Posted on 02/15/2025 10:03:27 PM PST by grundle
Tired of Taxes: Both sides view themselves as victims - one of the 'patriarchy,' the other of a 'gynocentric culture.' Radical feminists believe men hold all the power, and the manosphere men believe women hold all the power. Radical feminists are women who hate men, and manosphere men are men who hate women. And, just like most men want nothing to do with women who hate men (radical feminists), most women want nothing to do with men who hate women (the manosphere).
First of all: I have already explained that the manosphere is a mixed bag, and contains some unsavory elements - which I soundly reject.
1. The "niche" podcasters in the manosphere who openly hate women or encourage hate are certainly a small minority.
2. The "Pick-Up Artists" whose goal is only to seduce women represent another, somewhat larger minority. (I can't know exactly the proportions since I obviously don't actively seek out such women-haters and cads.)
Your repeated assertions that the manosphere is no better (or the "mirror image") of radical feminism imply that you have undertaken an objective study, and can cite objective statistics.
But that isn't the case, is it?
I repeat that just because both spheres may have some similar but opposing views you are unfair to equate them. (Both Churchill and Hitler bombed each other's cities, called for the utter destruction of their opponents, drank tea - but they are most definitely not therefore "two sides of the same medallion!)
I, for my part, have explicitly identified several manosphere podcasters whom I appreciate to varying degrees and, for all their foibles, who have something of value to offer (see my post #227 above).
I therefore challenge you to do the same, to corroborate your negative view of the manosphere! List several sites that do nothing but foster hatred towards the female sex! And place them in quantitative relation to the far greater number of sites promulgating useful knowledge and practical advice!
(Although I have already conceded that "bad actors" exist - but that I reject them, and that I can't be held to account for their unhealthy attitudes.)
But, I checked one of his videos where he was insulting people. Not my cup of tea.
You have to watch at least a dozen of them. If you're lucky, you might find some where Mr. Samuels actually slaps some sense into these delusional women, and/or where he consoles them and/or where they thank him for his efforts!
(Don't accidentally waste your time watching "comment videos" where other people bloviate on snippets of Kevin's sessions.)
TikTok is not real life.
Young men and women today are spending more time online than in real-life social interactions (not counting work-hours - though I'm not sure that they aren't actually watching/making TikTok even while on the job!)
After a certain point, PERCEPTION IS REALITY.
Today, YouTube and TikTok and the like have a far bigger impact upon shaping culture generally and the worldviews of young people specifically than Bible Study Classes or listening to family stories and sage wisdom at one's father's knee.
(But again, I exhort and implore you to view at least a dozen of Kevin's YouTube clips. It's really a hoot how he systematically disabuses young Black women of their skewed values, selfish attitudes, and warped perceptions!)
Regards,
The value and truth-content of what people say lies in what they say - not who they are.
Anything else is an example of the "Genetic Fallacy."
I'm not asking you to marry Mr. Samuels - I'm asking you to assess the truth-content of his utterances.
Regards,
China is in a race against time at trying to meet the level of development where a decline in population is manageable. Hopefully they lose.
“Maybe she dates single fathers.”
Single fathers have crazy scheduling issues—just like she does.
They have been burned in previous relationships—just like she has. That carries scars—and she might be on the punching end of some of those.
Other than that—she should go for it.
Lol.
—
I stick to my original view—she should be wearing a football helmet on dates.
“Young men should get offline, go out in the real world, and open their eyes. Real life is not what they see online.”
You deeply misunderstand the manosphere.
The whole purpose is training young men for real life.
It uses the feedback approach.
Try this in the real world. See if it works. Tell us what happened (good or bad). Let us learn from you.
Rinse and repeat.
That is much of the discussion and debate.
“This did not work. What did I do wrong? What could I have done better?”
Then the young man tries again and reports those results.
More feedback and learning....
More real world...
etc etc etc.
China (PRC) has what seems like an endless labor supply and even with a manufacturing base 6.5 TIMES that of Germany, 2 TIMES that of the US, they are still not even at capacity: https://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/20858.jpeg
China (PRC) doesn't have our population issue and it's “over population” they were concerned with.
We actually have to import labor in western nations because of the abysmal birthrates and to keep the tax base afloat.
In Germany you have Gastarbeiter years past and liberal immigration policies with 1.2 million Syrians getting brought in, 3 million Turks, Yugoslav, etc. before that. In the US H1B visa and illegals which we in reality depend on and tolerate all while we slander and scapegoat them... But it's all the same crap.
Exactly! As Rollo Tomasi never tires of emphasizing: It's not a movement; it's a praxeology.
Regards,
The 'manosphere' gives terrible advice to men and women, based on what I have read and heard, including right here on this forum.
If I had daughters, I would warn them to avoid the men whose worldview is the manosphere.
Maybe I’m misunderstanding your post. You’re not suggesting single fathers are prone to violence, are you?
One of the rules of the manosphere is young men are instructed never to discuss it with women.
Now you know why.
Lol.
Single fathers are subjected to great stress.
That is all I am saying.
“Single fathers are subjected to great stress.”
We don’t have kids, but I have to say that I can’t imagine trying to raise even one child going it alone, mother or father. It’s got to be the hardest job in the world.
Based on your descriptions alone of those podcasters, I wouldn't waste my time. Unless they are telling young men and women to respect themselves and each other, they have nothing to offer but bad advice.
>"Young men and women today are spending more time online than in real-life social interactions"<
There's the real problem. Proximity is a big factor in a person's dating life.
It's mostly a matter of numbers and proximity. High school sweethearts meet in school. Other young people meet in their neighborhood or social groups. Then, in their late teens and early 20s, more young men and women begin to pair off as they meet in college or through friends. Some people meet at their church. Then, people meet at work (not always a good idea). As the years pass, fewer and fewer people remain single.
