Posted on 02/02/2021 8:57:08 AM PST by Onthebrink
There is a myriad of excellent tanks that have been built since the first British MkI rolled across the battlefields of Western Europe during the First World War. However, for every T-34, Leopard and M1 Abrams, there are tanks that rightfully belong on the scrap heap of history – yet instead of rusting away from memory, we should use these as examples of everything that went wrong.
While I am sure many can make different choices based on a whole host of different factors, here are my picks for the five worst tanks ever.
(Excerpt) Read more at 19fortyfive.com ...
From its looks, had to have been in the rear?
I would not wanted to be a tank crew man
Kind of depends on the tank and the tank crew, doesn’t it?
My Uncle was in Elvis’ tank crew in Germany. Said he got a lot of Elvis’ leftovers and hand-me-downs
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When they weren't broken down. And had gas.
I remember in the 1970s, a wargaming magazine had an article comparing different tanks, their strengths and weaknesses. For weaknesses of the Maus they had "Small mammals that eat the eggs?"
A lot of German tank development after the blitzkrieg years seemed to have been based on "We have a really big gun. Let's just put tracks under it and get it out the door." Mobility, visibility, reliability, production and operational efficiency and all that were secondary.
Don’t know if it’s true, but I think I read once that more Tigers (I and II) were abandoned when they broke down than were knocked out in action.
The ancient Romans used to say, "A pack of mangy dogs can bring down a lion."
The year after I left active duty they started deploying the M1's. Still, we felt pretty good about our chances against the Russian T-62.
“It’s modified so it’s as fast in reverse as it is going forward—we aim to get out of trouble as fast as we find ourselves getting into it”— Oddball.
Patton tank may refer to any of a series of tanks used by the United States military from the 1950s to the 1990s, named for General George S. Patton.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patton_tank
I didn't know it either before linking to these Wiki-pages. There isn't many bolts on an M60 I haven't turned. Like you, I never got a turn at the M1.
And, just as such a pack of dogs constantly communicates through yips, barks, and growls, WW II Shermans benefitted from superior radios that made coordinated tactics the norm.
Centurion just missed having an impact in WWII. Was still engaged in major armored combat into the 1980’s. Some combat engineers retained the modified vehicles until mid-2000’s.
I found this video to be very informative on the subject of the Sherman:
Myths of American Armor
Nick Moran (The Chieftain) is quite the authority on tanks. He is a Son of Ireland who served as a tank commander(I believe) in the U.S. Army during the first Gulf War. He knows his stuff.
I've watched several of his tank walk-around videos. They're always very informative and it's interesting to see the inside of these historic machines and hear commentary from someone who knows what he's talking about.
“Expending 2 or 3 Shermans to take out one Panther”
Actually this was not the US Army tank doctrine. The idea was that the Sherman would support infantry and as soon the German big cats showed up they would radio in the tank destroyers like the M10 and M18. So not sure Patton can be blamed for all of this.
Not really. The Germans also had some horrible flaws.
The Panzer IV’s later models were fitted with a large side plate. If you look at the plate it does not only protect the wheels but it’s higher and protect the hull too. This is because the side armor was really weak. The Russians started to use anti-tank rifles (!) to shoot though the side armor of the Panzer IV so they needed to upgrade the armor with the plates.
The Panzer VI Tiger was tons too heavy because the Germans wanted to side armor to be 82 mm. The industry could not produce long enough armor plates so the Tiger I was designed too width compared to the length of the tank so ground pressure was really high. So because of the armor plates they designed the hull like a box and this increased the weight tons. This would make it hard to cross bridges and they got stuck in the mud a lot.
The road wheels were overlapping (this is also on the Panther) and this is a nightmare for replacing parts or maintenance. If you need to replace a road wheel in the back row, you need to dissemble other wheels too. Also they would collect mud and ice that would freeze up and in the morning the tanks could no longer drive until all was cleared, which was a nightmare too because of the overlap.
Then the turret traverse of the Tiger was really slow. Originally the Tiger I would have a 75mm gun fitted. But Hitler wanted the 88mm in the Tiger so they make the turret bigger and heavier also making the turret ring bigger so it travers too slow.
Also because of it’s width, the Tigers could not be transported on trains without removing the tracks and putting transport tracks on it.
The Tiger II was created longer but the weight went from 57 to 69 tons but the engine and drivetrain remained the same so you can imagine what kinda strain these would endure. It also gazzeled gas like crazy and when a Tiger II broke down, you needed it to be towed by a combination of 3 large half tracks and since 50% of them would break down all the time, this was a huge problem. So sometimes they would tow a Tiger with another Tiger wrecking the other Tiger too. So this was forbidden but in the field it would be needed to be done that way else lose the stranded tank.
The Tigers were all engineered in a way that would not be able to use in mass-production which was pretty stupid to do in the middle of a war. But it also means you need a large magazine of spare parts for just one of you tanks that was not even produced in large numbers and high skilled engineers. If you could repair a tractor, you could repair a Sherman.
Tigers are also complicated to drive because of the steering wheel and semi-auto transmission.
The Tiger V Panther was rushed from the design table to the battle of Kursk in 1 year. They would break down almost all the time and the drivetrain problem was really never resolved. So same with the Tiger, after 100 hours of operations you needed to do some big replacements.
The Ferdinant was a Porsche made Tiger hull with a huge gun on it without a turret. But the Germans did not supply it with machine guns so they were vurnerable to infantry. The Germans resolved it with the construction of a curved barrel for the STG-44. These barrels would wear out really fast so yeah, that was quite stupid.
As for all German tanks, they are all petrol fueled and were prone to overheating because they relied a lot on air-cooling. Tigers had 2 different engines, the HL 230 and HL 210. They 230 was cast iron, the 210 aluminium and had less problems with overheating but had less HP. So either overheat more or have less power.
They also needed good, skilled drivers because of the drive trains else taking too much punishment and breaking down.
Thanks for the link, I watched the whole thing, well worthwhile.
One key take-away: the WWII death rate for US infantry in Europe was almost 20% overall, with some divisions suffering over 100% (with replacements).
Among armored forces, the death rate was 3% and half of those were armored troops caught outside their tanks -- I guess taking a cr*p could prove deadly!
Moran makes several other important points which try to rehabilitate the Sherman's reputation and that of senior US commanders who oversaw the European campaign.
I’ve read that too. I’m pretty sure it’s true.
Also by late in the war the German army’s level of competence worsened drastically because the training became completely inadequate. They never really stood a chance in any protracted war.
That is an eye opener given the historical memes.
Personally, in the opening where the presenter stated that often told "truths" are rarely true just because they are repeated so often, is a lesson learned for me and unfortunately occasionally re-learned.
"Nobody said nothing about locking horns with no Tigers"
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