[oldenuff2no]

Air tight water proof containers are cheaply and easily made out of 6”-10” PVC pipe, glue and caps. Use a screw on or in cap on one end. A shovel, a little time, wiped down with an oil cloth and they will be fine for months at a time. Ammo will store in the same way. If you are stupid enough to turn over all of your firearms then you deserve what you get. In many states you can still buy firearms from a private party without registration or background checks. These are the weapons you want to put under ground. Pay in cash and make sure it is a legal sale.
A good reloading set up and a stockpile of powder primers an bullets is also a good investment. It is not that hard to roll you own.

[dragnet2]

As has been said before, no one is going to order any military unit to take weapons or arrest any lawful, peaceful American; no one.

Your first sentence is ridicules since no one suggested the military is going to attack or mass arrest any *peaceful* Americans. That would certainly not be tolerated either.

If things get really bad, and the mood of the people changes from simple anger to boiling contempt, I hope no authority ever decides to go up against the people of this country. It will be government that needs to dramatically change and restructure, not the people.

In an extreme scenario, it would make the dusty streets of Baghdad look like a church picnic on a spring day.

The military would have better luck using teaspoons to stop rain from striking the ground.

If this comes to pass, and I really hope it does not, in the end it must be the people and the Constitution that prevail, not the government that has created and perpetuated these disasters.