I would advise all young men and women to stop obsessing over their love lives (or lack thereof). Get out and get involved. Oh, and stop worrying about being 'friend-zoned.' Many young couples start out as friends.
1. You have to be a little bit more open-minded about this. I say this as a FRiend!
2. Your statement implies that the situation is such that a 15-minute session of "hard love," with strict instructions to "straighten out and fly right" would suffice.
In actual fact, the situation is much more dire!
These self-entitled Black women who called into Kevin's show (erroneously believing it was some kind of "dating service" or "matchmaking show" where all they had to do was recite their "Wish List" / enumerate their demands and flash a little cleavage before leaning back while their "DMs" exploded with proposals from hundreds of high-value Black men) had to be first led down the garden path, then be exposed as hypocrites, humbled, and then admonished.
These women are like hardened S.S. officers in their warped worldview.
You know how you or I, as teens in the 1970s, would watch those saccharine PBS Public Service Announcements exhorting inner-city children to "believe in themselves?" That we were "the most-important people in the world" and could "do anything we could dream of?" You remember how, even at such a tender age, we could only shake our heads at the naive (and dangerous!) leftist worldview being espoused there? Because we knew that, in actual fact, it was necessary to put one's nose to the grindstone and exercise self-discipline, to advance in the world? And that, even then, success was far from guaranteed?
These woman swallowed that nonsense hook, line, and sinker!
A gentle "I would recommend that you drop your B.M.I. from 35 at least to 25, and then ask your mother to accept guardianship for the four illegitimate children you have from three baby-daddies, before re-entering the dating market" would have had no impact.
You apparently have had no experience with insolent, aggressive, angry, delusional, low-I.Q. (There! I said it!) Black women. I, myself, at first found it incredible how self-entitled they can be. And they called in to Kevin's show in droves.
It's mostly a matter of numbers and proximity. High school sweethearts meet in school. Other young people meet in their neighborhood or social groups. Then, in their late teens and early 20s, more young men and women begin to pair off as they meet in college or through friends. Some people meet at their church. Then, people meet at work (not always a good idea). As the years pass, fewer and fewer people remain single.
You are re-arranging the deckchairs on the "Titanic!" You are telling those hardened S.S. officers that they should just "try to make friends with the Jewish concentration camp inmates you're guarding - then you'd discover how they really aren't all that different from you!" You are handing out "Midol" to villagers in the midst of an outbreak of pneumonic plague!
The anodynes you are offering do not do justice to the severity of the vast, societal problem we are facing!
Regards,
A somewhat idealized, but essentially fair portrayal of dating life as it was in the 1950s.
But unless you have one of these...
...you might as well forget it.
You're SNL's "Church Lady," advising Madonna to "tone it down a little, maybe try attending a few church picnics."
(No offense intended!)
Any advice we dispense must recognize the reality in which young people today are living.
Regards,
approximately 69% of divorces are initiated by women.
“I would advise all young men and women to stop obsessing over their love lives (or lack thereof). Get out and get involved. Oh, and stop worrying about being ‘friend-zoned.’ Many young couples start out as friends”
First marriages last 8-9 years on average, second marriages 7-10 years, and third marriages 5-8 years. https://divorce.com/blog/divorce-statistics/
Either you live in an alternate universe, or the ‘manosphere’ has warped your worldview.
Right here, right now, in the 2020s, among the many families my kids and I knew, many young people have married in their early to mid-20s. Some of them were high school sweethearts. Others met in college. A few met after college. Most of them are raising their own children now. None of the young men had lots of money. The same is true in my extended family where young couples have been marrying in their 20s and early 30s, and they are very happy together.
Of course, other young people have not married... yet. But many 20-somethings are dating. Some couples are living together, and some people choose not to settle down. Other young people do not date at all.
But, if a young man wants to meet someone, the logical solution would be to stop spending life in front of a computer. Get out and get involved. But, first, he should ask himself if he truly likes women because the men in the manosphere sure don’t.
As I said earlier, I checked some of Mr. Samuels’s videos. Some of the women said they earned six-figure incomes, and some of them were attractive. But he made money by insulting people. He used that schtick to get a lot of hits on his videos. He wasn’t doling out sage advice. He was making money by saying what the manosphere wanted to hear.
The usual routine was that the women would begin by denying that they are "golddiggers." They would swear that they were willing to "settle" for a man on their level. Then Kevin would quiz them as to the sort of life they wanted. Inevitably: a husband hardly older than themselves, 3 (more) kids, international travel, stay-at-home mom - in, e.g., Atlanta. Kevin would then "do the math" and show that, in actuality, that wouldn't be possible without a high-earning man. He would point out that only 5% of men earned that kind of money, and that they were generally in their mid-40s or older. He would then confront the women with the following question: Why would a high-earner prefer her to the ten-year-younger, childless version of herself which he undoubtedly could find and attract on the open market.
He would explain that they didn't actually want the man, but rather only the lifestyle.
Mr. Samuels was devastating!
There's another manosphere site I forgot to mention in my earlier post: Insolent Insults. Very entertaining!
Right here, right now, in the 2020s, among the many families my kids and I knew, many young people have married in their early to mid-20s. Some of them were high school sweethearts. Others met in college. A few met after college. Most of them are raising their own children now. None of the young men had lots of money. The same is true in my extended family where young couples have been marrying in their 20s and early 30s, and they are very happy together.
I won't dispute your anecdotal evidence. Might still apply in rural parts of "fly-over country." But in large metropolitan areas? Doubtful.
Regards,
Hey! That means that my one marriage has already lasted longer (27th anniversary this Aug.) than the combined first three marriages of those people!
Regards,
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