God, Evolution and Charles Darwin

The Times ^ | September 17, 2008 | Nick Spencer

[Soliton]

Darwin Quotes:

1. “The mystery of the beginning of all things is insoluble by us; and I for one must be content to remain an Agnostic.”

2. “It seems to me absurd to doubt that a man may be an ardent Theist & an evolutionist.

3. “I hardly see how religion & science can be kept as distinct as [Edward Pusey] desires… But I most wholly agree… that there is no reason why the disciples of either school should attack each other with bitterness.”

4. “In my most extreme fluctuations I have never been an atheist in the sense of denying the existence of a God.”

5. “I think that generally (& more and more so as I grow older) but not always, that an agnostic would be the most correct description of my state of mind.” (Letter to John Fordyce, May 7 1879)

6. “I am sorry to have to inform you that I do not believe in the Bible as a divine revelation, & therefore not in Jesus Christ as the son of God.” (Letter to Frederick McDermott, November 24 1880)

7. [In conversation with the atheist Edward Aveling, 1881] “Why should you be so aggressive? Is anything gained by trying to force these new ideas upon the mass of mankind?” (Edward Aveling, The religious views of Charles Darwin, 1883)

9. "My theology is a simple muddle: I cannot look at the Universe as the result of blind chance, yet I can see no evidence of beneficent Design." (Letter to Joseph Hooker, July 12 1870)

10. “I can never make up my mind how far an inward conviction that there must be some Creator or First Cause is really trustworthy evidence.” (Letter to Francis Abbot, September 6 1871)

[SMCC1]

Sometimes I question the existence of God (thanks to liberal College science professors), but I don’t buy the argument that organized religion is the reason for most wars. It seems the absence of religion caused some of history’s most terrible wars. Nazism, Communism were both the result of the absence of religion and morals.

[Soliton]

Nazism, Communism were both the result of the absence of religion and morals.

If you follow an ideology religiously then it becomes a religion. Communism and National Socialism were religions to their ardent supporters.

[Soliton]

Nazism, Communism were both the result of the absence of religion and morals.

If you follow an ideology religiously then it becomes a religion. Communism and National Socialism were religions to their ardent supporters.

[LtKerst]

Deep inside I know that God is real.

all of nature has His fingerprints.

The transitional Fossil market for fakes was at an all time High when Arcyopterix was “found” along with many other frauds in the same area.

the so called “find” was sold at a great price and was locked away and only plaster casts are now shown as “proof”

Evolution is Satans Big Lie.

The Physical world supports the Creation Model every time.

[LiteKeeper]

YEC INTREP

[LiteKeeper]

Please read

Was there every nothing?

[Soliton]

So here's where we are. The Something that existed at the beginning must be able to exist without depending on anything else. It must be totally and fully self-sufficient. For It was alone at the very beginning. And It needed no environment within which to exist.

This is all conjecture. We do not know what existed before the big bang. We can not know what properties it might have. It is convenient for Christians to think it might be their God, but it could just as easily been a magic frog named Schmoo or an asymytry in the multiverse. There is no compelling reason to drag in the Judeo-Christian God except for your faith that it is true.

[Coyoteman]

The transitional Fossil market for fakes was at an all time High when Arcyopterix was “found” along with many other frauds in the same area.

the so called “find” was sold at a great price and was locked away and only plaster casts are now shown as “proof”

Perhaps you could check your facts a little before you make these grand pronouncements.

From Wiki:

The first complete specimen of Archaeopteryx was announced in 1861, only two years after Charles Darwin published On the Origin of Species, and it became a key piece of evidence in the debate over evolution. Over the years, nine more fossils of Archaeopteryx have surfaced. Despite variation among these fossils, most experts regard all the remains that have been discovered as belonging to a single species, though this is still debated.

If there are so many frauds in paleontology, I challenge you to name five. I'll even spot you the first two: Piltdown Man (actually a hoax) and Archaeoraptor. Can you come up with three more (and no, Nebraska Man does not count; that was a mistaken identification that lasted only a short time before the mistake was straightened out--by scientists). Hint: avoid the cr

Evolution is Satans Big Lie.

No, wrong again. Evolution is a scientific theory based on solid evidence.

[Hyzenthlay]

I’m taking an anthropology class that’s currently mostly about paleoanthropology and prehistoric archaeology, and a little bit of paleontology, so I think I can name at least three more frauds (not including the two you mentioned):

-The Cardiff Giant
-That Fujimura guy who was planting things in Japan
-The Calaveras Skull in California
-The fake artifacts in the Pachaug Forest

Well, I’m feeling a little more confident about my ability to pass my exam =)
You’d probably enjoy this book I’ve been reading called ‘Frauds, Myths, and Mysteries’ and it has a couple chapters that cover hoaxes but it also gets into debunking or explaining stuff like prehistoric UFO’s and Atlantis. It’s really fascinating and scientifically solid.

And, just on a random interesting note, Darwin only vaguely hinted at human evolution in Origin of Species, and then only in the last sentence. I guess he was expecting too much opposition from the people that wanted to believe that humans are completely special and separate beings than animals (instead of just ‘higher’ animals), or he wanted to hold on to those beliefs himself. And something even more interesting: Darwin wasn’t the first person to propose evolution - Aristotle was. Darwin was the first person to come up with a detailed and reasonable-sounding explanation of the ‘how’ and ‘why’ of evolution.

[Coyoteman]

Thanks for the reply.

You noted four "frauds" in your post. I think you perhaps are incorrect on these, as none relate to evolution.

-The Cardiff Giant: This had nothing to do with science. It was certainly a fraud and a hoax, but it was done for showmanship and greed, not science. And it certainly had nothing to do with paleontology or evolution.

-That Fujimura guy who was planting things in Japan: This was archaeology, and stone tools, not paleontology.

-The Calaveras Skull in California: This was apparently a recent Indian skull planted deep in a mine. It has nothing to do with paleontology.

-The fake artifacts in the Pachaug Forest: Again, this is archaeology and not paleontology.

I think my challenge to come up with five examples of fraud in evolution may still be intact.

[whattajoke]

5 Frauds in Evolution:

Ken Ham
Kent Hovind
Duane Gish
AiG
ICR

How’d I do?

[Coyoteman]

Can't argue with any of those!

But I'd add Jack Chick to the list!